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[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

   Yes they do and I have and will, but I was going to send it to him anyway so I figured I would see what it could use. I am probably over pessimistic about it really.

[hemmingjay]

Hi all, I have been busy with work and answering some very interesting messages from B12 folks. I am starting to get some talented folks inquiring. To answer some of the common questions:

What am I looking to do? I am trying to incubate talent and ideally put together a great dev team. If I could put together a smaller, more organized version of Chuckelfish I would consider my life complete. One of the problems that happens in game development is that they try to make a specific game and then try to find people who can pull it off. In reality it's a terrible method. Every team has it's own unique DNA that allows, or predetermines what they can make. A talented group should make the game that they can make best, not the game that someone wants them to make. After a couple of iterations a specialty tends to develop and that's how genre defining games are created.

Am I paying? Yes, on a full fledged development project I would arrange for salaries or contract fees to be paid. The first project or two would be small in scope, developed in free time and released as free and/or open source. This is simply team building and reputation building. Once a major project is decided upon and everything moves forward, then everyone should expect to be paid. The option to receive a straight salary/contract as opposed to a small stipend and profit sharing is a decision that everyone can make when the time comes.

Raising money, how? I have some money, but I consider that an emergency reserve. You don't get or stay wealthy by playing with your own money. I have a good deal of success consulting on Kickstarters as well as traditional financing. I have an interested party who understands the inherent risks of development and is willing to invest for the right project. If we chose that partner, it would unfortunately be a straight salary deal with no profit sharing beyond some indexed performance bonuses.

Why am I doing this? It's not for the money, that's for sure. My day job is much more profitable and affords me a great deal of security. Producing and/or managing a project like this is a passion of mine. I like the idea of finding talent and changing the way the industry works whenever possible. Of course, the idea of selling a million copies is an attractive dream  Just not a likely one. I am compelled to help others and make something for everyone to enjoy.

What am I like to work with? I am not in charge. I work with everyone, not above them. People listen to me because they trust in the thoughts that I express. They know that if they disagree they can tell me so anytime as long as; 1) They can prove it  2) They have a solution and not just a reason why something won't work.
I can work with anyone but a dictator. I have had the misfortune of working with several different programmers who are completely inflexible in their ideas. They assume that their ideas are the best and this is due to the fact that they have tunnel vision. Everyone should work on the things that they are expert at and trust other tasks to those more suited.

The worst thing about working with me? Everyone has my ear. I get calls, emails and visitors for 18 hours a day from people looking for advice or help. Sometimes it's professional paid consulting, sometimes it's personal advice and very often it's pro bono consulting. I don't believe in making more money than I deserve which means I do a lot of free work for people who are just starting out.


I'm all about goodwill, positivity, work/life balance and fairness. If you can't handle that please don't write to me. Of course all of that goes out the window when it comes to marketing, PR, community management and reputation management. I am ruthless in that regard.

[hemmingjay]

You know, I like you hemmingjay, but I guess I have to be the one to say it.

Let's suppose for a second that I'm an up-and-coming game content developer, no connections or professional accomplishments, but a lot of moxie and some demonstrable ability.  I have tons of game ideas that I'd love to make, because as many people as there are who have no ability to produce game content but have tons of big ideas, there is not a single person with any definable skill who does not already have a dream game they want to make.

I could make my own idea for probably-no-profit and some small amount of personal recognition.

Or I could make your idea for probably-no-profit and whatever recognition I can soak up from a game with someone else's name on it.

I'm being crass here, but I hope you already know the point is serious.  If you have an idea for a game (like any other creative thing) you either have to be able to make enough of it to convince other people that you're going places and helping would be a good idea, or you have to be able to put up enough incentive to make it worthwhile for a motivated single developer to put their own dreams on hold for yours.  And if you all you can offer is no more than a single developer could do for themselves with a single-person-quality game and Steam Greenlight, there's really not much incentive.

I get that you're basically talent scouting here, but without a tangible goal and any real definition of compensation, it comes across as those "I'll put in a good word if you work for free" posts they're trying to ban from Craigslist.

Sorry I missed this earlier! You missed the point that I am NOT making the game that I want to make, nor am I having people make a game in my name. The whole point is to organize a team effort, but your post definitely highlights the problem facing the programming industry and in particular, the games industry. Programmers tend can sometimes be egotistical princesses. Not all of them or even the majority, but too many think that they are more talented than they are and they also are incapable of admitting that they are not experts in business, marketing, project management, training, record keeping, relationship nurturing, deal brokering and all of the other elements that are required for true business success. Programmers are great, but they aren't the rockstars they think of themselves as. Honestly, the real genius tends to shine with the rare, qualified game designer.

I totally understand your post was merely designed to play "devil's advocate" and I thank you for bringing up an important issue. Once again, I am not looking for loners. I am looking for people who like to have fun as part of a talented team. I want the Beatles, not John Lennon.

[Shook]

Now, i'm probably not the kind of guy you're looking for (given that i'm already working on my own project, and also don't really qualify for a programmer), but i am curious; what qualifies for a game designer, and what does it involve? I like to think that i'm reasonably good at designing things that aren't website layouts, but that is obviously up for debate.

[Solifuge]

Game Designer

Thank you, Wikipedia, for being there to beam information directly into curious people's brains. If only we remembered you existed.

[cerapa]

Game Designer

Thank you, Wikipedia, for being there to beam information directly into curious people's brains. If only we remembered you existed.

Wikipedia gives a very dry, but technically description of things. "A game designer is a person who designs gameplay, conceiving and designing the rules and structure of a game." Tells you little more than the name itself, and isn't actually a description of what the job is like.

[miauw62]

So, when are you going to steal that one Chucklefish dev, Hemmingjay?

[Solifuge]

Game Designer
-snip-

Wikipedia gives a very dry, but technically description of things.
-snoop-

Well, you also need the patience to get through the first few paragraphs.

It encompasses creating game mechanics, designing levels and puzzles, writing settings and characters, user interfaces, and setting the general theme, style, systems, and flow of the game. It's similar to the role played by a Director in a film project, though different aspects are often performed by multiple specialists.

[Jopax]

And if you want a fun and good way to learn more about certain things.

Anyways, this is both a PTW and a goog going HJ, this will be very interesting to follow as it develops. Also if there's ever need for any of my limited skills I'd be more than happy to help

[adwarf]

PTW and wish you good luck hemmingjay.

[sjm9876]

Yet another PTW and GL here.

[wierd]

I am pretty good at creating the conceptual models of imaginary worlds (the mythopia), and at creating solid 3d models of inorganic objects. (Tables, chairs, vehicles, etc.) I also make pixel art. (I made my avatar in mspaint.)  I am not a professional software developer, but can read source code and tell you what it is doing, and can easily pass the fizzbuzz test. I don't want to be a programmer. It gives me ulcers. Just that for me, computers are logical machines and not magic boxes. I am somewhat good at troubleshooting and beta-testing, and know how to file a proper bug report. I am not a texture artist, and would need to work with someone who is if I did 3d solids for a project. It takes a lot of time, but I can do sprite work on my own. I work best with an itinerary of items to make, and some concept data.

I am currently occupationally involved creating maufacturing programs for cnc machines, as well as creating industrial blueprints. I have many years of experience working with NURBS based solid objects and creating industrial blueprints.

I am leery of joining a team, as such endeavors usually consist of starry eyed kids of one sort or another, without a clear and consistent itinerary or goal structure. I work best with small, achievable, and well defined goals, with sensible deadlines. I am discouraged by poorly defined, and nebulous goals or objectives, and completely put off by indecisive leadership.  Most community created projects are not well conceived when a team is formed, leading to considerable amounts of wasted effort, false starts, and overall developer hell.

Before even contemplating joining a team, I would need assurances that this was not the case.

I don't consider myself a rockstar. I currently make things for personal pleasure only. I don't mind making things for others, but prefer to make things that are wanted or useful, with emphasis on specific items. Eg, if you ask me for a multi-solid NURBS assembly of an AK-47 with a tactical night vision scope, I will ask you for a specific make/model for the scope, and ask that you specify what kind of stock. I would then make you as faithful a model of that firearm as I am capable of. (Even if that means getting out calipers.)

I would look at you crossly if you told me to "go make me some cool guns or something.", however. "Guns" is a very large set of objects, and "cool looking" is subjective. Unlike many artists, I try to make objects that are at least theoretically functional. I am occupationally involved in engineering, and it shows. Eg, if I were to attempt to design a laser pistol, I probably wouldn't make a buck rodger's special. I'd look up what kind of energy emittance would be needed to make an effective laser pistol, calculate the thermal entropy it would generate, and begin design from there, selecting materials and subsystem designs to match the intended goal. Flashy startrek props are not my thing. Systems that could theoretically be built are. It's why I insist on specific items, and not nebulous concepts. (I take the same painstaking care when developing world mythos as well. I don't leave dangling plot pieces if I can avoid it. This means many days of doing nothing else but thinking about the story I have been presented with, asking "why", until all the answers are known. Even if the game never encompasses 3/4 of that information, I still use it to shape the worlds I create, because it is necessary to keep it self consistent and as free from retcons as possible.)

This is what really put me off from doing work for OpenGameArt.org. programmers had an idea for what they wanted the game to do mechanically (it's an FPS! Or, "it's a turn based strategy game!), but often hadn't even the slightest clue about art assets they wanted (ok, it's a shooter-- what's the setting? What kinds of assets do you want? What's the game's mood?), story requirements for their game's plot (who/what are we shooting and why?), or even what kind of person their protagonist was (is he heroic? Is he a douche? A madman? who and what is he? Is he a she?? Etc.), even if asked. I simply can't work under those conditions, since I can't read minds. I'd make assets for you all day long, if I knew what you wanted, and when you wanted it by, but it has to be specific.

I apologize for sounding like a total dillweed, but I have worked with such "teams" making mods before, where the "project lead" was basically incompetent, and I would need assurances that this wouldn't be the case before really earnestly trying to join any such team. Moving the goalpost mid project is not something I am willing to deal with ever again.

[mainiac]

My experience with projects on the internet is that you basically need one guy who would be willing to do almost all the work himself and anyone else is just supplementing that.  You can end up with so many people that your leader ends up doing only a small fraction in the end, but he is the germ of the project, without which you have nothing.  I somewhat doubt this project could amount to anything because we don't have that guy.

That being said, if this ever was to amount to something, I imagine I could be rather helpful as a game designer.  I like to think about the mechanics of strategy games down to the smallest detail.  I'm actually working on a hex-based game in python at the moment and would be willing to turn it into a team based project because programming comes slowly to me.  But then we are just at the position of people saying "why should I do mainiacs idea when I can do my own?"

[mishka]

The original post is so vague. He says he's going to be involved... but he doesn't say what the game is going to be about or what the programming language would be. I mean, he just wants to gather a group of people, who may or may not be interested in the same things, and who may or may not know how to program in the same language??

It's like. Tower of Babel Squared.

[Skyrunner]

You could always learn a new language.