Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 ... 20 21 [22] 23 24 ... 44

Author Topic: Beginner's Mafia XLIII: Robot Mafia - GAME OVER - TOWN WIN!  (Read 136076 times)

Imp

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Oh Tiruin.  To me you're still my mentor here, you're still the person in this thread I feel the most comfort and rightness in buddying.  For this you pass forever, even if you also for other reasons fail.

Hey Squill!

Going to encourage you to talk about a few more things, hope you'll be willing to.

Would you discuss your evaluation, in terms of Town/Scum/null tell, for the play so far of Mr.Zero?  Would you do the same for Deathsword?
Logged
For every trouble under the sun, there is an answer, or there is none.
If there is one, then seek until you find it.
If there is none, then never ever mind it.

Superblackcat

  • Bay Watcher
  • Giving Gifts of Bad Luck
    • View Profile

Pssst Can we get a prod for everyone that is not me, Squill, Imp, DS, or MrZero ( ithink that's only Darvi left)
Logged

Rolepgeek

  • Bay Watcher
  • They see me rollin' they savin'~
    • View Profile

Ugh...I keep putting this off, and putting this off, and putting this off. Frustrated with myself. Because I want to play the game. I really do. But let's begin as usual by answering questions.

@RPG why is killing persus confusing?
I don't know if it is. Indeed, I never said if it was or not. It was Mr. Zero who said it was confusing. So, I would advise you to ask him.

If you want my opinion, however, I don't think it's particularly confusing, though it sheds very little light on the situation, since none of the people being accused were night-killed, and he was voting Kleril, I believe. Just scum waiting it out, I suppose.

Oh, hi there, Rolepgeek.  So...

That's an extremely poor idea. Until I'm replaced, I am going to continue to play to the best of my ability.

Is how you have been playing 'to the best of your ability'?
Yes. It has been. The best of my ability has been pretty poor, I'll admit, but Mafia, with it's myriad quotes and intricacies, is a bit more difficult than describing how I'm going to bash someone's skull in with a hammer.

No...no, no, shit, I can't do it. I can't get the time and I'm getting too emotional to play. Well, that, and I can't get into the right mindset. I can't look deeply into posts, all I can do is stare at them. It's frustrating. I'm gonna have to ask for a replacement, sorry guys. Should have done this a while ago. I'll still answer questions and such, I just...I can't work up the motivation. Sorry.

This is the best of your ability?  Your end of D1 post, more evidence of the best of your ability?

I don't have school tomorrow. HOWEVER, turns out I don't have extra time to do stuff, because I still have to get up at the same time.

Sorry. >.> Not planned.
Yep. This is why I'm asking for a replacement. I thought I would have more time(and motivation) than I turned out to, during the school year.

You keep telling us stuff like this -

Alright. I dislike having to do this again, but I can't do anything today, really, because I've been dealing with a lot of drama. Tomorrow I hope to be able to do a nice large post with the various things I want to say on it.

And internet will shut off soon, so I need to cut this post short, though there may be a follow up.

Alright, well, as a stopgap measure I'm gonna try to answer questions at the least on my IPad.

Gah. Sorry. I have like two minutes to do this. I got a girlfriend. >.> I really wish I could respond, but when I say two minutes, I mean my internet will shut down in two minutes, and I'd rather not give hasty answers, and I'd rather not not post. I'll vote for an extend, too.

Now, this is your weekend too.  You've essentially told us you have drama issues, time issues, distraction in the form of new girlfriend issues - heck, you probably have other issues you're not bothering to mention, I know I do.  Relaxing and doing what you please is a big part of handling stress.

I figured, as I'm answering everyone else, lets make sure I didn't miss anything from you, so I checked your recent posts to be sure.

Dang!  32 posts elsewhere since you last posted here.  One of them impressive things has over 1000 words in it.  Are you surely sure you mean what you say when you say stuff like "Tomorrow I hope to be able to do a nice large post with the various things I want to say on it."[/spoiler]

I know what you've been showing all game.  And you still find time to play elsewhere, post dozens of posts in other DF threads in the last couple of days... Oh you have focus and you have self control, you just -won't- use it for this game now.  Maybe cause you're Scum.  For sure Scum can just skate through this game, and that's the kind of crud you're doing.  You're acting like Scum.  You have pages of posts to somehow manage to read, you have this entire game that you signed up for to play.  Do it.  Right now it seems pointless to question you - you're claiming you can't even read the thread.  Play, or die here.  You've got total control over your own behavior.
Oh, I've read most of it. That's not the problem. The problem is that last game, I could get into it. I could settle down, read the thread a few times(to be honest Imp, part of the problem is the sheer volume of posts, and the sheer number of them. In one day. One.), and really suspect people of this or that. That may be because I was involved in fewer other games, and had more time to spare. But currently? Instead of it being fun to suspect everyone and pressure them as much as I could, it feels more like a chore. An obligation that I have to fulfill, but can't get up the nerve to do it; after all, why do this when I could go look at my other games?
But no. It's not pointless to question me. It would only be pointless to question me if I was confirmed town or scum. As it is, I have a question for you. How would you be able to know for sure who would die? You said something similar to Deathsword, but you can't lynch two people, let alone know who would die. Unless, of course, you knew who would be night-killed. But that would make you scum, wouldn't it?

Deathsword.  I'm seriously disappointed in you now, in you as a player and in you as an 'example of how to play', which is what I believed an IC would act as.

You're acting like you have this 'right to lurk', and you absolutely don't.

Just look at your posts on lurker - This whole game you've only made 11.  I double checked them all;  two of the 11 have been only use of IC voice, and including those, 5 of them have had nothing I can recognize in any fashion as scumhunting.  I'm being really generous in this assessment.  Anything resembling a question, anything resembling analysis; anything more than answering questions, apologies, or IC voice I'm calling 'scumhunting' - it doesn't seem to be a joke, and even if it is, I'm calling it garbage.  Your activity and effort in this game, at least inside this thread, has been poor and steadily getting worse.  I'm calling you on it.
So. As you've shown us, Deathsword is even less active than me. So why are you voting me, and not him? You obviously think he's worthless as an IC. So what's your reason in going after me in particular? Is it because I 'personally attacked you'? You know, where I criticized your playstyle?

Almost like you're doing here. Huh. Weird.

Now, last BM, you were Scum IC.  Presuming you -are- both Deathsword and Scumsword, in private chat those lucky scums got the benefit of 36 of your posts in just 39 days.  And here's what one of them says:

Quote
DO NOT, this is important, DO NOT speculate on night events. Focus on day and the day only. If someone starts speculating on the night, call them out on WIFOM. If they freak out, put pressure on them, ask why they got nervous. If not, just scumhunt as usual. 

Why, and for that matter, how dare you coddle your Scum that game with protective and helpful advice, and give us filth, with your IC voice, no less?  In the ongoing Witches Coven, the lack of a N1 kill got brief discussion.  The two N2 kills got discussion.  It's not the only thing being discussed by any means, but it's certainly not a taboo topic.

Night kills, even N1 kills, get some attention in Supernatural 1, 2 and 5.  Supernatural 3 and 4 discusses the lack of night kills (and 4 talks more about the ressurection of the D1 lynch).  Point being, players that look more experienced than us talk about night kills, or the lack of them, if they see reason to.  And -Scumsword-... aka Deathsword, are you not?... saw fit to explicitly and strongly warn his Scum off of talking about their night kill, "DO NOT, this is important, DO NOT" and instructed them to attack and stop anyone who speculated about it.  Why?  Because this is very dangerous for the Scum, who are the only players in the game who don't have to guess why and what the thought processes are?  And you dare try to use your IC voice to take away our belief in our freedom to talk about it like the more experienced players do should we choose?
So, to summarize. 'Other mafia games talk about it, so why shouldn't we talk about it'? Along with a hearty helping of 'You aren't giving the advice I want you to, therefore you're abusing the IC voice'.

Actually, wait a second. This doesn't have anything to do with anything. You're basically criticizing him for doing a good job in a different game. What? Do you think people always have the same amount of time available? Or are you just upset about the reasoning in that advice?

Two BMs ago, you were IC and scum, and you lurked there too.  Got sick there too.

I'm currently very sick, I'll get another post with non-IC content tonight.

I'm really sorry your health's so bad you've gotten seriously sick twice in the same year.  Even without being sick people called for prods on you and complained about your inactivity.
So...you think he's lying? Is that what it is? Why? Because you think it's unlikely, based on your highly in-detail knowledge of Deathsword's RL health?

{I won't be able to get that post out after all.}

Even there, as Scum, you're making excuses in your IC voice.  I didn't distrust your IC voice, but I do now, as I do everything else about you.  From what I see, your play is tainted.  You're treating the game itself with disrespect and disregard.  I know all about being busy - I work 40 hours a week and am going to school almost full time.  I work in a lab now and didn't get home until after 10 PM because we have an inspection tomorrow.  Life's tough for everyone, yet you play game after game with garbage... oh, but you find or make time for your Scum when you were Scum IC.  Shame on you, giving -this game- so little.  Do better or die in this game, Deathsword.
Hey, look, 'personal attacks' and ultimatums without the ability to back them up! You're even claiming he's abusing the IC voice! Nicely done, Imp. New levels of hypocrisy. Which segues nicely into the next quote.

Now lets talk about votes, since you disapprove so much of how I currently use mine.

Imp: If you got nothing better to do with your vote, as you claim here:
Rolepgeek, I've got this vote and no better use for it right now.  If you're dead there's no need to replace your spot; and from close to start of play you've not really done much that seems pro-Town to me.  Your behavior isn't that bad of a Scum cover either.  I'm far from sure you're Scum but I'm far from sure you're Town either, so for the moment this works for me.  As long as you're seeking replacement I'm not going to ask you anything.
Then why not use it to pressure someone who can actually answer you? It seems as if you want to vote someone but don't really care who, and Rolepgeek provides a nice, safe target.

The only way you can make that claim about how I use my vote, and how I use pressure, is to disregard how I have played this game so far.  Considering how -you- have played this game so far, I'm not surprised at you at all.

I -am- using it on someone who -can- actually answer me.  But how are you using yours? You're not really scumhunting with your vote on me, because you're not really working or thinking, you're either just randomly pushing - taking the easy out that you accuse me of - or you're actively trying to control how I use my vote.  Shame on you for either, you IC jerk.   My vote is -mine-.  The pressure I place is -mine- to use as I see fit, be that pressure with words gentle, harsh, or supported at the time or later with a vote.  Get into this game and play, be the role model and player in this game that you are supposed to be, or die here for your failings.
Well, if you don't question me, I can't answer you. So...there's that, first off. And while I would disagree about why you've voted me, (unlike Deathsword, I think it's because you have a personal vendetta against me on the grounds of me calling you on your bullshit, even a little) he has a point. If I can't be bothered to read the thread like you say, there is no point in voting me.

Next part of it. I don't see how it's taking an easy out. It gets worse when, as Deathsword noted as well, you look at your reasoning for voting me, and then your claimed reasoning for why his vote is bad. 'No better use for it' vs. 'randomly pushing'. They seem very similar to me. As for controlling how you vote...it's pretty hypocritical for you to say that, since you're trying to control how other people post and play in this game, period(as far as I can tell, with the saying 'Get into this game and play...or die for your failings'. The middle of it is left out, and can be seen above. Context.

Finally, how would you kill him, exactly? Are you able to control the outcome of a lynch? Perhaps you can ensure he dies if he continues to annoy you with a NK? Interesting ideas, I would say.

Now lets talk about votes, since you disapprove so much of how I currently use mine.

Imp: If you got nothing better to do with your vote, as you claim here:
Rolepgeek, I've got this vote and no better use for it right now.  If you're dead there's no need to replace your spot; and from close to start of play you've not really done much that seems pro-Town to me.  Your behavior isn't that bad of a Scum cover either.  I'm far from sure you're Scum but I'm far from sure you're Town either, so for the moment this works for me.  As long as you're seeking replacement I'm not going to ask you anything.
Then why not use it to pressure someone who can actually answer you? It seems as if you want to vote someone but don't really care who, and Rolepgeek provides a nice, safe target.

The only way you can make that claim about how I use my vote, and how I use pressure, is to disregard how I have played this game so far.  Considering how -you- have played this game so far, I'm not surprised at you at all.

I -am- using it on someone who -can- actually answer me.  But how are you using yours? You're not really scumhunting with your vote on me, because you're not really working or thinking, you're either just randomly pushing - taking the easy out that you accuse me of - or you're actively trying to control how I use my vote.  Shame on you for either, you IC jerk.   My vote is -mine-.  The pressure I place is -mine- to use as I see fit, be that pressure with words gentle, harsh, or supported at the time or later with a vote.  Get into this game and play, be the role model and player in this game that you are supposed to be, or die here for your failings.
Rolepgeek asked to replace. When someone asks for that, it usually means they stop posting. You yourself said you voted him because you had nothing else to do with said vote. Now you talk about your previous play, but it is this very same previous play that makes your disregard as to where your vote goes more glaring. Is the vote yours to use as you see fit? Yes. It still does not exempt you from being called out on it.
As an addition, Imp, you never responded to this portion of his post.

Superblackcat:

What I think about the night kill - Reading old Scumchats, most recommend to go for players that you think will be a problem for you.  Either because they're after you, which can be revealing, or because their active and likely to be of use to Town later in play.  Persus was that, whether he was actually already on Scum or not, he was active, analyzing, seemed open minded, rational, interested, was talking to everyone and getting answers in many cases.  I was scared he was Scum for a reason I already explained, but man he seems to have been a good pick for nightkill.  I posted the most - but he talked to everyone the most.  I wish I could trade places with him - maybe he'd have been able to get this Town talking again and I don't see how Town can possibly win this without more people talking more.
I think if their purpose was to get rid of the active players, they would have killed you. It's more likely that the scum were trying to kill someone that would leave the most fingers pointing at each other; we were all at each other's throats for day one, after all. Still are, though the throats and the knives have been switched up.
Squill - can't tell, hasn't shown himself clearly enough.  He seems to hate to talk, is willing to offer silence, and is apparently willing to accept silence from everyone.  That doesn't seem Town to me.  He looks great in comparison to Luke, but that's not saying anything.  Almost active enough for me to have a feel for - but almost is not quite.  May want to catch Scum, but sure not trying to do anything to make this happen/happen more easily.
It seems like you're trying to avoid going one way or the other. Which seems scummy. After all, if people start trying to lynch him, you can get behind it without being (too much) of a hypocrite. But if he gets NKed, or lynched, and turns up town, you can still hide behind it, since you weren't the first person to suggest it, or the second, or the third, etc.
Rolepgeek - Hasn't really played since the first couple days of the game.  Complained about players to focused on semantics (Mr.Zero, me).  Launched non-Scumhunting personal attack on me.  He sure doesn't seem to care about catching Scum or not.
Yes, that's it. It was a personal attack. Totally. [/sarcasm] Leaving aside the part where you're doing the same thing.
Deathsword - Can't tell, way idle.  Almost no focus on teaching as IC or on scumhunting as player.  Probably a pattern for the player as a whole as meta.  Cited health and other real life issues limiting playability - but despite that, we need enough activity to judge him on - I haven't had that. He sure doesn't seem to care about catching Scum or not though.
He's probably more concerned with RL issues. Not that he's been doing the best job as an IC, but I'm not going to blame him for something like that.

Mr.Zero - I think he's Town.  Seems too tunneled on Cat to me, and to unconcerned about telling Scummy from Scum, but that's a pretty common human trait I'd guess.  I think he's trying to catch Scum, but that seems to be focused mostly on catching Scummy Cat.
So when Mr.Zero looks like he's tunneling someone else to you, it's okay. When you think someone else is doing it to you, it's not only scummy, but a personal attack. Alright, then.
Superblackcat - I've swung around to thinking Cat is Town.  Reason being Cat's talked a LOT, he's really shown several parts of how he reasons.  I can't tell for sure, but I think Cat just looks scummy and sometimes makes bad choices, but with Town intentions.  I'm by no means sure, but I think Cat has shown a pattern of play that I can follow and understand, and following it doesn't point to him as being Scum to me.  I don't think Cat could have played as he as if he is actually Scum.
Why not? He turned on kleril easily enough once he realized people thought there was something between them. Self-preservation isn't exactly a towny quality. It's a scum one.
I'm so depressed to be at this point of the game and to have this low level of activity.
This isn't low activity. From some players certainly, but there's as much or more activity than my previous game, I'd say. It's just that it's more heavily weighted towards a few players who are on constantly, vs. players who don't give themselves the time they should to play. Since you're one of the people posting, it seems low activity in comparison to your own posts.

So, questions for all:

Why so quiet?
Is anyone happy with the level of Scumhunting happening in this game?
If not, are you intending to do anything to help improve it?
If so, can you help me understand that things are going well, not terribly quiet, and why you think we're not going to a lurky town loss as is?
1. Because I have issues related to procrastination, and when there's no deadline...No, I don't consider Night a deadline, because we keep on extending it.
2. Yes. Unfortunately, I'll probably procrastinate on that too. But hey, I can always try...
3. I doubt we're going to lose. As long as we can get just one scum, our odds drastically improve, statistically and otherwise. More time to get the next one, info on who tried to help them, etc.

You just threw a vote on Rolepgeek because you could, because you had nothing better to do with it.

You may have read what I said about my impressions of the six of us playing that are not me.

For -four- of us I have no solid feel; I find the scum-hunting efforts of -four- of us to be highly unsatisfactory (though some within that set are worse than others) (and of the rest of us, I'd like more too, because I'm not sure we're cutting it - yeah that means me too because we are a team and we succeed or fail as a team; if there's a way, anyway to get this working that my actions can help make happen, I'm duty bound to do it if I can find it).

My vote could have been placed on any of the four with my conscience comfortable; I selected the scummiest and hardest for me to read as of that point.
Ah. Well, then. Why wasn't that said at the beginning, when you voted me? He said you threw it on me because you had nothing better to do with it at the time, because that's why you claimed you put it on me. This sounds like you're coming up with something after the fact, because you didn't have a good reason when you voted me.

While the added reasons are nice

Calling them 'added reasons' is bunk; or proof that you're not bothering to pay attention (they were also listed here, under all things Rolepgeek), or possibly that you arn't bothered to think up real reasons and are just grabbing what's recent and comfortable to deflect attention from the lacks in your play I have been increasingly pointing out.

At this point I could live with a lynch on any of these four: Rolepgeek, Deathsword, Darvi, Squill.  I'm not totally certain that my Town picks are Town, but they're sure a heck of a lot more Town-like than any of the rest of you, and they've both interacted enough for me to get a feel that allows me to think of them as Town.  Hint hint, if you're on my 'seems scummy list', that's a way to help confirm or deny your Townness - get more active.  Talk more, to me or anyone.  Show enough of yourself to be readable - and particularly show your scumhunting.

I am depressed to be near the end of day 2 and to have so little feel of so many players.  I want that fixed.  I don't know how to fix it myself.
But that's what they are. Added reasons. You stated your primary reason, and the rest are secondary. Order of operations, so to speak. Besides the semantics of the situation, where calling them added reasons doesn't matter one way or another anyway.
See, being okay with a lynch on over half the players we have now is not a particularly town move. It seems really scummy to me, when looked at from that perspective, in fact; 1 scum buddy, one 'oh he's not scum anymore' to leave for when the game is at it's end, and the rest you can mislynch.

You claim

Almost no focus on teaching as IC
Regarding this: as a whole, the remaining players here are doing pretty well, mechanics-wise. There is little at the moment that requires an IC explanation.

So you're saying that this game is going just fine.  Activity is fine, interaction is fine, ...  Wow.  I call so much BS from you and what you say.

Why, you even wait until NOW!! to throw out an IC comment about don't personal attack.  More than ten days after it happened!
No, that's not what he's saying. He's saying everyone understands the mechanics of the game and how to play. Which is true, even if not everyone is playing actively.

Second comment is non sequitur...

to be quite frank, I consider you to be, among the new players here, one of the most possibly dangerous if scum.

On a theory level, I'm flattered and I hope to be very dangerous when Scum; on an actual level you're failing in your logic here.
Reasons, here. You of all people should know you can't say that and not give specifics.

The most dangerous Scum are the people who actually are Scum, in this game right now.  Those two as yet unfound people.  It's fine to go for me, but we cannot afford for you to ignore everyone else, or for you to tolerate low levels of interaction and scumhunting - and you appear to be doing both.  I do not protest that you call me and my actions Scum - I protest because you're being lazy about it.  You're not working, you're not using anything but convenient easy recent things to support your attack; you look like you're just going through the motions, not that you care about anything other than deflecting attention from yourself.  You're scumhunting scummily.
No really? The scum who are actually scum are the dangerous ones? Now that the obvious has been stated, let's look at the rest. You can't ignore everyone else. But that's what extends are for. We pressure you until you crack, and then we pressure the others for a feel on who your buddy is until the end of the day when you get lynched. Or, if you really are town, we pressure you until you crack in a different way, and then we move on and look at your posts with a new light.

Whoever we lynch today, me or anyone, Town or Scum, that passes the edge from playtime to endtime.  Use today to prepare for Mylo.  Get AS MUCH information today as you can, because if today is a mislynch and tonight there's a kill, there's almost nothing left to work with.  Get active peeps.  Set yourselves up, work as a team so the Scum are also forced to work as a team or stand out - so that if we mislynch today we are in a great position for tomorrow.  Please, my partners.  Please get involved and active, so the Scum cannot stand beside you so easily.[/b]
I would say the same to you.

I'm curious Squill: Why didn't you extend?


It was in big bold letters: "Today will end on Oct 18 blah blah"
Because I'm a god damn moron and I somehow thought that the day ended on Tuesday.
Bull shit. The day ends on tuesday, now. If you had answered with something about not being here to see it, it might have made sense. But now it just looks like excuses made up after the fact.
Oh Tiruin.  To me you're still my mentor here, you're still the person in this thread I feel the most comfort and rightness in buddying.  For this you pass forever, even if you also for other reasons fail.

Hey Squill!

Going to encourage you to talk about a few more things, hope you'll be willing to.

Would you discuss your evaluation, in terms of Town/Scum/null tell, for the play so far of Mr.Zero?  Would you do the same for Deathsword?
What? While encouraging players to talk is great and all, especially when you don't insult them or their playstyle, why would you buddy Tiruin? Especially if you think I'm scum, and he'd be replacing me. This would seem suspicious if not for the fact that he isn't playing. >.>
Logged
Sincerely, Role P. Geek

Optimism is Painful.
Optimize anyway.

Imp

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Rolepgeek:  Welcome back again.

I'm going in order through your post, so I'll start here:

I don't know if it is. Indeed, I never said if it was or not. It was Mr. Zero who said it was confusing. So, I would advise you to ask him.

If you want my opinion, however, I don't think it's particularly confusing, though it sheds very little light on the situation, since none of the people being accused were night-killed, and he was voting Kleril, I believe. Just scum waiting it out, I suppose.
Please explain your thinking on why the Persus NK was smart?  I happen to think it was too, but I'd like to know your reasoning.  And explain how that night kill choice might have been chosen to shove suspicion on you?


Right now it seems pointless to question you - you're claiming you can't even read the thread.
Oh, I've read most of it. That's not the problem.

I understood you were not reading the thread (staring at it sometimes, yes, but NOT reading it) because you said so, and then gave no indication until your most recent post that this had changed.

Additionally you've said this in answer to others' questions:
I'll get back to you. I need to look through the posts, and badly. Harass me if I don't get back to this.
And then you asked for a replacement, though you said you'd still answer questions and such, then tried to do so in the same post, but you included  stuff like

I had said Mr. Zero because at the time I thought I'd spotted a post he'd made that had raised my hackles, but I can't find it now
...
And nnnnnnn...superblackcat. Holy crap, I just realized. The post he had right before mine was the one I thought was Mr Zero's. Probably. I can't really tell, and I thought it had been on page 15.
...
continued tomorrow

And of course, it wasn't continued 'tomorrow', or even the day after.  So I really didn't think you were up to following the thread, playing here, or answering questions.  In fact, you still haven't really 'continued that'.  Since you now say that's changed, sure, I'll ask some more.  I do have plenty for you.


As it is, I have a question for you. How would you be able to know for sure who would die? You said something similar to Deathsword, but you can't lynch two people, let alone know who would die. Unless, of course, you knew who would be night-killed. But that would make you scum, wouldn't it?

I've been reading other Mafia games.  Variants of that phrase have been said to people in many games, more or less directly phrased, said usually to one player but sometimes to more than one.  Typically though not always used on lurkers.
As of my post you refer to, it's how I chose to speak to each of you, for the reasons I explained.  Are either or both of you actually going to die in play?  We'll see.  These are ultimatums, not direct and pure threats.  After all, stuff like this happens too:

requesting him to speak or die. He spoke. Your reply?

Either or both of you may take actions that satisfy the ultimatum without dying in game.  I'm fine with that.


Deathsword.  I'm seriously disappointed in you now, in you as a player and in you as an 'example of how to play', which is what I believed an IC would act as.

You're acting like you have this 'right to lurk', and you absolutely don't.

Just look at your posts on lurker - This whole game you've only made 11.  I double checked them all;  two of the 11 have been only use of IC voice, and including those, 5 of them have had nothing I can recognize in any fashion as scumhunting.  I'm being really generous in this assessment.  Anything resembling a question, anything resembling analysis; anything more than answering questions, apologies, or IC voice I'm calling 'scumhunting' - it doesn't seem to be a joke, and even if it is, I'm calling it garbage.  Your activity and effort in this game, at least inside this thread, has been poor and steadily getting worse.  I'm calling you on it.
So. As you've shown us, Deathsword is even less active than me. So why are you voting me, and not him? You obviously think he's worthless as an IC. So what's your reason in going after me in particular? Is it because I 'personally attacked you'? You know, where I criticized your playstyle?

Almost like you're doing here. Huh. Weird.

Well now, look at the size of that deflection (adds more Scummy points to Rolepgeek's total).  None the less, I'll answer some of these questions.

First off - read what I wrote again.  Where do I say or show that Deathsword is "even less active than you"?  I make no comparison to your activity in what I said about Deathsword's activity, or anywhere else prior to this thread that I am aware of.  Where did you get that idea from, that "As you've shown us, Deathsword is even less active than me."?

I'll make that comparison here now though, lets see if it's true, what you assert from I don't know where....

As of right now, Deathsword's made 13 total posts in the game.  Rolepgeek has made 17.  In raw 'activity' measured by # of posts, Rolepgeek has indeed been more 'active' than Deathsword.

In terms of scumhunting (which is an activity I consider primary when I consider 'activity', not post count), Deathsword has made a total of 7/13 which contain at least a single sentence I can recognize as Scumhunting.  In some posts, it's literally a single sentence.

Rolepgeek has made a total of 6/17 posts which contain at least a single sentence I can recognize as Scumhunting.  In some posts, it's literally a single sentence.


Furthermore, Rolepgeek... my search through your posts reminded me of something else you said:

Top town...Deathsword, I think, still, since his posts have plenty of good activity and scum-hunting from what I can tell when he posts, and Darvi, I think, for similar reasons, though he's more active. May be that he fits my definition of scum-hunting better is all, though.

We have a really different opinion of Deathsword's scumhunting.  Would you please help me understand how to see his posts as having "plenty of good activity and scum-hunting" like you can tell?  And I understand you right, that Deathsword, not Darvi, "fits [your] definition of scum-hunting better", which is why Deathsword, not Darvi is your top Town?


Now, back to those deflective questions.
So. As you've shown us, Deathsword is even less active than me. So why are you voting me, and not him? You obviously think he's worthless as an IC. So what's your reason in going after me in particular? Is it because I 'personally attacked you'? You know, where I criticized your playstyle?
Nope.  My preferred answer to personal attacks is to distance myself from them, as I've made mention of in a few previous posts that I'd rather not talk to you at all.  That means I have to choose between playing this game or not.  I've decided, for now, to deal with you.  I'd already decided to match your tone as much as I could.  You stay polite with me, I'll stay polite with you.  We both might prefer that - I know I would.  Giving you the choice though; it's me matching you.

So in order to Scum hunt, I need to talk with those not talking, including you; or we can just see your role flip.  If you're talking... and you are.  So we talk.  You still appear highly scummy to my eyes, though I appreciate that you are attempting to scum hunt, though your attempt is focused almost purely upon myself. This is an improvement, and I will trust you further if you continue to improve.  That trust has not yet started, but I am watching, and listening.  If you're Town, we desperately need you, and I am delighted to place my vote upon the Scummiest player I can find, especially when a day is not about to end and I don't need to consider possible tie-votes or other such issues.

If this seems confusing to you - I am trying to say 'prepare for the possibility of a mislynch' and 'attempt to identify the Scum, be one of them me or not'.  By all means, do keep hunting me.  But I will find only- or primarily- hunting me suspicious - and others might as well.  Were this really the only suspicious thing about you, that might pass.


So, to summarize. 'Other mafia games talk about it, so why shouldn't we talk about it'? Along with a hearty helping of 'You aren't giving the advice I want you to, therefore you're abusing the IC voice'.

Actually, wait a second. This doesn't have anything to do with anything. You're basically criticizing him for doing a good job in a different game. What? Do you think people always have the same amount of time available? Or are you just upset about the reasoning in that advice?

So...you think he's lying? Is that what it is? Why? Because you think it's unlikely, based on your highly in-detail knowledge of Deathsword's RL health?
I have no idea what he's doing with that, lying or anything else.  It seems weird to me.  It's 'public record' as it were.  I wanted to see his response.  Pattern of deceptive play?  Looking like it to me.  Severely biased {guidance}, tuned against town?  Looking like it to me.  Is it -ever- appropriate to use {excuse for absence}?  That one I'm going to say, -no-, not while the player is alive.  Were he only present as an {IC voice} and wished to tell us that he could not offer advice for a time, that's innocent.  But as a player, no.  He can use player level excuse, but not IC level.  It's garbage to do otherwise.


Well, if you don't question me, I can't answer you. So...there's that, first off.
Though you "can't answer [me]", you have created an interesting and detailed response.  You have indeed 'answered' me, even in the portion where you say that you "can't answer".  I didn't expect or not expect to get a useful response, but I'm glad to get one and view it as a hopeful sign that you might continue to interact in information-containing ways.

So...there's that, first off. And while I would disagree about why you've voted me, (unlike Deathsword, I think it's because you have a personal vendetta against me on the grounds of me calling you on your bullshit, even a little) he has a point. If I can't be bothered to read the thread like you say, there is no point in voting me.

Next part of it. I don't see how it's taking an easy out. It gets worse when, as Deathsword noted as well, you look at your reasoning for voting me, and then your claimed reasoning for why his vote is bad. 'No better use for it' vs. 'randomly pushing'. They seem very similar to me. As for controlling how you vote...it's pretty hypocritical for you to say that, since you're trying to control how other people post and play in this game, period(as far as I can tell, with the saying 'Get into this game and play...or die for your failings'. The middle of it is left out, and can be seen above. Context.

You look majorly scummy to me for a bunch of reasons.  Some of the biggies:  Lurky, unfulfilled promises, overall lack of scumhunting, apparent and claimed lack of focus on game.  That I have said I'd prefer not to interact with you is belied by my vote and comments towards you, and by my continued interactions with you.  I will feel intense satisfaction if I can come to a clear sense of your Town-ness or Scum-ness; this will allow me to not feel I have as strong a responsibility to directly interact with you this much.  The process of getting to that point could even lead me to respect and appreciate your playstyle.  (dare I venture to suggest 'us' and 'each other's' instead of 'me' and 'you'?  Probably far, far to much to imagine)


Finally, how would you kill him, exactly? Are you able to control the outcome of a lynch? Perhaps you can ensure he dies if he continues to annoy you with a NK? Interesting ideas, I would say.

I refer you back to the earlier portion of this post, where I discussed the ultimatum's wording and apparent general use.  My only tools which can kill in this Mafia game are words and votes, both mine and others.  All players together control the outcome of lynches.  If I could and would NK those who annoy me - I do believe we wouldn't be talking now, you and I.


Rolepgeek asked to replace. When someone asks for that, it usually means they stop posting. You yourself said you voted him because you had nothing else to do with said vote. Now you talk about your previous play, but it is this very same previous play that makes your disregard as to where your vote goes more glaring. Is the vote yours to use as you see fit? Yes. It still does not exempt you from being called out on it.
As an addition, Imp, you never responded to this portion of his post.

I see no questions; that is his response to my response.  What sort of further response are you looking for?


Superblackcat - I've swung around to thinking Cat is Town.  Reason being Cat's talked a LOT, he's really shown several parts of how he reasons.  I can't tell for sure, but I think Cat just looks scummy and sometimes makes bad choices, but with Town intentions.  I'm by no means sure, but I think Cat has shown a pattern of play that I can follow and understand, and following it doesn't point to him as being Scum to me.  I don't think Cat could have played as he as if he is actually Scum.
Why not? He turned on kleril easily enough once he realized people thought there was something between them. Self-preservation isn't exactly a towny quality. It's a scum one.
This comment of yours contains a question, thus I answer:  Everything is a gestalt.  If it wasn't, then by your reasoning: Kleril turned on Cat more intensely, and more rapidly, than Cat turned on Kleril.  This Kleril is Scum, despite his Town role.

Since instead, truth is (for me) more easily found in wholes, my entire evaluation of Cat and everything he has done so far leads me to believe certain things about him; the only one that matters most is that he is much more likely to be Town than Scum.  As he continues to interact, I continue to observe, and in my mind test everything I have gathered about him against the new information and see if my opinion is changing.


3. I doubt we're going to lose. As long as we can get just one scum, our odds drastically improve, statistically and otherwise. More time to get the next one, info on who tried to help them, etc.

What are you basing this belief on?  Of the last 42 BM games in the forum - Town won only 7 times.  You're partially right, most of the Mafia wins had both Mafia surviving - but even catching one Scum doesn't make it likely that Town will win.  I stopped counting how many Mafia wins came after one Scum died when I hit 10 - leaving the most recent 7 Mafia wins unchecked.  But even when one Scum is lynched, in past games the single surviving Scum still defeated the Town well over 50% of the time.  What's got you so sure of a Town victory?


Ah. Well, then. Why wasn't that said at the beginning, when you voted me? He said you threw it on me because you had nothing better to do with it at the time, because that's why you claimed you put it on me. This sounds like you're coming up with something after the fact, because you didn't have a good reason when you voted me.

Strategy has many forms.  One of my goals, both direct and indirect, is to get people talking, especially those who have been talking little.  Another is to get people Scumhunting, especially those who have been visibly Scumhunting little.  I am perfectly content to be a target of Scumhunting; I consider it a fault to only Scumhunt narrowly.  That's a major lesson I've gained from Kleril's mislynch.  I -still- might have voted for his death, he appeared massively Scummy to me.  But had I looked as widely as I could on D1 I would now feel far less stupid about my involvement in that mislynch.  The placement of my vote upon you was not my first nor my only indicator that you appeared Scummy to me; it's been discussed before by me.


But that's what they are. Added reasons. You stated your primary reason, and the rest are secondary. Order of operations, so to speak. Besides the semantics of the situation, where calling them added reasons doesn't matter one way or another anyway.
See, being okay with a lynch on over half the players we have now is not a particularly town move. It seems really scummy to me, when looked at from that perspective, in fact; 1 scum buddy, one 'oh he's not scum anymore' to leave for when the game is at it's end, and the rest you can mislynch.

Nope; I think in gestalt (and semantics) far more than order of operations as perhaps you do.  I think in wholes.  And I am VERY disturbed to have such a weak feel of so many players - and it IS because so many of you are lurking both actively and passively.  I'm not sure of my Town picks either; but they sure look more Town than any lurky player to me, yep.


to be quite frank, I consider you to be, among the new players here, one of the most possibly dangerous if scum.

On a theory level, I'm flattered and I hope to be very dangerous when Scum; on an actual level you're failing in your logic here.
Reasons, here. You of all people should know you can't say that and not give specifics.

Specifics of?  How he's failing in his logic?  It's bolded, follows immediately after, and you quote it as well.


The most dangerous Scum are the people who actually are Scum, in this game right now.  Those two as yet unfound people.  It's fine to go for me, but we cannot afford for you to ignore everyone else, or for you to tolerate low levels of interaction and scumhunting - and you appear to be doing both.  I do not protest that you call me and my actions Scum - I protest because you're being lazy about it.  You're not working, you're not using anything but convenient easy recent things to support your attack; you look like you're just going through the motions, not that you care about anything other than deflecting attention from yourself.  You're scumhunting scummily.
No really? The scum who are actually scum are the dangerous ones? Now that the obvious has been stated, let's look at the rest. You can't ignore everyone else. But that's what extends are for. We pressure you until you crack, and then we pressure the others for a feel on who your buddy is until the end of the day when you get lynched. Or, if you really are town, we pressure you until you crack in a different way, and then we move on and look at your posts with a new light.

Whoever we lynch today, me or anyone, Town or Scum, that passes the edge from playtime to endtime.  Use today to prepare for Mylo.  Get AS MUCH information today as you can, because if today is a mislynch and tonight there's a kill, there's almost nothing left to work with.  Get active peeps.  Set yourselves up, work as a team so the Scum are also forced to work as a team or stand out - so that if we mislynch today we are in a great position for tomorrow.  Please, my partners.  Please get involved and active, so the Scum cannot stand beside you so easily.[/b]
I would say the same to you.
I'm not sure I follow your reasoning.  Expound upon both of your comments quoted here, please?


Oh Tiruin.  To me you're still my mentor here, you're still the person in this thread I feel the most comfort and rightness in buddying.  For this you pass forever, even if you also for other reasons fail.

Hey Squill!

Going to encourage you to talk about a few more things, hope you'll be willing to.

Would you discuss your evaluation, in terms of Town/Scum/null tell, for the play so far of Mr.Zero?  Would you do the same for Deathsword?
What? While encouraging players to talk is great and all, especially when you don't insult them or their playstyle, why would you buddy Tiruin? Especially if you think I'm scum, and he'd be replacing me. This would seem suspicious if not for the fact that he isn't playing. >.>

You really following this thread?  And understanding it?

I first referred to Tiruin as mentoring me and as someone I could buddy as much as I desired a week and a half ago.

There's a very large chance that Tiruin cannot be considered as a replacement for anyone in the thread, this is why:

ZU: Spoilspec please-if only to give access to deadchat, thanks. :P

Now we don't know if zombie urist gave her access to either or both - but we do know that when she asked if she could replace you, well this was the response.

If nobody ish going to replaace in then I'm volunteering if it affects the game for far too long.
Can you do votecounts and stuff this week?  :) I'm suuuuper busy.
I don't even...
:I

Either she isn't acceptable to replace anyone, or she just wasn't accepted to replace you (but maybe could replace an IC).  Ergo, you're still here, and still asking for replacement.

As she is not a player, and has requested to be ineligible to become a player, I feel especially free to respond to her in any way I please and to continue doing so.

You think this seems suspicious?  I think you're reaching for anything to say about how suspicious I am.  Flattering.  Welcome back to the game, please keep reading and trying, and consider turning your attention to additional possible Scum candidates.  If we mislynch again, I believe we're in grave trouble - even if we lynch correctly as I understand the odds, they are against us.  Scumhunting only counts as 'Town points' to me if it's used in a way that appears to be working towards a Town win over time.
Logged
For every trouble under the sun, there is an answer, or there is none.
If there is one, then seek until you find it.
If there is none, then never ever mind it.

Darvi

  • Bay Watcher
  • <Cript> Darvi is my wifi.
    • View Profile

So over the weekend I completely forgot that this was a thing.
Logged

Superblackcat

  • Bay Watcher
  • Giving Gifts of Bad Luck
    • View Profile

Welcome back.
Logged

Tiruin

  • Bay Watcher
  • Life is too short for worries
    • View Profile

So over the weekend I completely forgot that this was a thing.
:I
Logged

Tiruin

  • Bay Watcher
  • Life is too short for worries
    • View Profile

A deep piston-like shot rings in the air, before the ceiling opens to unveil a wonderful sunny day.

          The sky is auburn with the sun's presence, and the lack of clouds bring out the complexities of the dawn.

          Rays of sunlight reflect on your bodies.

          You all shine.
1

1
1
1

1

2
  Imp - Deathsword
  Squill
  Rolepgeek - Imp
  Superblackcat - Mr.Zero
  Mr.Zero - Superblackcat
  Deathsword
  Darvi - Squill

  Not Voting: Rolepgeek, Darvi

Rolepgeek has asked for a replacement!


Extend - 0/3
Shorten - 0/4


Which means ~63 hours left. :I


Spoiler (click to show/hide)



ZU: Spoilspec please-if only to give access to deadchat, thanks. :P

Now we don't know if zombie urist gave her access to either or both - but we do know that when she asked if she could replace you, well this was the response.

If nobody ish going to replaace in then I'm volunteering if it affects the game for far too long.
Can you do votecounts and stuff this week?  :) I'm suuuuper busy.
I don't even...
:I

Either she isn't acceptable to replace anyone, or she just wasn't accepted to replace you (but maybe could replace an IC).  Ergo, you're still here, and still asking for replacement.

As she is not a player, and has requested to be ineligible to become a player, I feel especially free to respond to her in any way I please and to continue doing so.
Ma'am Imp is right. ZU, however grumpy he is with me, has only provided me the deadchat link. It is...dead, for a blunt definition. :I

So I can't replace anyone and will be happy to converse in casual play with everyone because ZU is busy and bleh. :P

So yes, you're still here Role. Make the best of your time (or rescind your request for replacement if able).
« Last Edit: October 20, 2013, 08:54:35 am by Tiruin »
Logged

zombie urist

  • Bay Watcher
  • [NOT_LIVING]
    • View Profile

I'm done with *most* of my time consuming things. I have another midterm on Wednesday but I think I'll be good for the rest of the game.

Thanks Tiruin for doing votecounts, but you still can't replace in.  :P

Be active everyone.  ;)
Logged
The worst part of all of this is that Shakerag won.

Teneb

  • Bay Watcher
  • (they/them) Penguin rebellion
    • View Profile

Imp, what you are basically doing is trying to dominate the game with massive walls of text. Every time someone says something you disagree with, out comes the WoTs.


Above, for example, you attempt to discredit rolepgeek by point out posts where he said he was busy/not paying attention. While that was certainly true, what makes you think he didn't do a full read of the thread before posting his own wall of text?


You talk a lot about personal attacks and how long it took me to react. You know why I took so long to "react"? Because I did not see it as a personal attack. He criticised your playstile, which apparently offended you, thus resulting in you calling it an attack on your person. Well, following that logic, all your allegations that I am a shitty player/IC are personal attacks as well.

You are trying to do a lot to discredit me, despite the fact that I've been trying to provide advice since the very start of the game. Darvi was gone for a full week, but you barely said anything about that, and when you did it was in a friendly tone. When it comes to me, out come the allegations of me being shit. SBC is gone too, not a single word was said by you about that. So is MrZero. So is Squill.

Your walls of text are smokescreens, for walls of text are indeed intimidating, and it discourages others to go through them and attempt to counter the arguments.

I am, of course, unfazed by such attempts of discredit. But it reeks of scum play, and for that my vote stays on you.
Logged
Monstrous Manual: D&D in DF
Quote from: Tack
What if “slammed in the ass by dead philosophers” is actually the thing which will progress our culture to the next step?

Squill

  • Bay Watcher
  • Decided to play DF, I guess I'm back now?
    • View Profile

Hey Squill!

Going to encourage you to talk about a few more things, hope you'll be willing to.

Would you discuss your evaluation, in terms of Town/Scum/null tell, for the play so far of Mr.Zero?  Would you do the same for Deathsword?
Sorry for not posting for a while, had a bit of a busy weekend.

Anyways, I think that Mr. Zero has been fairly inactive lately. It seems a little bit scummy, but right now I think there are bigger problems.

As for Deathsword... I think that either him or Imp are scum. I think that one of you two is bringing emotions into this to either a. Make the other look bad, or b. Provoke a lynch of the other by agitating the other players into a sort of panic. Currently, I think it's more likely to be Deathsword; as right now, Imp is both the most frequent poster and the most aggressive player. It makes her into a priority target for scum, both because of she's more dangerous as a scumhunter, and because the volume of her texts makes it more likely for her to say something that can be used against her. Of course, it is entirely possible that Imp is scum, and aware of her position, and is using it against Deathsword, but I find that unlikely, because if I remember correctly, Deathsword was the one who initiated the conflict.

Even with all this though, my vote remains on Darvi.
@Darvi: You "forget" about us for over a week, and when you finally get back, this is all we get?
So over the weekend I completely forgot that this was a thing.
This seems highly suspect, as you admitted to having seen the thread, but still you post no content.
Logged
I have not posted in almost a year
But now in iambic verse I am here

Imp

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Deathsword:
Imp, what you are basically doing is trying to dominate the game with massive walls of text. Every time someone says something you disagree with, out comes the WoTs.

I disagree with your determination of my motive.  I am playing, very actively playing.  I flat out don't care if my activity 'dominates the game' or not - I wish everyone were more active and would be perfectly content if everyone were as active and verbose as I am.  You however, are connecting pressure upon me to a directive from you to be less involved in the game.  Seriously scummy move.


Above, for example, you attempt to discredit rolepgeek by point out posts where he said he was busy/not paying attention. While that was certainly true, what makes you think he didn't do a full read of the thread before posting his own wall of text?

You again incorrectly ascribe motive to me.  I make no attempt to 'discredit' Rolepgeek; he's doing a fine job of that all by himself.  I discuss what I see, oh yes.  Every person must draw their own conclusions.  Your question is answered, and quite fully, in the portions of my answer immediately preceding and also following what you bothered to quote:


You talk a lot about personal attacks and how long it took me to react.

Really?  Seems this is the only thing I've said about that:

Why, you even wait until NOW!! to throw out an IC comment about don't personal attack.  More than ten days after it happened!

Why does that feel like 'me talking alot' to you?

You know why I took so long to "react"? Because I did not see it as a personal attack. He criticised your playstile, which apparently offended you, thus resulting in you calling it an attack on your person. Well, following that logic, all your allegations that I am a shitty player/IC are personal attacks as well.

I accept your classification of 'wasn't a personal attack' to you.  Given that his "criticism of my playstyle" post came 3 days after he said he'd stopped reading what I (or anyone else) was writing, and he said he hadn't thoroughly read that either, despite saying he "was wanting to dissect the behemoth piece by piece and feed it to [me]".  When someone says something like this:  "I was trying to pressure Imp, to get him to do a good play instead of active-lurking like it had appeared he had been(and still may be)." and also say something like "[Imp's bad play] may have changed in the last five pages...About everything post behemoth, I can't say anything yet" - That's garbage.  Covering his inactivity with 'scumhunting', or at least "pressure" which he directly says he isn't even paying attention to the thread - useless, stupid application of "pressure" if he doesn't even bother to check if it's still warranted by his own non-scumhunting motives.  Guess what:  attacking someone outside of scumhunting - what is that?  What is it doing in the game?  What is it intended to achieve?

I think it's intended to cover his arse, to point fingers and shout and try to make someone other than himself look bad.

Your {IC} comment about no personal attacks coming a week and a half after the issue entered the thread; you don't bother to notice or care about its presence in the thread until you see fit to mention personal attacking in your own post as a player; Garbage.  Covering your arse garbage.  You're acting like Scum, before and still; I am calling you on it, and I understand this to be how the game is played and what Scumhunting is.  Which is not what Rolepgeek was doing in his "criticism of my playstyle" post where he said 'I have no idea what is going on now but I'll put a lot of words into apology, say I don't know what is going on, and talk about how terrible that terrible Imp is, I've got some stuff to vent so woo!  I'm venting'.

You are trying to do a lot to discredit me, despite the fact that I've been trying to provide advice since the very start of the game. Darvi was gone for a full week, but you barely said anything about that, and when you did it was in a friendly tone. When it comes to me, out come the allegations of me being shit. SBC is gone too, not a single word was said by you about that. So is MrZero. So is Squill.

You too are doing just fine in discrediting yourself.  I'm talking about your actions, sure.  Do they look Scummy?  I think so.  But they're your actions, and we're supposed to Scumhunt.  You're the person to look to if what you do is Scummy; no one can "discredit" anyone but themselves; all anyone else can do is highlight and discuss.

As to other players being too quiet:  Yes.  And I don't know what to do about that.  I've been talking about it; 'be more active, please' has been a theme.  My first reaction to lurkers was back on the third day of play

I still have no idea what to do about lurkers:

Requesting a prod for Rolepgeek and griffinpup - the rules on the first page says someone has to request for non-posters to be prodded or it won't happen, am I understanding that right?
Only if I don't notice.  :o

I still am not sure if I'm supposed to track days (no one else is giving it high priority, not even either of our ICs or our moderator or our substitute moderator) and ask for prods, or they just won't happen.  When a prod was requested for Darvi, after 4 days of no posts, the mod responded with:

Prods will go out tomorrow at midnight though.  >:(

...  So I dunno.  I so dunno.  But I have to do something.  No one else seems to be, and I'll be damned before I just sit here and wait for Town to die.

Your walls of text are smokescreens, for walls of text are indeed intimidating, and it discourages others to go through them and attempt to counter the arguments.

I am, of course, unfazed by such attempts of discredit. But it reeks of scum play, and for that my vote stays on you.

You and Rolepgeek both look like Scum to me.  I can't say that I mind a seriously Scummy player saying "my vote stays on you", especially when the reasons given seem amount to:

You are active.  You are verbose.  You are attacking me.

Do I understand your case against me correctly, Scumsword?

As of right now, I'm equally happy to vote for either Rolepgeek or Deathsword.  I'd like to hear more from both, and everyone, before D2 ends.  We have about 28 hours before day end.  I'll be the first to say Extend in the wild hope that activity increases; failing that I don't mind seeing this amazingly inactive day end because without activity, I don't see any benefits to more time or less time; I see nothing but another pitiful Town loss.

Squill/Everyone:
Would you discuss your evaluation, in terms of Town/Scum/null tell, for the play so far of Mr.Zero?  Would you do the same for Deathsword?
Anyways, I think that Mr. Zero has been fairly inactive lately. It seems a little bit scummy, but right now I think there are bigger problems.

Err.  Is that your entire analysis of Mr.Zero?  That' he's been fairly inactive lately?  I don't just want to evaluate your thinking, I'd also like to see him through someone else's eyes; yours and anyone else's.  There were a few concerns about him, especially near the end of D1.  I'd really like to be able to consider another's view of his play.  I hope you have more to add...

But I am opening the question up wide.  I'd like to hear from anyone, and/or everyone, what you think of Mr.Zero's play.

The analysis of Deathsword/myself shows greater thought, which is more useful.  Perspective appreciated, though I'd like you to analyze more than just 'the last few days' if you're willing to revisit the question and consider Deathsword-over-time as well please?

If you want to also analyze me, go for it.  It won't change what I think of my alignment, but I am trying to understand how you think and what you are thinking, so I can evaluate you, and nearly anything gameplay related can possibly help me do that.

As to Darvi:  I'm disappointed beyond words.  His 'abandonment' just increases my incredulity.  However this is what may have happened:  He did somehow 'forget'.  he noticed, somehow, totally outside of his normal posting hours - he typically posts in the thread around the time I'm posting this or a little sooner; his 'oops' post came at what seems crazy hours for his posting - I'm willing to accept that he had no time then to do more than say his form of 'I messed up, I'll fix when I can'.

Weekends are considered free time from Mafia games; while I don't -like- at all that after missing us all week he STILL took the weekend off (but did post in other threads on DF forums) - as I understand the rules I don't get to hold someone not posting on the weekend against them.  So he has today, and this is around the latter range of the time he normally posts here during the week he did post.

So I'm prepared to wait until after today before I start adding even more 'that's scummy' points to his tally or screaming for his neck, in the off chance that he's in the middle, right now, of catching up and posting.  Does not mean he's forgiven.  Just means I can see a 'reasonable reason' with the little I know of him for him to not have answered again before now so I'm no more upset that it's this time today without his next post appearing than I was, say, Saturday at this time or Sunday at this time.  Now, tomorrow at this time, ehh.

But really, everyone needs more activity :(
Logged
For every trouble under the sun, there is an answer, or there is none.
If there is one, then seek until you find it.
If there is none, then never ever mind it.

Imp

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Oh yeah, also meant to ask you, Deathsword:  What's your opinion of everyone who's not me (I know you say I'm Scum) and yourself?
Logged
For every trouble under the sun, there is an answer, or there is none.
If there is one, then seek until you find it.
If there is none, then never ever mind it.

Tiruin

  • Bay Watcher
  • Life is too short for worries
    • View Profile

Requesting a prod for Rolepgeek and griffinpup - the rules on the first page says someone has to request for non-posters to be prodded or it won't happen, am I understanding that right?
Only if I don't notice.  :o

I still am not sure if I'm supposed to track days (no one else is giving it high priority, not even either of our ICs or our moderator or our substitute moderator) and ask for prods, or they just won't happen.  When a prod was requested for Darvi, after 4 days of no posts, the mod responded with:

Prods will go out tomorrow at midnight though.  >:(

...  So I dunno.  I so dunno.  But I have to do something.  No one else seems to be, and I'll be damned before I just sit here and wait for Town to die.
I..I thought that ZU sent out the prods so I didn't and and and T_T
>____<

Sorry!

But really, everyone needs more activity :(

In the eyes of the sun, the orb turns a vivid crimson color.

A gunshot sounds. The orb speaks.

"IDLENESS. SOLITUDE. IF NONE SHALL ACT, THEN I SHALL. IF NOTHING IS TO BE DONE, THEN THE ELEMENTS WILL OVERTAKE YOU ALL.

ACTIVATING SECURITY MEASURE -24601
"

You get the feeling that, without much attention to each other (and this game), everything will probably go to the scrapheap and beyond. . .soon.

[Seriously guys? You've all had FIVE or so days. Imp is giving me all the nostalgia about her long posts because I did long posts back then.

And really. Nothing from you men? >_> is everyone that busy that they fear a tiiiiny slip? THIS GAME IS FOR LEARNING, AND NOT MAINLY PRESERVATION.

Though in context, it would really be preservation now. Preservation of expiry date given the idleness of 80% of its players. :/

@Imp: When taking any case-focus and summarize as you go on-mention the things that mark the target out as scummy, and learn to cut out the trivial points that don't directly lead to the aforementioned scumminess--you may point this out in your 'revealing paragraph', but trim it a bit as you go on. =] Good work so far, for whatever team you're in.

Scum IC: What are your words on this case. :I]

We have 26 hours left guys. Given timezones and all...
Logged

Rolepgeek

  • Bay Watcher
  • They see me rollin' they savin'~
    • View Profile

GAWD
Imp, what you are basically doing is trying to dominate the game with massive walls of text. Every time someone says something you disagree with, out comes the WoTs.


Above, for example, you attempt to discredit rolepgeek by point out posts where he said he was busy/not paying attention. While that was certainly true, what makes you think he didn't do a full read of the thread before posting his own wall of text?


You talk a lot about personal attacks and how long it took me to react. You know why I took so long to "react"? Because I did not see it as a personal attack. He criticised your playstile, which apparently offended you, thus resulting in you calling it an attack on your person. Well, following that logic, all your allegations that I am a shitty player/IC are personal attacks as well.

You are trying to do a lot to discredit me, despite the fact that I've been trying to provide advice since the very start of the game. Darvi was gone for a full week, but you barely said anything about that, and when you did it was in a friendly tone. When it comes to me, out come the allegations of me being shit. SBC is gone too, not a single word was said by you about that. So is MrZero. So is Squill.

Your walls of text are smokescreens, for walls of text are indeed intimidating, and it discourages others to go through them and attempt to counter the arguments.

I am, of course, unfazed by such attempts of discredit. But it reeks of scum play, and for that my vote stays on you.

I have to agree with you on at least one thing, Deathsword. Walls of text are intimidating. They're difficult to read, and frankly, I don't feel the desire to read them. It's difficult to follow what's going on, since it takes stuff individually instead of in context. To me, that is the single most important thing in an argument. Context. That, and not making assumptions. Everyone's doing it. Myself included, if only because I'm picking up bad habits from everyone else. Probably not the only reason, though(likely has to do with the fact that at some point or another in this type of game, it becomes a requirement. Period.). But my point is, let's say the first part of Imp's most recent Wall of Text.
Deathsword:
Imp, what you are basically doing is trying to dominate the game with massive walls of text. Every time someone says something you disagree with, out comes the WoTs.

I disagree with your determination of my motive.  I am playing, very actively playing.  I flat out don't care if my activity 'dominates the game' or not - I wish everyone were more active and would be perfectly content if everyone were as active and verbose as I am.  You however, are connecting pressure upon me to a directive from you to be less involved in the game.  Seriously scummy move.
Several assumptions being made here that aren't there in reality, as far as I can tell.
First is the assumption that Imp is trying to dominate the game verbally, and that he's using WoTs to try and break apart anyone who disagrees with him.
NEXT, is the assumption that Deathsword is telling Imp to be less active.
Neither of these are true, as far as I can tell. And then there's the underlying assumption, that I'm recently realizing is untrue.
The assumption that WoTs are the best way to go about communicating in this game. Be honest Imp. Really be honest. If everyone, if all nine people, were as [let's go with dedicated] as you, how do you think it'd go? WoTs and Counter-WoTs everywhere. Do you really think you'd have the time to read all that? Let alone respond?

I played, left, returned to, left again, and tried once more, a roleplaying chat-room based website. A very successful one. One in which 'walls of text' were much appreciated, since it was believed that meant you were a better RPer, or at least were better and establishing the scene, and such, even though a single one would take 15 minutes to write, whilst only maybe 15 seconds would pass, if it was, say, a combat scene. I've realized, playing there and elsewhere, that this isn't the best way to go about things. It tends to turn it into a contest, rather than a game. Now, here, at least, it's both, but it's not a contest between everyone. WoT may have legitimate information in them, and usually do. The problem is that it gets hidden, and obscured, by sheer volume of information. I'm learning this too, in class; my British Literature teacher is saying that my biggest problem is going into too much detail. For this type of game, so that I can respond to your posts and not be intimidated into procrastinating by their sheer size, try to cut them down to reasonable lengths Parse out less important details(perhaps in a spoiler at the bottom, little tidbits we can read if we have extra time, but not the true meat of it?). At the least, don't dissect posts anymore. Quote the post, maybe once, then either number the things you refer to(we can reference it ourselves; if nothing else we won't have to scroll down as much), or simply make it clear what it is through (hey look this word again) context.

At another time, when I have more time(Aka, the weekends), I will be able to chop through your WoT. My 'WoT', from Friday? That took me over an hour and a half to make. I was only able to because I didn't have school that day. Most days, I have an hour and a half on the computer, period. I'm not going to spend it all on one game. Not to mention the time it takes to figure out what's being said, and then figure out what that means. For now? I will ask you to find the most important things from that and summarize it/repeat the questions alone(though with context, or at least the ability for me to figure out what the context is), so that I can respond.

Although, part of the problem is that I have very strict limits on my time, due to the way my schedule(and what I own) works. I can't check in throughout the day like most people, or do stuff at lunch or anything.


AND NOW FOR THE IMPORTANT PART DUR DUR DURRR
Since it's a tie, I need to vote someone, to break it at the least. I'm not actually going to vote Imp, since I'm starting to think she has important things to make clear, and I want to give her a chance to cut stuff down so she isn't fucking with my eyes anymore. >.> So I'll vote Superblackcat, as they(genderwhutidunno) look to have been active-lurking for the last long while, without really contributing. Plus, you know, the whole ground that's already been trodden upon stuff with buddy-stabbing. :D
Logged
Sincerely, Role P. Geek

Optimism is Painful.
Optimize anyway.
Pages: 1 ... 20 21 [22] 23 24 ... 44