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Fivex's

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Total Members Voted: 8

[Andrew425]

Just a quick note IC about Malta and Sicily(I haven't fully read the thread yet, its late!):

Castille view Aragon as part of our patrimony, therefore all lands currently occupied by them we consider Castillian property.
At the current time we don't feel it would be acceptable for a foreign power to encroach on these lands. We will defend them, if necessary, but we hope that our intentions are made clear enough to avoid that.

-King 0 0 0 deadbeat of Castille

tl;dr Keep your stinking English hands out of the med.

Them be fighting words. Perhaps Gibraltar should be thrown into the mix as well?

[Grand Nagus]

Just a quick note IC about Malta and Sicily(I haven't fully read the thread yet, its late!):

Castille view Aragon as part of our patrimony, therefore all lands currently occupied by them we consider Castillian property.
At the current time we don't feel it would be acceptable for a foreign power to encroach on these lands. We will defend them, if necessary, but we hope that our intentions are made clear enough to avoid that.

-King 0 0 0 deadbeat of Castille

tl;dr Keep your stinking English hands out of the med.

Them be fighting words. Perhaps Gibraltar should be thrown into the mix as well?

Don't make me send an Armada your way, this time we will check the weather first.

[Tarran]

Italy is amused at how powers occupying Italy's rightful territories are conflicting with those who wish to occupy the same territory. Italy offers 20000 pizzas to both parties to never even spill one drop of blood on the island from the fighting and thus preform fantastically ironic wars.

Italy also offers 500 dishes of spaghetti for every ship lost fighting.

Italy, finally, offers 2000 truffles to each for all the fighting to be done on Austrian lands.

[stabbymcstabstab]

Austria will aid england in its bid to expand I even know a few areas that would be a great starting point.

[Grand Nagus]

Spain will support Milan then, should they need our aid.

And who says politics isn't a playground?

Nerrr nerrrr!

[stabbymcstabstab]

Tartan is safe the area I'm talking about is some place called Naples.

[Tarran]

Oh stabby, you are vastly overestimating the hand of cards that you have got for yourself.



Also, Twiggie, a quick tip: Unless you are totally fine with a few dozen years of chaos for your country where anyone could ruin your day and you aren't strong enough to expand, don't westernize. For the love of god, don't do it.

[Grand Nagus]

Well I'm not bothered about Naples, but I imagine Milan will be mad if you try to encroach that deep into their boot.
And Milan has many friends. Because of previous Austrian aggression!

Not even mad.

[Twiggie]

Hmmm, I really must play a game where I westernize, haven't checked it out yet...

[Grand Nagus]

Hmmm, I really must play a game where I westernize, haven't checked it out yet...

It's pretty brutal. But if you can keep the revolt risk down, its not bad. I suggest waiting til 1600's for the RR reducing buildings personally.

[Azthor]

First non-Italian to get into continental Italy proper without Milanese authorisation gets a special french delivery, escorted by 31,000 units of infantry and 11,000 units of cavalry fitted with bleeding edge technology (most literally). The roads are mysteriously dangerous these days, after all.

I've refrained from entering the otherwise very, very valuable italian Savoy so that Milan could have the region; rest assured, I did not do so only for someone else altogether to hijack the region. Meddle in continental Italy at your own peril. I'd imagine the Ottomans have a similar view on the matter.

I shall also clarify: Milan is completely free to leave or keep to the PU with the French crown as it pleases. Either way, however, it remains guaranteed by the French crown.

[Tarran]

Hmmm, I really must play a game where I westernize, haven't checked it out yet...

1: It crashes all your points to -100. So you should spend as many as possible.
2: It crashes your stability to -3, while increasing the cost 200%... unless I'm mistaken, this means 300 points for increasing negative stability, after the game has crashed your stability.
3: Westernization does not progress until you are at 0 stability at least.
4: There are many events to ruin your progress, drastically reducing your diplomacy or military points by 100 or stability by 1. Thankfully, similar events for admin only get rid of 25 points, but you lose advisors.
5: There are still random stability decreasing events. Comets, anyone?
6: It is extra horrible if you are catholic and the Reformation hits right in the middle of the westernization. Religious Turmoil, yum...

[Pnx]

There's a few ways to make it easier on yourself though.

Firstly, you can wait for an event that increases stability, and then before you click accept, click westernise, though this is a bit of a gamey solution. Religious turmoil can actually be good for this because solving it gives you +2 stability, and the deal with rebels mission gives you +1 stability, though those might be rather hard to do if you're in the middle of westernising.

Secondly, you can wait for a good admin monarch, and take a good admin advisor, the other forms of monarch points won't matter much.

Thirdly, if possible you can just wait for yourself to accumulate 900 admin monarch points, then instantly go from -3 to 0 stability. This will save you from having to take all those -1 stability or lose a bunch of points and gain a rebellion events.


One other thing I should warn about is the issues I wound up running into when westernising in my recent Golden Horde game. I tried to do it as soon as possibly by snuggling up to Genoa's black sea provinces. This worked, and I eventually managed to westernise by about 1500, but I quickly realised this might not have been the best strategy when the war I was in with Muscowy when I finished quickly went bad very quickly. This was a war that was going alright up until that point, Moscow may have had more units, and a better quality of military, but with good leadership and tactics I was managing to hold my own.

Then I westernised and my units all automatically swapped to western types, which was bad for two reasons. The first was that all of them dropped to 0 morale, which froze them in place and allowed Moscow to instantly kill some 18 regiments of cavalry, and the entire rest of my army.

The second is that equivelant western units were actually worse. The nomad tech group starts the game with slightly better units than the western tech group, this only evens out at about tech level 10, which was something I was nowhere near close to having (this is ignoring all the little discipline and shock bonuses you get along the way).

Even after the war was over, the other nomads were kicking my butt as well on account of having better units. I eventually just threw my arms up and gave up after Moscow declared war again.

[Dutchling]

You can also cancel coring, or cultural conversions to save Diplo or Admin points.

[stabbymcstabstab]

Will not make it this week end, busy murdering att for stupidity