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[Meph]

Hey guys,

I hit a dead end. I did write a system for magic dwarves, simple stuff, fire, air, water, earth, white and black magic. It uses following files:

Code: [Select]

building_.txt
creature_.txt
inorganic_.txt
interaction_.txt
item_.txt
plant_.txt
reaction_.txt
I also replace creature_standard.txt with a new one, adding the new castes. I did not change anything else, only CASTE: and SELECT_CASTE: tags, and all other changes inside these castes. But somehow I have a problem.

Dwarves no longer eat. Both the mage-castes as well as any normal dwarf. They do not recognize food as edible. Not meat, eggs, plants, prepared meals... nothing. I know that this should be affected by material templates and the [EDIBLE] token, but I do not change the material templates, nor any tissue templates.

Does anyone have any idea what might cause this?

I can post all the raws, if that helps, but they are very large. They also only work in my mod.

I do not use any dfhack scripts besides autosyndrome to deliver the transformation syndrome, and itemsyndrome for magic items. Both are tried and tested in the mod, and both caused no issues so far.

[Halfling]

Are they getting hungry? Are food items still cookable?

[Meph]

Yes. They do get hungry, then starving, then "catch small creature", then die of hunger.

The food items are all listed in the stocks, the kitchen accepts it to make meals, but the prepared meals are also ignored. Food items are also correctly stockpiled.

Dwarves still have hands (grasp bodyparts) and are completely healthy, no injuries.

Dwarven mage castes with the NO_EAT token do not get hungry and starve. Maybe I should try without any NO_EAT castes.

EDIT: I narrowed it down to the creature_standard.txt. I do have a version without the magic castes, and a version with the magic castes... if I use the former, dwarves eat, if I use the latter, they do not eat.

I compared them with beyond compare, but cant find any fault.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

no raws?

[Deon]

Meph, we cannot help you if you do not post raws. Do they have mouths? Do they by chance have some token which could prevent eating?

[Meph]

creature_standard.txt
creature_standart with the magic additions causing the problem.txt

Here they are. I hoped that someone else stumbled upon the same problem including a solution, because the raws are indeed quite long, and I didnt want you guys to waste time sifting through them. But seems like its the best option. Something like WinMerge or BeyondCompare will still be the best friend.

EDIT: I only found a duplicate of SELECT_CASTE:SORCERER_MALE and SORCERER:FEMALE, but this shouldnt cause any problem. It only adds the profession names and skill learn rates and beards for these two castes.

RawExplorer can also not find any problems with it.

EDIT2: After I removed all other creatures and metatags I might have found a hint.

'[' count: 4065
']' count: 4070

But I'd be damned if I know where the 5 missing pieces are. ... And after reading some more, I found them: Its vanilla DF. Toady added a line, "*** need a new style to keep these short and need to make the entity def say to keep them short", and afterwards there are 5 half-open entries. They dont do any harm, because the [ is missing, not the other way around. So its not the brackets, either...

EDIT3: Oh, and some additional info: Its not caused by any interaction a mage would caste on the dwarves. Even if I embark with 7 normal dwarves, and do not test any of the mages, the problem exists.

[smakemupagus]

Maybe I should try without any NO_EAT castes.

I don't see any fault either; have you tried it without the NO_EAT castes yet?

[Meph]

I did remove all the SELECT_CASTE:SORCERER till WHITE_3, which means all new mages. Testing showed that that fixed the problem. Dwarves eat.

I put half of them (arcane base caste, fire, water, earth, air) back in, and left black/white mages out. Tested again. Dwarves DO NOT eat.

This means the problem is in the first half, or in both halves. Testing is slow, since I have to wait for dwarves to get hungry (about 1,5months). I dont have any more time atm, but at least you guys have an idea how to narrow it down, if you want to try.

I would have honestly assumed it was the lich or vampire mages (with all those tags), but tests show that its somewhere in fire/water/earth/air. Flier tag maybe, Ai/Pathfinding broken? I really cant explain anything yet.

EDIT: Ok, one last test for today. I removed the duplicate SELECT_CASTE:SORCERER_MALE and FEMALE, the flier tag from air-mages and all SELECT_CASTE:FIRE and WATER.

This means arcane base caste, black, white, air and earth mages are still in. Lets see if it works or not.

EDIT2: That fixed it. Dwarves eat. I still dont know if it was FIRE, WATER, the flier tag, or the double entry for select_caste:sorcerer_male/female. I can check that tomorrow, or, smake, if you feel like it, you can have a go.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

wow that is a horrible mess, I'd suggest for your sake of debugging to look into how [SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE] will help quite a bit, you are constantly redefining other tags (I think I saw HOMEOTHERM 3 times?)

I'd say do a quick find for these tags:

CARNIVORE
BONECARN
HUNTS_VERMIN

to ensure that they are the culprit, as I know HUNTS_VERMIN might be the biggest cause. Also for a little pointer, I saw your dwarves are using standardized materials yet they still have [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE] in them also typo in Black Mages bone spike spells, the first one is "spit a bone pike:spits a bone spike" and several mages have spells in the wrong headers (or maybe black mages) where they use [SELECT_TISSUE] and alter the values, you do know that changes the tissues for all of the castes? Tissues and Materials are CREATURE level, not CASTE

here is some hints at how to fix some things:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[CASTE:FIRE_1_M]
[CASTE_NAME:ashkin:ashkins:dwarven]
[DESCRIPTION:*ASHKIN - FIRE LVL1* This dwarf bears a spark of magic in him. A fresh member of the school of fire, he has learned to withstand intense heat. He can throw balls of flame at his enemies Being arcane in nature he can still cast his magic conceal spell. He is a novice in the use of the fire staff. If carrying a fire aura, he will cause blisters and pain in all nearby enemies.]
[MALE]
[CASTE:FIRE_1_F]
[CASTE_NAME:ashkin:ashkins:dwarven]
[DESCRIPTION:*ASHKIN - FIRE LVL1* This dwarf bears a spark of magic in her. A fresh member of the school of fire, she has learned to withstand intense heat. She can throw balls of flame at her enemies. Being arcane in nature she can still cast her magic conceal spell. She is a novice in the use of the fire staff. If carrying a fire aura, she will cause blisters and pain in all nearby enemies.]
[FEMALE]

TO:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

[CASTE:FIRE_1_M]
[MALE]

[CASTE:FIRE_1_F]
[FEMALE]

[SELECT_CASTE:FIRE_1_M]
   [SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE:FIRE_1_f]
[CASTE_NAME:ashkin:ashkins:dwarven]
[DESCRIPTION:*ASHKIN - FIRE LVL1* This dwarf bears a spark of magic in her. A fresh member of the school of fire, she has learned to withstand intense heat. She can throw balls of flame at her enemies. Being arcane in nature she can still cast her magic conceal spell. She is a novice in the use of the fire staff. If carrying a fire aura, she will cause blisters and pain in all nearby enemies.]

you have custom descriptions of He and She might as well scrap that, I'm sure players can read the dwarves stats and find the gender. By using "this dwarf" and "they"
I'd also just redo your entire Dwarf creature with the stuff that all castes should have at the top then caste special stuff, then interactions/spells I'm sure 4000+ lines can be cut in half effortlessly if not close to, since alot of it is duped raws.

Also as for my example if you want to keep the He and She descriptions that is fine, however for interactions and spells do they really need to be separate? I don't think there is a male or female related magic, everyone can cast the same spell regardless of gender. Just saying.

I'm still looking for what could be causing the issue of not eating, it could be [BLOOD:] as if the surrounding tempeature is hot enough to boil their blood or damage it, they will consider it HOT or they might consider it COLD basically thinking "This place is too dangerous, I shouldn't stay here" thus won't really eat or drink due to thinking it's dangerous. Had that issue with automatons that has steam as blood (when I used a custom water materials, not WATER)

EDIT::

just saw

   [SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL]
      [MULTIPLY_VALUE:3]
      [COLDDAM_POINT:NONE]
      [HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
      [IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
      [IF_EXISTS_SET_MELTING_POINT:15000]
      [IF_EXISTS_SET_BOILING_POINT:20000]

won't do anything, materials are standardized, and if it did work all dwarves are fire proof.

[Meph]

I cant define materials inside castes? How could I make the fire-mages fire-proof then? Fireimmune token is broken in that regard, they would still die.

And I dont care very much how nice or ugly it looks, as long as it works.

I dont use carnivore, bonecarn or hunts_vermin.

And they dont cancel their eating job, they never start one. Anyway, like I said, I have narrowed it down quite a bit.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

well you need a two new BDPs that add fire-proof materials to the dwarf and tissues that use those fire-proof materials, and since you have some castes that have faster healing rates and such, maybe some custom tissues for them too.

You will then have to define the [USE_BODY_DETIAL_PLAN:VETERBREA_TISSUE_LAYERS:FSKIN/SKIN/HSKIN:etc:etc:etc]

where FSKIN would be fire proof so those would be called in fire immune castes
SKIN is normal skin used for normal dwarves
HSKIN is fast healing skin used for black mages and earth mages or whatever caste that has faster healing

And I dont care very much how nice or ugly it looks, as long as it works.

If it actually looked nice or was organized better, I'm sure you would have found the issue in the newly added castes already. This is what programmers call "A bad foundation" since I saw two MAX_AGE tags the last one is going to take over, so IDK if you want 90:110 or 100:120

So before you say "I don't care" take the advice and reconsider it, messy and redundant code (in the programming world) will cause you grief down the road.

And they don't cancel their eating job, they never start one. Anyway, like I said, I have narrowed it down quite a bit.

Like I said about my Automations, you issue might be your water mages

   [SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL]
      [MULTIPLY_VALUE:3]
      [COLDDAM_POINT:NONE]
      [MAT_FIXED_TEMP:5000]

make a quick embark, and use "i" and try to set a meeting zone, does it have a COLD or HOT next to it?

If anything removed all of the SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL from castes that insist they have to be fire immune or cold.
and run a world.

[Putnam]

I cant define materials inside castes? How could I make the fire-mages fire-proof then? Fireimmune token is broken in that regard, they would still die.

Give them unique materials with different names (FIRE_SKIN etc.)

[Meph]

I have so many raws, it would take days to write them out "clean". I am also coding from busses and boats, hostels and trains, suddenly a powercut, or a military control, or the road gets to bumpy to type... mostly offline, so I cant look up any tags/tokens... thats why the code looks odd most of the time.

I will try with custom materials and additional tissues layers for the special dwarves then. And try more embarks and single the bug out slowly. But how would the material temperature affect eating behaviour? They drink just fine.

Thanks for the help so far. I am really curious which part causes all this.

[Putnam]

Get Hugo's wiki rip; that should clean it right up.

[Meph]

Good idea.   I have it at home on my constantly-online PC, but somehow ignored the fact that I could copy it onto the netbook, lol.

I added water back in, still everthing ok... now I added the last caste back in, fire, currently testing.