Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Tack]

I like research in 4x games because it encourages prioritisation over your rivals. Especially civlikes where world wonders are capped at 1 and you have to "race" for them.

[Shadowlord]

Not because 4X survives on that implementation, but because it'll come from a place of "let's try 4X, but different."

The diplomacy/influence system in Star Ruler 2 is one of the best 4x innovations ever, and not because diplomacy was replaced with cards - it wasn't - because it was an enhancement over the standard 4x diplomacy systems and the card system was positively inspired.

Methinks "4X, but different" is far, far, better than MoO3's "It's going to be a 5X, not a 4X, and to make sure that everyone knows, we're making the subtitle 'The Fifth X'". The fifth X, by the way, was 'eXperience', because that's certainly not a thing which mattered in any other 4x #sarcasm.

[Damiac]

Here's a peeve that's a bit niche:

When developers implement a feature that the great majority of the player base doesn't like, then brings it up every time they want to implement another unwanted feature, as it to prove "We can do whatever we want and you have to deal with it".

Or, perhaps a little more generally, devs that are overly antagonistic with their players.

[Ultimuh]

Here's a peeve that's a bit niche:

When developers implement a feature that the great majority of the player base doesn't like, then brings it up every time they want to implement another unwanted feature, as it to prove "We can do whatever we want and you have to deal with it".

Or, perhaps a little more generally, devs that are overly antagonistic with their players.

I get what you are saying, but to be fair.. If developers always did what the players wanted, it would likely be a weird mess of a game.
Also, I remember when Minecraft was supposed to have lanterns and torches would have to be reignited every once in a while. But then some vocal players didn't want it and.. well..
I was exited to see what the devs would do next, but things didn't happen because of the players.
But then again, I was hoping they would make a real skyworld-ish dimension, and then we got The End.
But yes, I do agree that there are devs out there who may not know what they are doing with their game.

[Damiac]

I guess it's less devs not knowing what they're doing, because what do I care if some guy ruins his bad game further?

It's more devs who have a good game, and seem to take pleasure in antagonizing their playerbase.  Especially because this sometimes creates rifts in the playerbase, and you end up with a bunch of bitter cynics calling the devs idiots on one side, and a bunch of rabid fanboys praising everything they do on the other.

[Rolan7]

I almost forgot about the skyworld option in early builds of Minecraft!  Is there a good mod for those?  Certain types of Mystcraft age can be kinda similar, but not really the same...

And yeah timed torches wouldn't be so bad, the idea was that you'd need glowstone (from Hell) for permanent light.  The reliable spawn-blocking property of light sources is stupidly tiny, though...

[itisnotlogical]

Non-permanent torches just seem like tedious maintenance. If you play Minecraft for any length of time you'll soon have more coal than you know what to do with, making re-lighting torches more of an occasional "ugh i have to do this" than a meaningful challenge.

[Rolan7]

It makes glowstone actually important, though...  Coal torches become an early-game stopgap.
That's probably more survival-esque than most people actually want from Minecraft though. 

[Darkmere]

Having to run around every so often to re-establish what you've done is just chores. Can't have fun til you do your chores. Ooop, it's been a while, do your chores! Creeper spawned and blew up your shit because you didn't do your chores!

I don't think there's anything particularly engaging about simple maintenance shit like that.

[miauw62]

Minecraft is just shit in general really. Lanterns would just have been a way to force people to visit the shitty, empty, bland dimension known as the Nether. Featuring THREE WHOLE NEW BLOCK TYPES and lava, and NOTHING ELSE.

One of my peeves: people's need to recreate games... in other games. Splatoon IN MINECRAFT!!! Team Fortress 2 IN MINECRAFT! !!!

I really don't get the appeal of playing a shitty, watered-down version of a game, especially if it's watered down with the overall shittiness of minecraft.

[Rolan7]

I disagree with everything you just said

Having to run around every so often to re-establish what you've done is just chores. Can't have fun til you do your chores. Ooop, it's been a while, do your chores! Creeper spawned and blew up your shit because you didn't do your chores!

I don't think there's anything particularly engaging about simple maintenance shit like that.

Sure, but I'm not talking about a chore.  I'm talking about early game survival, until you get magic forever-light in the form of glowstone.

Besides, Minecraft is made of chores.  Advancing in the game just mitigates them.  Mining with stone is very slow, which iron and diamond (and enchantments) ease.  Smelting ores is a tedious process, but hoppers help (and most mods make the process far easier... with an investment of resources and infrastructure).

Frankly Minecraft sucks at being a survival game.  It's more like an upgrade game, or even an idle game with mods.  But the first few days are designed to be survival-esque, and having mundane torches run out would fit that design philosophy just fine.

[miauw62]

its still not good game design. just because the rest of minecraft is shit doesn't make that idea any less shit.

[MrRoboto75]

Minecraft stops being about survival as soon as you get like 15 iron ingots.  Then the enemies stop actually being a threat.  Multiplying the amount of torches I need by 10 isn't going to make the game any more challenging nor interesting.  Glowstone alone won't make me bother with the ass that is the nether.

In fact, that's what bores me about most "survival" games.  After a certain point, you become so established that survival just stops being any issue.  You won't run out of supplies any time soon, and you're too powerful for most enemies to be threatened by them.  That establishment point in minecraft can be done in about three minecraft days if you actually try.

[Darkmere]

See, there's a difference between doing something to progress and doing something to maintain. There's no "getting better" to running around flipping switches from off to on over and over, like turning torches back on.

Then again, Nether was indeed shit and I got sick of minecraft after about 5 hours so I have no stake in it whatsoever. Terraria was just better at everything that matters.

In fact, that's what bores me about most "survival" games.  After a certain point, you become so established that survival just stops being any issue.  You won't run out of supplies any time soon, and you're too powerful for most enemies to be threatened by them.  That establishment point in minecraft can be done in about three minecraft days if you actually try.

The point you're talking about is Equilibrium. The difference is good survival games let you do something else when you reach equilibrium, like explore or attempt more difficult challenges. Minecraft shuffles you off to Nether for... some reason. Don't Starve just piles more and more tedious maintenance on you to artificially destroy equilibrium.

Cataclysm DDA gives you labs, mycus, army bases, super-science stuff to collect at the endgame. Big difference.

[Rolan7]

Minecraft stops being about survival as soon as you get like 15 iron ingots.  Then the enemies stop actually being a threat.  Multiplying the amount of torches I need by 10 isn't going to make the game any more challenging nor interesting.  Glowstone alone won't make me bother with the ass that is the nether.

In fact, that's what bores me about most "survival" games.  After a certain point, you become so established that survival just stops being any issue.  You won't run out of supplies any time soon, and you're too powerful for most enemies to be threatened by them.  That establishment point in minecraft can be done in about three minecraft days if you actually try.

3 days is generous, even!  You can spend the first day harvesting trees, then dig straight down to bedrock with a cobblestone pick as the sun sets.  If you avoid caverns, which are sorta-kinda dangerous in that they contain enemies which can kill you if you aren't careful enough, you'll *still* probably find diamonds before you run out of wood.

But while I grouse about Minecraft being about survival for only a few days, I kinda love-hate 7 Days To Die.  Because it's... a lot like Minecraft, except that the enemies aren't stopped by a layer of wall and some torches.  It's kinda maddening for me, being so used to establishing safe spaces in Minecraft.  Every night damages my home, and every seventh night is an absolute nightmare.

To make things worse, the spawning rules are pretty complex compared to Minecraft.  I don't think light does jack, it's all about your one bedroll - but certain areas ignore that.  It's very frustrating but I find myself going back to it a lot.