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[Tacomagic]

I have to say, I think I'd prefer DF a little more if food wasn't so easy to come by and more had to (and could be) provided for by trading. I find the abundance of resources and the accompanying abundance of idlers to be somewhat at odds with the idea of industrious creatures striving for their survival.

I suppose there's always the option of playing on a mineral poor world and embarking on a terrifying desert with an aquifer.

Or you could mod raws so everything gives less food.  You might also be able to mod dwarves to need to eat and drink more often, but that starts to change balance in interesting ways (such as starvation and hunger kicking in a lot faster).

There's also a farm mod out there that significantly reduces farming production.  Might be a good place to start for you.  I think I remember seeing it in the optional bits of Modest Mod.

[Ozarck]

I had a feeling I was being too hard on my dwarves. On the other hand, I looked at some of the things they consider to be "work," (eat, sleep, drink) and thought, "nah, they are looking out for themselves just fine."

 I think I will start going easier on them. There are plenty of pieces of furniture to admire, a legendary engraved dining hall, statues, and the like for them to enjoy. Plus, I apparently put this fortress in Happy Happy Love land. In five years, I have had about three snatchers, four kobold thieves, and exactly one siege, composed of eleven goblins and an Olm. No ambushes, no megabeasts. I have lost more dwarves to the vampire than to everything else together. I'll let them chill a bit, until I hit the caverns.

Thanks for all the great responses.

[Witty]

Avoid at all costs. Idlers talk to other idlers and make friends. Dead friends lead to tantrum spirals.

A happy dwarf is an introverted working dwarf!

[Button]

I like idlers. I like to play near necromancer towers, so a good population of idlers = faster cleanup after a siege = less FUN next time the necros attack.

For reference, I like playing with a pop cap of 200-400. (I built my first fortress of note on a coast, with a river, not realizing what a terrible idea that was... ever since then, as long as my fps is over 15 I'm happy.)

[slothen]

Update on my previous stance.  A lot of idlers just reminds me its time to designate the next step of fortresses architecture.  I may have 70 idlers quite often, but I get them all working now and then for good stretches (concurrent mining/masonry projects + reorganizing stockpiles and moving ore).

[Tirion]

Playing Genesis, I just turn key personnel, military included, into bronze, [NOEMOTION] clockworks... so I let idlers idle and make friends, the best worst thing that could happen is a tantrum spiral wiping out the useless parts of the population.

[Urist Mc Dwarf]

I have about 60 for quick hauling pulling. Also, they are all in my military. Every dwarf is.

[Raphite1]

My stance on idlers is a bit wobbly and bowlegged. It's really hard to keep your balance on their shoulders, even if they're just standing around in the meeting hall.

[Ozarck]

My stance on idlers is a bit wobbly and bowlegged. It's really hard to keep your balance on their shoulders, even if they're just standing around in the meeting hall.

I usually have to hang on to a *chandelier*, or lean against a -microcline statue-, at least, if there are only one or two idlers. With twenty or so, it gets a little easier.

[CognitiveDissonance]

^ Ha 

Idlers are important. If you have no idlers, that means that 1) Something isn't getting done or 2) Skilled dwarves are doing all the hauling
Therefore, I try to keep about 20% of my fort as idlers for the various tasks as need arises.

You never know when you need an emergency soap maker...

[evictedSaint]

Whenever I get a new wave of migrants, I go through and nickname them things like, "MINER" or "FARMER" or "ARMORER" for ones that have valuable skills.  For the less-valuable ones, such as our bee-keepers and soap-makers, I nickname them "PEASANTS."

Whenever I initiate the draft or need a particularly dangerous job done, PEASANTS are usually at the top of the list, as they're the most idle most often.

[sweitx]

I generally have my fortress at about 90% duty level (120 dwarfs, about 10 idle at any time). Basically I have nearly ALL labor enabled for a couple dozen "Peons" (like Girlinhat), excluding labors such as miner/woodcutter (conflicting tool setup), hunter (don't want hunters), planters (don't want a lot of small stack plant returns).
Since I'm slightly OCD in keeping my fort clean of loose boulders. So I have a mine-cart based quantum stockpile, which has a feeder stockpile that takes directly from 3 other feeder stone stockpile (this way, I have 9 haulers w/ wheelbarrow hauling stone at all time). I also have a set of siege training + pump operator training room for all peons. If there's a need to haul, I just deactivate the siege engines and pumps to free them up for hauling. Currently working on getting a auto-swimming training system setup http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=124729.0 for those sweet, sweet agility attribute gain.

[JerBear]

then i guess my 270 pop fort with its 170 idler might drive u mad :O
they keep throwing parties left and right in the above-ground walled-off main courtyard .. im fine with it as long as its "light" tile
my fort is pretty lay-back, hell even the military squads are always only half staffed on patrol duty, when not working or patrolling they are free to party.

on the upside i have a row of emergency levers around the courtyard, when they need to be pulled a dwarf will almost always be less than 6 blocks away.

i usually sort through the idlers once in a while in dwarfTherapist for low skilled workers to assign more dangerous jobs to them:
such as hauling stuff outside, smashing through that volcano wall, or change the bed sheets for the commando combat vampire i locked up in the caverns (if u know what i mean)

[Ozarck]

-shudder-

I know what you mean.

[weenog]

I like to have a modest pool of idlers.  Think of them not as Idle, but as Ready.  They're there to react to messes and other events that the other dwarfs are too busy to do.  I think joblessness of 25% or higher is usually a sign that I need to get busier, though.