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[taptap]

hello, my new fortress (2x2 desert embark, aquifer, 7 population cap, 5th year = 17 adults / 20 under-age dwarves, 2 cavern layers, magma at about 60, invaders on / neutral biome) has captured a few goblins and I want to put them to good use (for computing).

1st thing I want to do is a to build a lever that repeatedly triggers upright spikes while being pulled only once to turn on and once more to turn the trap off (obviously this is completely unnecessary, but still). I have a basic idea how I can make a goblin repeatedly triggering the thing, but how do I build it in a way that I can deactivate and reset the whole thing? (I don't want my cavern entrance deadly for the rest of the game.) Bonus: Activation by pressure plate and deactivation by lever. Any help?

[Garath]

try a water chamber, or corridor. I'm too lazy to write it all out, but water sloshing around, triggering a pressure plate every once in a while. And if you want ot off all you have to do is drain the water out

[slothen]

make a second lever that when pulled stops the goblin from triggering the repeater.  Pretty simple.

[taptap]

make a second lever that when pulled stops the goblin from triggering the repeater.  Pretty simple.

Haha, yes. I was thinking the wrong way (removing the goblin from the circuit), when stopping him is enough.

[gchristopher]

Don't forget minecart-based signal generators, too. There's only a few examples out there, so I bet the field's pretty ripe for invention.

I keep wondering if it's possible to make a reusable input device that doesn't require a dwarf to pull a lever. Maybe it'd have to be a non-goblin monster, so you can re-lock a door behind it after it passes through?

[taptap]

Don't forget minecart-based signal generators, too. There's only a few examples out there, so I bet the field's pretty ripe for invention.

I keep wondering if it's possible to make a reusable input device that doesn't require a dwarf to pull a lever. Maybe it'd have to be a non-goblin monster, so you can re-lock a door behind it after it passes through?

I wanted to do goblin-logic. Minecart-logic has to wait (I have to build my first working minecart route first . There have been some designs on the forum and wiki. (This one: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=62798.0 was most helpful.)

P+C^+^C+P should be sufficient to make a simple goblin switch (P is Path, the others are equivalent to the symbols in game, 2 pressure plates linked to the adjacent hatch + any output you want, 3 doors). According to door settings (1 or both outside doors open/unforbidden) this simple design can be player input (you just have to unforbid a door, instead of sending a dwarf to a lever to produce output) or pressure plate / lever input and it can be a high speed switch (no lever pulling) or a repeater. You can also maintain the thing without removing the goblin by forbidding the door in the middle and isolating the goblin in one part (released captured = fleeing goblin doesn't conquer buildings I guess).

To answer my initial question. I guess two goblin switches are needed, the first to activate the trap + starting the repeater (the second element) - I don't know how crucial the involved delay will be, but in principle this should work.

P.S. I just realize that unlike what the wiki page on goblin logic (vasilns pages) says, you can build all logic gates AFTER the pressure plate / hatch (instead of the simple doors in my example). Basically you only allow the goblin to path through it, but not to walk the path much easier to setup than to build a return path.

[taptap]

Improved design:

Code: [Select]

P+C^
    +
P+C^
    +
P+C^

and elsewhere the trap (maybe a different trigger is necessary for forgotten beasts, but you always can trigger it manually)

^BTTTT

C = hatch, T = Trap, P = Path, + = door, B = raising bridge and ^= pressure plate.

The lower two of the legs are a goblin repeater, the first leg is the initial position of the goblin (the door out is forbidden, so no path). When something walks into the trap (the door to the repeater opens and the goblin starts triggering the spikes - the good thing is, that you have no spare safe tile in the trap this way. The pressure plate the goblin stood originally keeps the trap open while he stands on it, but closes it when the goblin left. As the goblin won't return to the origin before you reset the trap manually, you effectively trapped a monster. This is my first computing experience, but I am somewhat proud how small this thing is and that it needs so little processing power (1 goblin).

P.S. Later: I realized the bridge is closed while the goblin stands on the pressure plate (I could make the bridge over a ramp, but then I would leave a safe tile in the trap). Hmm. Guess I need sth. to invert the signal (a NOT-gate?).

[gchristopher]

You can also maintain the thing without removing the goblin by forbidding the door in the middle and isolating the goblin in one part (released captured = fleeing goblin doesn't conquer buildings I guess).

Whoa, seriously? That's the obvious design, but I always assumed that the goblin would capture the center door and you'd lose the ability to keep him on the pressure plate. But, I'd never tried it. Thanks for mentioning that!

[taptap]

You can also maintain the thing without removing the goblin by forbidding the door in the middle and isolating the goblin in one part (released captured = fleeing goblin doesn't conquer buildings I guess).

Whoa, seriously? That's the obvious design, but I always assumed that the goblin would capture the center door and you'd lose the ability to keep him on the pressure plate. But, I'd never tried it. Thanks for mentioning that!

For normal situations you can keep him in place just by giving him only one pathing goal, but I really wondered about maintenance building extra leg with cage trap to neutralize and later redump etc. But in fact it isn't necessary. I don't know however, how they behave if a siege is on the map (I play a small and badly defended fortress w/ natural growth).

[taptap]

Goblin inverter / NOT-gate idea - I feel I need one.

Code: [Select]

   c
pc^cc^cp
    +

all symbols as before (p is path, + door, c hatch, ^pressure plate) - unlike above here we need the additional center hatches and can't do with the simplified variation with a central door - as fenwah, vasiln et al. always do (and we don't have the door which is so convenient for maintenance - well it should be possible to add one in the middle anyway). that gives us two different directions to work with, in the middle all hatches are triggered by adjacent pressure plate, by triggering both the hatch and the door (on the sides) with one pressure plate the goblin in the NOT gate will end left when the pressure plate is open and right when the pressure plate is closed - the right pressure plate can be used for the inverted signal.

[taptap]

Actually building anything with invaders on and low population and too much hauling takes ages... I need to look into minecarts soon.