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Author Topic: Warhammer 40k  (Read 14453 times)

Hanslanda

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #60 on: August 15, 2013, 11:18:32 am »

Indeed. Adding Adrenal Glands and Toxic Sacs to basic gaunts or hormagaunts is a huge waste of points. If you want them to have them, get a Tervigon, give it to the Tervigon. Sure, your hormagaunts can't get them, but they're fucking hormagaunts, point for point one of the most efficient assault units in any army.

Also, tricking out the MCs is neat to think about and all, but they're already PROHIBITIVELY expensive points wise, much better to stick to the bare bones requirements.
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Hanslanda

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #61 on: August 23, 2013, 02:48:15 pm »

Just started painting for the first time ever. For the basic troopers, I started off with the horrible idea of going black, then layer of green overtop. Can't tell it at all, might as well just stick to black and do detail highlights. Color the claws, fangs, tongue, etc. Got a genestealer with ushtabi bone claws, with very very dry brushed mephiston red overtop. Good effect, overall. Doesn't look like the 'blood on mah clawz' that a lot of people might go for, rather it looks like the claws themselves are that color. Started working on varying ideas, such as putting some gray between the ribs of the 'stealer, which looked like crap, so I nixed that idea. I've got another nine or so to perfect the coloring before I tackle my Broodlord, then move onto the gaunts to get an idea how to paint the Tyrant and Warriors. The Tyrannofex I will save for last, and perhaps paint it rather more spectacularly, with a lot more bright highlights. Keep it from being garish, whilst also being attention getting, to add to that natural desire, "SHOOT AT THE BIG ONE."

It's rather useless against tanks, and the templates it fires are GREAT against infantry, but it has no AP capability, so I might have to think about getting more Genestealers or maybe Warriors with Boneswords. We'll see.
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Rolepgeek

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #62 on: August 23, 2013, 08:23:43 pm »

Actually, I did something very similar with my Kroot. Everything got an undercoat of black, and I mixed a light green color for their skin, since they're meant to be my Kroot Boyz. I haven't painted anything else on them, but it looks quite good even with just 2 colors. It's probably just the color-combos and way the models themselves look.
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Hanslanda

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #63 on: August 23, 2013, 09:27:54 pm »

Kroot are such an interesting race, I sort of wish they had their own entire army codex. I mean, every First Founding Space Marine Chapter that didn't get shit on by GW (Read: Iron Hands, Raven Guard, White Scars) has their own Codex, so why not some of the other races, like Kroot. I would also like to see some fluff xenos brought into play, such as the Hrud and Lacrymole.
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Chaoswizkid

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #64 on: August 23, 2013, 10:40:39 pm »

Just wanted to post that there's some freeware something-or-other that came out before Roll20 that allowed for multiplayer RPG stuff with designed maps and whatnot. A WH40k pack was available, and people were able to play WH40k matches online, for free. Not as cool as irl with miniatures, but I figured I'd throw it out there. Sorry that I can't remember what the program was called.
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Rolepgeek

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #65 on: August 23, 2013, 11:04:54 pm »

IT was called Vassal.
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Parsely

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #66 on: August 26, 2013, 02:50:43 pm »

I want to make a Gorkamorka forum game. How to?

Namely, how do I write orks? What kinda stuff do I need to know about them and the setting to make the characters, items, weapons, vehicles, etc. proper and orky?
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nenjin

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #67 on: August 26, 2013, 03:42:53 pm »

I want to make a Gorkamorka forum game. How to?

Namely, how do I write orks? What kinda stuff do I need to know about them and the setting to make the characters, items, weapons, vehicles, etc. proper and orky?

Well, first off, Orks in 40k talk like drunken Pikies. Bad, horrifically accented gutter english. "Oi, wutz deez 'umans doin?" You can have more or less of that as you prefer, but, Orks are basically modeled after British Soccer Hooligans according to GWS.

Secondly, and probably most important of all, is the concept of MOAR DAKKA. More firepower, more bullets, bigger noises, basically an entire race that operates the same way Michael Bay thinks. Orks believe that the color red makes vehicles and planes go faster. The bigger, the faster, the louder, the more dangerous it is, the more Orks like it.

Third, is improvisation and adaptability. Orks don't make anything "new." What they do is cannibalize the things other races make. So their weapons and vehicles and space ships and power armor are all "folk crafted." By that I mean, they're effective but basic, ramshackle and unreliable. Armor is thick and heavy and made of other bits of armor. Guns are loud and violent and high rate of fire but they jam or explode a lot. Vehicles are cobbled together from derelict tanks and troop transports. Rok Space Fortresses are literally chunks of other ships rammed into giant asteroids and wired together (using totally unexplained Orky technology) so they work. Structures are built out of shot up Flak Board, burnt and twisted sections of steel and anything else they can bolt together to make a wall. No thing made by Orks is consistent, each and every one is different in some way. Or "Kustom" as they like to call it.

Fourth is their mindset. Orks are basically a primitive, tribal culture. Bosses are those that are the biggest, the toughest, have the biggest tusks, the most spikes on their armor, have crushed the most of their foes ect... Whether you're dealing with Feral (completely non-technological orks who grew up on a planet with zero contact with other races or other orks) or Space Orks, they still basically organize and operate as tribes and clans. Following the above, Orks also rarely settle down and live sedentary lives. They live for war, bloodshed and conquest. Feral orks trapped on a planet will happily make war on each other if there's no one else to fight with. It's not a conscious thing, orks are simply wired for destruction. This isn't to say Orks are stupid. Their not smart but they are crafty as long as it relates to something dealing with war.

Fifth is related to the third but only somewhat. Orks are one of the universe's greatest species, and here's why. They can thrive almost anywhere, in almost any environment with next to no technological assitance. Sub-zero world of ice floating on a methane sea? No problem. Volcanic hell scape where the air is 50% toxic fumes? It's like a holiday getaway for orks. An Asteroid fortress floating in space with intermittent life support and power? To the Orks it's a Rolls Royce. They simply don't give a fuck about most of the things that pose dire hazards to other races. Even if it IS fatal to them, they'll just spawn more orks to replace the ones they lost. About the only things completely lethal to orks are: the vaccum of space and being totally disintegrated. Orks, when they feel pain, tend to not register it. They'll happily survive losing an arm, a leg or more and keep fighting. They don't feel sorry for themselves, think about the future very much or have long-term goals beyond making war. When Orks find there's no enemies left to fight, they either go find new ones or start fighting each other.

Sixth is their relation to the Warp. Orks don't create impressions in the Warp like most other sentient races. That doesn't make them immune to the warp by any means, but it does have some noticeable consequences. For one, Orks don't worry about being taken over by daemons, they simply can't be. Second, they're hard to "read" via the warp. Their thoughts are alien and don't leave warp signatures that psykers can read very well. You can't prognosticate on them, get a sense of what they're thinking or communicate with them telepathically. You can't manipulate their thoughts or reorder their minds. Third is that their use of the Warp is highly destructive and random because their use of isn't learned so much as felt. Which is why an Ork Weirdboy Psyker is as likely to fry a regiment of Imperial Guard with their powers as their own mob.

And lastly, I guess, is the concept of WWAAAAAAAGGGGGGHHHHH. Waaaggghhh is basically Ork morale. It gets stronger the more orks are around. A single ork may be ornery and dangerous on his own...but basically they're still primitives at heart and kind of cowardly. But get 50 of their boyz next to them, and there is no risk they won't take, no enemy too tough, no objective too difficult, no death too grisly. It's been said of 40k Orks that the only reason they haven't dominated the galaxy yet is their inability to unify and keep the WWWWAAAAAAGGGGHHHH endlessly going. This isn't like Chinese Communism or any real sense of community; it's more like what happens when a mob turns into a riot. The times Orks pose a real threat to the galaxy is when a strong enough Warboss can gather enough clans together to make war on an epic scale. WWAAAAGGGGHHHHs of that sort can last decades before enough orks die or leaders die that the WAAAGGGGGHHHH peters out. While it's going, Orks in a WAAAAGGGGGHHHH just sweep through galaxy, leaving fire and ruin in their wake.

One example of Ork tech I like is from a 40k novel I read. These guys are trying to drive an Ork wagon, which was refitted from an Imperial troop transport. The steering is so heavy that a normal human can barely manage to keep it going straight without dislocating their shoulder. The shifting likewise grinds gears horribly and requires brute force to use. The truck is stinky and full of unvented exhaust and rusted through body panels. The truck accelerates so hard it's enough to give a normal, unprepared person whiplash. There's no modern conventions like glass for the windows, heaters, air conditioning or any of that, because Orks just don't give a fuck. And then the vehicle later on unexpectedly dies on them.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 05:48:05 pm by nenjin »
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kaian-a-coel

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #68 on: August 26, 2013, 05:33:45 pm »

I'll add some pseudo-science on that. Some imperial scientists are so baffled by ork "teknology" that they made an hypothesis, according to which ork stuff works because orks believe it does. If operated by any non-ork, ork tech just plain doesn't work.
The main example of this is that red-painted ork vehicles DO go faster. In the tabletop, at least in the codex I read, ork vehicles got an option reading like that: "red paint: can go 1 inch further." (out of 6-12).

Orks work on instinct. For everything, including tech and strategy. Their technology is genetically hard-wired. Ork themselves understand nothing of their own technology. They do it by instinct, and it totally works. It's like feral predators: wolves aren't smart per se, but hardwired pack instinct make them dangerous predators. Same for orks. They are really dumb, but have hardwired WAR instincts making them a dangerous force on the battlefield.

On the topic of reproduction, as far as I'm aware they reproduce asexually via spores. Whenever an ork dies, his corpse spread spores all over the place, giving birth to fungi, squigs, snotlings, and more orks. Which is why ork infestations are more or less permanent.

As for Psychic stuff, I do believe they have a warp "footprint", but not an individual one as humans and eldar do, rather a collective one. That's why ork psykers (the bizarboyz) are more powerful when there's more orks around: they tap into the collective pool.

Also of note, orks don't age. They got bigger and stronger the longer they fight.

Scientifically speaking, all of this makes the orks somewhat halfway between humans and tyranids. And since the orks were crafted by the Old Ones to fight back the Necrons, this led me to believe that the Tyranids may be a Superweapon from the remaining Old Ones, having fled into the interstellar void and pushing the metaphorical "reset button" for the galaxy. Hinting on that direction is the fact that the Squigs, iconic orkish pet/warbeast/meal/whatever used to be a tyranid organism (this part of the stuff was later retconned, the squigs are now 100% ork stuff). On the other hand, it is implied rather heavily that the Tau's evolution was artificial, which makes all of it even more complicated.
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Parsely

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #69 on: August 26, 2013, 05:48:07 pm »

Tell me more about specific kinds of Space Orks, as well as the average population of each in the standard Space Ork clan. I'm not interested in Feral Orks right now.

How long does it take different kinds of orks to grow? What do they eat?
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GiglameshDespair

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #70 on: August 26, 2013, 05:52:11 pm »

Its also important to rememberr that orks sort of have circular logic in their toughness (tuffness). A strong ork is bigger than other boys, so he rises to prominence. As he's risen to prominence, he'll get bigger and stronger. The ork belief in their gods, Gork and Mork, literally created them and they are now the two strongest gods in the WH40k setting. In the fluff, the Imperium diverted the Tyranid fleet leviathan into the ork empire of octavius. As a consequence of such heavy, constant fighting, the orks have gone much larger and stronger and the tyranids are evolving new, more deadly combat forms based on ork dna.

Orks grow very quickly from spores. Orks eat mainly squigs, which also grow from spores, though they also photosynthesise and can eat other things. The spores are released on death and may lie in the ground for years. You know what, here: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Orkoid_physiology
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nenjin

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #71 on: August 26, 2013, 06:03:02 pm »

At this point I feel it's necessary to give the standard 40k canon disclaimer: there is no canon, and for every truth there's at least one novel or fluff piece that says the opposite. Everything everyone has said is completely correct. But, for example, people can pick up most Ork weapons and shoot them (albeit badly and probably with a couple broken bones from the recoil.) So while kaian-a-coel is completely correct, people generally can't make Orky tech work, there are exceptions. Anything based on combustion engines or basic gun technology is fair game. Ork warp engines? Forget about it. Like he said. Orks don't understand that compression is what makes an internal combustion engine work. But they can build those engines and make them work as though they were born to it. Every Ork is basically a shade tree mechanic. Even Ferals show a surprising knack for tools and weaponry.

Quote
Tell me more about specific kinds of Space Orks, as well as the average population of each in the standard Space Ork clan. I'm not interested in Feral Orks right now.

Your average clan like the Bad Sunz or what have you? Millions. Billions. More than can be possibly counted. I want to say I read somewhere that Orks are the most numerous species in the 40k universe.

Space Orks, there's a lot of info out there. The Ork types are honestly based off the table top wargames more than anything. You've got your Warboss, which might be anything from a chief of a small band all the way up to this badass.

From there are Orks are generally specialists, until you hit the bottom ranks which are just "Boyz." So you have Shootas, Choppas, Storm Boyz(Orks w/ Jump Packs), Fly Boyz (Orks flying planes), and on and on. There are a couple? actually racially different Orks, but I may be getting my 40k and Fantasy confused. Are there still Black Orks in 40k? Either way, they're just bigger and meaner.

As far as clans go, they can be as big or as small as you need them to be. "Clans" is the overarching term for the largest organizations. There is no real "King Ork" although occasionally different memorable Warbosses have almost filled that role. Beneath clans there are warbands and tribes and smaller and smaller demarcations. Why they're together, why they're organized that way, is beyond my Orky knowledge. But generally Orks will follow a stronger Ork on the promise of "sumfin ta clobber." You'd have to go back to Fantasy to probably find the roots of the different Ork clans. In 40k I think they're loosely organized around either figures, activities (I think the Speed Killz Clan is all about the vehicles) or WAAAAGGGGGHHHHs.

Orks will eat virtually anything. As was said, Squiggs are their primary food source. The life cycle of the Ork is much debated in 40k fluff. I believe I've heard one theory that basically all things Ork: Spores, Squiggs, Snotlings, actual Orks.....are all the same life form. They all spring from the same basic spore. So the theory is that a Squigg is really an undeveloped Ork, or a branch in the same family tree. So that technically makes Orks cannibals. Which is very Orky. There is a wealth of info out there about the Ork life cycle.

Just like Space Marines, Orks are designed to survive. So while they like to eat, they don't need three squares a day. They can go a long, long time without real nourishment. Being hungry just makes them pissier. They're resistant to just about everything: temperature, radiation, gases, poisons, toxins. I think they even take longer to drown. Basically the only things they aren't at least partially resistant to are acid, a complete vaccum, the offensive power of the warp and brain death. And their skulls are quite thick. I can also easily believe an badass Ork getting blasted out of an airlock could survive at least a little while out there, way longer than a Human.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 06:12:24 pm by nenjin »
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Parsely

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #72 on: August 26, 2013, 06:10:24 pm »

Well I knew that clans are really big, but could you help me quantify the numbers? It's a forum game after all, and I'd like there to be a semblance of progression. Think small clan crashes on planet.

If all orks can just build stuff, what are mek boyz for?
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kaian-a-coel

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #73 on: August 26, 2013, 06:16:49 pm »

I want to say somewhere that Orks are the most numerous species in the 40k universe. 
Second most, tyranids just outnumber the galaxy a million to one, accounting for every living being either side.

And their skulls are quite thick. 
I remember an illustration of a trepannated ork.
Spoiler: Here it is (click to show/hide)

Well I knew that clans are really big, but could you help me quantify the numbers? It's a forum game after all, and I'd like there to be a semblance of progression. Think small clan crashes on planet.

If all orks can just build stuff, what are mek boyz for?
Nobody knows. No non-ork can feasibly count an ork clan without being killed, and the ork themselves can't count that far. "Small clan" can go from a couple hundred/thousands to a couple millions. If you want a planet crash, a Rok is in order. It's basically an emptied asteroid filled with orks.
All orks can build stuff, some are just better at it. Think tony stark mixed with Hulk.
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nenjin

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Re: Warhammer 40k
« Reply #74 on: August 26, 2013, 06:21:31 pm »

Well I knew that clans are really big, but could you help me quantify the numbers? It's a forum game after all, and I'd like there to be a semblance of progression. Think small clan crashes on planet.

If all orks can just build stuff, what are mek boyz for?

They have a better feel for tek than your average Ork, and are generally at least as interested in fooling with tek as they are with clobberin. While any Ork can probably get a broken Imperial vehicle working, it takes a Mek Boy to build something like a Killa Can.

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Well I knew that clans are really big, but could you help me quantify the numbers?

Numbers in the 40k universe in general are hard to provide for most races. Space Marines are the only ones that really get to say "Yes, we have 1000 Marines or less in our Chapter."

I guess I'll say this.

10 Orks is a small band, the remnants of a tribe or mob.

100 Orks is a small population, a small tribe, a small mob or maybe an elite battle force.

1000 Orks is small battle force, a big tribe.

10,000 is a respectable small army, and where I think you'd start thinking at the Clan level.

100,000 is an actual army.

1,000,000 is where the fluff likes to put their number for dramatic effect. Worlds with this many Feral Orks on them are not uncommon in the universe.

10,000,000 is enough to flatten a defended Imperial world. One Rok could easily carry this many.

100,000,000 is enough to wreck a whole system. These are the kinds of numbers you'd hear bandied about in stuff like the Wars for Armageddon.

1,000,000,000 in one battle or sector would be something that would go down in the annals of 40k history, as that many Orks pursuing the same objective is something to truly worry about.

Now that I think about it....maybe it's kind of a form of Imperial racism to assume every Ork is mechanically talented. Just like the real life stereotype that all Asians have talent in mathematics.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 06:35:12 pm by nenjin »
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When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
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