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[MoridinUK]

Ok So I'm going to use this thread to ask advice on how to do things in my first Evil Fortress.  I may link it to a community thread about my fort!

Here is my first question, I have blood gnats in my fort.  I believe these are surface creatures.  How do I get rid of them?  I'm not sure how they got in.  I have a single downstair entrance, which is walled off from the surroundings and has a hatch cover on it.  The Hatch is not currently closed/locked as my garbage dump and atom smasher are up there.  Did the Gnats come in via the hatch?

I guess they must have, unless they came up through a cavern before I covered that with a hatch but I thought them surface dwellers?

I'm also currently building a trade depot air lock.  I'm not sure how effective it will be but there you go.  Should I am to build a set of these near the map edges to get caravans out of the wilds asap?  Also how to route caravans to the airlocks?  I guess I need to have a depot accessible in each one?

Could I build a set of tunnels 3 wide from the one central depot to the map edges, each ending with a bridge?  (The depot also kept separate to the main fort) that way the caravan can enter it quickly and I can close the bridges at once? 

I need to read up on the wiki about the ai and pathing to see if the bad guys will try to wonder down the tunnels to the depot when the caravan is not on the map.

[Fluoman]

I think blood gnats are vermin, and vermin randomly spawn and disappear, completely disregarding path to the inside of your fortress (also, traps and water/magma flooded halls won't stop them).

Also, you could use a trick to make your Depot access invader-safe. The route to your fortress can be constrained by walls in such a fashion:

Code: [Select]

W..W..W..W
..........
..........
..........
W..W..W..WRepeat the motif with Walls or Traps or Channels and only the central "road" is Wagon-accessible: elves will spawn everywhere, but other traders will spawn only where they have access to the Depot.

[Merendel]

Boxing in a smallish 3 wide path with raised bridges against the edge of the embark that leads into a tunnel to your depot also works for keeping caravans relatively safe in evil bioms.  as long as thats the only available path to the depot they will always spawn in that one spot while invaders still have the whole map edge to spawn on makeing it unlikely for them to land in just the right spot to enter the tunnel.   Tad exploity but its what I do if I want to ensure the carvan's get under cover ASAP particularly before my military can protect them.

[MoridinUK]

Boxing in a smallish 3 wide path with raised bridges against the edge of the embark that leads into a tunnel to your depot also works for keeping caravans relatively safe in evil bioms.  as long as thats the only available path to the depot they will always spawn in that one spot while invaders still have the whole map edge to spawn on makeing it unlikely for them to land in just the right spot to enter the tunnel.   Tad exploity but its what I do if I want to ensure the carvan's get under cover ASAP particularly before my military can protect them.

So you would have a tunnel 3 wide from depot to map edge, with a bridge that raises at the end?  Wall the tunnel entrance to with in 3 tiles of the map edge, so a wagon can only reach the depot from that area?

Code: [Select]

= - Wall/rock
T - Tunnel
D - Depot
< - ramp
* - map edge
... - break until near map edge
z-1
======
DDDDD=====...=====
DDDDDTTTTT...TTT<=
DDDDDTTTTT...TTT<=
DDDDDTTTTT...TTT<=
DDDDD=====...=====
======
z=0 

        *
 ====== *
<       *
<       *
<       *
 ====== *
        *

But with a bridge thrown in to cut off once the traders are inside?  And another on the Fort side of the depot naturally?

[slothen]

I think blood gnats are vermin, and vermin randomly spawn and disappear, completely disregarding path to the inside of your fortress (also, traps and water/magma flooded halls won't stop them).

I've been told this isn't the whole story.  Vermin that blink in and out are tracked on some level even while invisible.  I agree though that you won't be able to keep vermin out of your food stores entirely.

[JTTCOTE1]

@Moridin:
No. If there is only one valid spawn location for a wagon that will allow it to reach the depot, it will always spawn there. However, you can't build walls within five blocks of the map edge. So you connect your depot to 5 blocks away from the edge in a 3 wide tunnel with walls (and a roof once you have the resources, fliers are annoying). Then use raised bridges AS WALLS for those last five blocks. Raised drawbridges function as walls and so the caravan will always spawn in that area.
= is wall
B is raised drawbridge
D is depot
W is the only valid location for caravan wagons to spawn
======
DDDDD===================BBBBB
DDDDD                                            WWW
DDDDD                                            WWW
DDDDD                                            WWW
DDDDD===================BBBBB
======

[MoridinUK]

I see! Thanks for that!  Not sure if I feel this is a little too gamey.  But I'll see.  I may build it in desperation!

[MoridinUK]

Floor hatches, can the bad guys get a los through them if they are not tightly closed.  In otherwords, if I set on as passable and not tightly closed will the bad guys (zombie boars) immediately start towards it to get inside, or do they need to see a dwarf on the surface before giving chase?  I seriously need more wood!

Thanks for the help!

[crossmr]

Boxing in a smallish 3 wide path with raised bridges against the edge of the embark that leads into a tunnel to your depot also works for keeping caravans relatively safe in evil bioms.  as long as thats the only available path to the depot they will always spawn in that one spot while invaders still have the whole map edge to spawn on makeing it unlikely for them to land in just the right spot to enter the tunnel.   Tad exploity but its what I do if I want to ensure the carvan's get under cover ASAP particularly before my military can protect them.

If 90% of caravans didn't spawn at or shortly before/after sieges/ambushes I wouldn't think about making an exploit like this. But it seems almost every year when diplomats and caravans show up, they're almost always accompanied by sieges or ambushers.
and most of the time diplomats don't bring guards, so they're always killed.

[vanatteveldt]

@Moridin:
No. If there is only one valid spawn location for a wagon that will allow it to reach the depot, it will always spawn there. However, you can't build walls within five blocks of the map edge. So you connect your depot to 5 blocks away from the edge in a 3 wide tunnel with walls (and a roof once you have the resources, fliers are annoying). Then use raised bridges AS WALLS for those last five blocks. Raised drawbridges function as walls and so the caravan will always spawn in that area.

Wouldn't it be a lot easier to put the depot in the soil layer and mine a 3-wide tunnel to the edge of the map, ramp up, and then only wall off the part near the map edge?

You can't block flyers in the last five tiles, so you might want to put a drawbridge over the ramp as well, to close the tunnel if needed.

[MoridinUK]

I've no idea what I'm going to do with these tunnels.. they are pathing like crazy to get around aquifers.. sigh...

I have an unrelated question, any advice on how to stop people picking up a barrel from a stockpile to do a job?   My farmers pick up a barrel containing all my plants (fort is still small) to go harvesting, which interrupts the jobs of others that suddenly have no workable item available?

I don't want to have to turn off barrels for the stockpiles.  I already have them in small stockpile accepting only one product at a time!

Edit: and how do I stop the loom auto setting collect web jobs when I open my hatchway?

[joeclark77]

Edit: and how do I stop the loom auto setting collect web jobs when I open my hatchway?

(o) for "standing orders"
(W) for "workshop orders"
then I can't remember which button but it toggles "auto-collect webs"

[cdombroski]

I have an unrelated question, any advice on how to stop people picking up a barrel from a stockpile to do a job?   My farmers pick up a barrel containing all my plants (fort is still small) to go harvesting, which interrupts the jobs of others that suddenly have no workable item available?

I don't want to have to turn off barrels for the stockpiles.  I already have them in small stockpile accepting only one product at a time!

Make a feeder stockpile with barrels turned off, and have the final destination piles only accept items from links. It won't completely stop the barrel migration, but if the feeder and destination stockpiles are close together, it should significantly reduce the distance the barrels travel.

[MoridinUK]

Thanks for the tips on stockpiles...

Ok so crazy question, does ore die when dropped a long distance, I mean over 50 z levels and could it break the surface it finally hits?

[crossmr]

I have an unrelated question, any advice on how to stop people picking up a barrel from a stockpile to do a job?   My farmers pick up a barrel containing all my plants (fort is still small) to go harvesting, which interrupts the jobs of others that suddenly have no workable item available?

I don't want to have to turn off barrels for the stockpiles.  I already have them in small stockpile accepting only one product at a time!

Make a feeder stockpile with barrels turned off, and have the final destination piles only accept items from links. It won't completely stop the barrel migration, but if the feeder and destination stockpiles are close together, it should significantly reduce the distance the barrels travel.

There is a benefit to this though. If a person has to pick up many items , they will actually pick up multiple items with the container. I suddenly realized the point of this when my dwarves were cleaning up a siege.
The guy took the bin out, and picked up several pieces of clothes before going back to the stockpile.
Yes it's stupid when it's just one item, but generally there is a purpose.