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Author Topic: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?  (Read 1309 times)

Id Utalrisen

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Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« on: May 17, 2013, 12:10:38 am »

This is something that has been bothering me for a bit. Do the undead get progressively weaker, after dying again? I'm in an undead biome, and I'm wondering if it's worth waiting for my weapon traps to break the undead into increasingly smaller pieces, or dumping their bodies after the first death.

What factors into undead strength? (Example: An entact Troll, vs just his undead hair and hands)
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evictedSaint

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2013, 12:58:48 am »

They do not get weaker, only more numerous.

Loud Whispers

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2013, 03:52:02 am »

By making them smaller you reduce their size, and as all natural attacks are treated as having the full weight of whatever's behind them crashing down on your Dwarves, this is a plus.

They do not get weaker, only more numerous.

This on the other hand, is the terrifying drawback.

Gentlefish

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2013, 04:11:46 am »

I'm afraid the "smaller piece" thing is false, at least when it comes to combat. How else can Yak Hair push in the brains of dwarves? Bits of an animal have the same combat size of the full animal which makes things like that scary.

Loud Whispers

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2013, 04:15:04 am »

I'm afraid the "smaller piece" thing is false, at least when it comes to combat. How else can Yak Hair push in the brains of dwarves? Bits of an animal have the same combat size of the full animal which makes things like that scary.
Nah, if you cut its hands and head off you've got a head and two hands to deal with, but no body or legs.
Undead get massive strength bonuses though and it doesn't take long for hundreds of undead to quickly overpower even the most hardy of Dwarves.

Psieye

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2013, 06:03:33 am »

Short answer: no they don't get weaker upon re-death. That's going to be changed next version when pulping comes in, but right now they come back at exactly the same stats as before if you carefully beat them up to death without amputation. If you did amputate, you just made them more annoying.

"Yak Hair" means "hair from the whole body", thus is like a full body undead that you can't amputate (based on my limited experience with them). Don't be fooled by "oh it's just hair" or "oh it's just skin", it thinks it's a full body.
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Deus Asmoth

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2013, 06:41:58 am »

Skin is much easier to deal with than hair though, because you're still able to cut the head off, even if it is empty.
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laularukyrumo

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2013, 04:57:00 pm »

In my experience, you can indeed chop pieces of hair off. This is useful because it allows you to get more units of animal hair thread, which is the only thing I ever use for suturing.

There is, of course, the problem of spinning the pieces before they get back up.
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Black_Legion

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Re: Do undead get weaker upon redeath?
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2013, 05:28:07 pm »

The only really noticeable way that an undead creature gets weaker after you kill it is that it retains the damage it sustained until it decided it was "dead". What was originally a whole troll corpse, becomes, a troll corpse with its left leg, right arm, and head gone... and a new zombie/skeletal troll head, arm, and legs to play with as well.

The conundrum is that as you tear apart one undead you only end up making smaller, and less "deadly", undead pieces. Unfortunately as it stands right now burning or dousing it with magma, which you would expect to be useful and/or dorfy, actually just sets it on fire perpetually until you kill it by either pummeling it to death (giving a chance to set your own dwarves aflame) or shoot it from afar with bolts... there are a few fixes floating around to help with this though.
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