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[Vector]

Second of all, "who will you use your intellect on in RVS" is not the same thing as "give me a ranked target list and gameplan for the entire game."  Don't blow things out of proportion.  You're being jumpy and overreactive over a question-dodge, and that's not good.

I dont understand this part, could you please explain?

You were asked:

Lenglon- You are now officially scum  Your intelligence is a great asset. Who will you use it in this RVS?

You responded:

Haha, ok, um, presupposing I were scum, I'd try to act as much like I would as town as possible. Any differences would be scumtells. I might even flat refuse to open the scumchat, simply because if having the scumchat changed my gameplay then that would be a scumtell.

This doesn't answer the question he asked.  So when I pressed you on not answering his question, you write:

the reason I didn't answer his question directly is quite frankly, this early in the game all someone can do is act on basic general principals, if he'd given me a more complicated situation I'd give a longer answer. Unless you're asking for me to provide a ranked target list and gameplan for the entire mafia game? i'd be willing to do this, but for my sanity, please name a hypothedical scumbuddy for me, and tell me which one of us is supposedly the role cop. I'm to lazy to bother writeing out a giant GRAND MASTER PLAN for every single possible combination, and anything that far-reaching would require customization to the specific situation.

I asked you to answer a simple question that pertained only to RVS; you could have listed any name and been done.  You replied by saying you weren't going to provide a "grand master plan" for every possible combination.  This is a clear overreaction to the question posed, and to the miniscule amount of pressure I put on you.

Hell, you could have just said "Whoops, I misread the question.  I'd use it on Griffionday."  Or you could have said "Yeah, I didn't know, so I didn't give him what he asked.  Is that okay?"  But instead you jumped a mile up into the air.

Vector: Why aren't you asking any RVS questions... at all? don't you want to get a read on the other players?

. . .

Lenglon, why aren't you answering his question?

Why aren't you focused on this BM?

Third of all, does my answer to your RVS question do anything helpful for you?

What have you learned from me?

Do you honestly think you're going to make anyone worried about your line of questions if you're completely clear about how they're supposed to react, and that you're not interested in killing anyone, and that you're playing defensively from the get-go?

How exactly is this pro-town, and how will it help you get a clear read?

Nice try, scumbucket.

[Lenglon]

interesting dodge there, those arn't RVS questions, those are pressure questions. You arn't interested in getting a read on most players, you're interested in how the player with the most RVS votes on them reacts to being pressured, and you dont care about anyone else. I dont see you trying to get a read on the other people here, I see you poking at the first easy target.

so once again, I ask you:

Vector: Why dont you want to get a read on any of the other players? Where are the RVS questions?

[Vector]

RVS stands for "random voting stage."  In general, one doesn't want to be random.  When possible, one wants to be systematic, and luckily for me, I managed to find some people behaving in an unusual way.  So no, I'm not participating in voting randomly and asking about folks' favorite ice cream flavors and scumteams and who's scary and so on.  I'm playing for real, which is something one should do as soon as possible.

Furthermore, you assume that only observation that perturbs the system is valid.  The phrase "getting reads" comes from the idea of "reading."  There is stuff to read here.  I am reading it, and learning from it.  In fact, I have reads on every player that has posted thus far.

But more than that, sometimes one wants to sit back and observe players in their natural habitats.  You can get more data sometimes from scum that feel safe than scum that feel worried.

[Lenglon]

Well then, good for you. mind sharing what you've got then?

[Vector]

Oh, and another thing:

You're asking "why are you paying attention to me?  Why won't you pester more than me and Shinigami_King?"  That's scummy and deflective.

Now, I have a question for you.  Why did you react like that to my vote?

Well then, good for you. mind sharing what you've got then?

You should be able to figure out what I think from how I've been playing.

[RangerCado]

Back and holy this is an active day 1. First, forgotten RVS:

Demdemeh: How much experiance do you have playing mafia?Answers to questions:

Shinigami: Prevalent may be an overstatement. Caution will be my greatest ally against you. You handled yourself well last game and i know that taking what you say at face value will not help me unless i know you are town. Your a cunning person so i have to watch what you say carefully, and fully.

Lenglon: I would not counter claim until about mid-day. Analiyzing what they say while everyone thinks its the only claim could help me build a case against them. I would inspect the player who took my side the most that night assuming he, the fake claimer, and i all survived.

Griff: I think i would target the player mister tunneler was after and see what happens. If no NK occurs, i have either saved my target, or stopped the NKer. (jailer blocks a player trying to NK right?) I would be suspicious of both of them. If all three of us survive the night and following day, I would target the tunneler and if no NK occured again, go after him. If an NK did happen, i would go after the tunneled player. This is all assuming that the NKs killed vanilla townies.

Griffon: Day 1 lynches have the highest probability of being a mis-lynch. They do provide information depending on their flip and their cases get a little more power if they had some points in them. Lynching either a very obvious scummy player or a lurker day 1 is usually the best option as it hurts the town the least. (unless its a town power role which just leads to facepalm and annoyance)
Questions/Banter:

Vector:

I'm willing to bet that Shinigami_King is your scumbuddy (or one of the folks who hasn't yet posted) -snip-

This seems a little quick to judge. Considering the odds of that happening, (1 in 18 or 27(i hate probability) this seems quite out there. especially when you haven't questioned anyone except Lenglon himself. Why so quick to the trigger?

PPE- Okay, you have a point now for going after Lenglon so much, and why your not questioning others.

Lenglon: The dodge would be scummy if it weren't for the sheer fact that she's right. You have 6 questions from her that you obviously have read and not answered. If you answered them and then pointed out the dodge, your post would have some merit. Failing to do this just makes you look scummy.

[Vector]

Vector:

I'm willing to bet that Shinigami_King is your scumbuddy (or one of the folks who hasn't yet posted) -snip-

This seems a little quick to judge. Considering the odds of that happening, (1 in 18 or 27(i hate probability) this seems quite out there. especially when you haven't questioned anyone except Lenglon himself. Why so quick to the trigger?

Lenglon: The dodge would be scummy if it weren't for the sheer fact that she's right. You have 6 questions from her that you obviously have read and not answered. If you answered them and then pointed out the dodge, your post would have some merit. Failing to do this just makes you look scummy.

Folks may have missed some of this, but two of those questions were for Shinigami_King.  I have also been questioning him, and Lenglon has addressed a couple of my queries.

But Cado, here's my question to you: what is the purpose of your third vote on Lenglon?

[Lenglon]

again with dodging the question. how hard is it, really, to back up what you're saying? you said you had reads on everyone who had posted, and was gathering so much data you dont even need to ask any questions! Prove It.

why did i react like that to your vote? your vote was meaningless, I reacted to your questions. and you seem to think that it's odd for me to over-answer questions. i suggest you take a look at my posting history. my past posts should speak for themselves.
PPE:

Lenglon: The dodge would be scummy if it weren't for the sheer fact that she's right. You have 6 questions from her that you obviously have read and not answered. If you answered them and then pointed out the dodge, your post would have some merit. Failing to do this just makes you look scummy.

6 questions... what? ranger, those are reposts of old questions that I already answered. if a new one was slipped into the pack please point it out.

[Vector]

Oh, I see.  You're just naturally histrionic, jumpy, and nervous.  You weren't reacting to my vote!  Just my incredibly aggressive questions.

I'm not dodging your questions.  I'm trying to help you learn something here, rather than spoon-feeding you information.  But whatever.  Here you are, you silly person.

    RangerCado - third vote without any questions, slightly worried.  Neutral, lean-noob.
    Griffionday - probably town, but I'll press him later today or the beginning of D2.
    Lenglon - probably scum.
    Cheesecake - needs to post.
    griffinpup - town.
    Demdemeh - needs to post.
    Shinigami_King - Acting strange.  Either new town or scum, I think, lean scum.
    Captain Ford - needs to post.

[Griffionday]

Lenglon:
You totally missed my questions to you here, did you forget that I'm still voting for you?

To repeat myself:

Lenglon- You are now officially scum  Your intelligence is a great asset. Who will you use it in this RVS?

Haha, ok, um, presupposing I were scum, I'd try to act as much like I would as town as possible. Any differences would be scumtells. I might even flat refuse to open the scumchat, simply because if having the scumchat changed my gameplay then that would be a scumtell.

That's an unusually long and convoluted answer to a question that boils down to "How do you plan on being intelligent this game?"  You also seem to be obsessed with playing as town as apposed to hunting scum...

PPE:

The reason I didn't answer his question directly is quite frankly, this early in the game all someone can do is act on basic general principals, if he'd given me a more complicated situation I'd give a longer answer.

It's spelt "hypothetical".  And you're still over-answering his question; not, as you seem to think, under-answering it.  You also missed that his actual question was based solely around RVS play, and you answered a question about play in general.

griffionpup:

I do look forward to interacting with you in this game and later.  I'm assuming that since you like griffins, you are naturally more intelligent then the average person, so don't prove me wrong.   

I think we can agree to hold each other to higher standards to protect the name.

What are your qualms about lynching a lurker purely because he is a lurker?  Is that only OK when there's no one else particularly scummy?  Or do you lynch All Lurkers?

First let's define lurking:

Lurking: Not posting. Especially suspicious in the case of Active Lurking, which is trying to look active while not actually doing anything (posting frequently but with no substance, for instance). The idea in either case is that townies actually care about finding scum, and so should be doing things. Scum don't care, they just want some random guy lynched so they can kill someone at night.

I respond differently to active lurkers than people who haven't been around at all.  Active lurkers are trying to hide: if a lynch vote will break them and let me know why they're hiding I've little qualms voting them to death.  Note: this doesn't excuse a lack of scum hunting in the active players and as I like to use my vote for pressure I'll probably not end up actually doing this often, but it's a vote that makes sense to me.

People who haven't been around at all I treat a bit more like claimed vigs; I'd lynch them in LYLO but probably not elsewhere, especially as if they are scum, they may be gone from the game, resulting in no NK if they're the last remaining scum.

Ranger:
Look up the spelling difference between my and griffinpup's name before shortening his (at least I'm fairly sure he's a he) name as griffon please...

Also why is your vote labeled as "questions/banter" when it obviously is neither?

[Lenglon]

Oh, I see.  You're just naturally histrionic, jumpy, and nervous.  You weren't reacting to my vote!  Just my incredibly aggressive questions.

... I really don't get where you're coming from here, and that is not at all what I said. I said I over-answer questions regularly. and I'm not accusing you of being over-aggressive. What I am accusing you of is tunneling, and I find it very interesting that you only weighed in after griffion got the ball rolling for you. You did eventually get around to asking someone else a question, but only after I pointed out what you were doing. That seems either scummy because you dont want to distract people from a potential wagon, or just plain lazy. and clearly you arn't lazy.

Lenglon:
You totally missed my questions to you here, did you forget that I'm still voting for you?

those were repeats of what Vector had already asked. all you were accusing me of was over-answering a question. which once again, I do that all the time, whoop de doo.

[Tiruin]

Vote standings:

• RangerCado -
• Griffionday -
• Lenglon(4) - Shinigami_King, Griffionday, Vector, RangerCado,
• Cheesecake -
• griffinpup -
• Demdemeh(1) - griffinpup
• Shinigami_King -
• Vector(1) - Lenglon
• Captain Ford -
• Not Voting(3) - Cheesecake, Captain Ford, Demdemeh

Day 1 has begun and will end at May 23, 2013 [Thursday]  9:00 pm [GMT//UTC +8]

Extension requests: 0
Shorten requests: 0

4 votes needed to extend the day
5 votes needed to shorten the day

Praise be, for Think's LurkerTracker!

((Just remember that Italicized text = flavor, or eye candy everyone!))


"Alright, who set up this AI (Actual Intelligence). It's playing Easy. I am not winning right here by that common Four Move win just because I'm playing White."

The sounds of grating pieces become your background music as you see the white pieces stride nonchalantly into the field of battle--lifelike pieces they all are, you wonder if they're miniature replicas of everything they resemble in real like.

Well, except that the Bishop looks like a Holy Inquisitor armed to the teeth with torture weapons and other lethal items along with a sash holding shining cans or cylindrical objects. That doesn't really bode well for anyone it comes in contact with (not to mention the fanged mace it wields on both sides of the King and Queen). From the classic heavy armor of the Knight, to the padded armor of the peasant militia, or Pawns, none would seemingly stand a chance against these pieces. It was as if they were all structured in a societal-hierarchy manner rather than the usual 'piece beats piece' Chess style.

Poor Pawns. No wonder they were so many.

"Knight to F3!"
"Algebraic Notation detected. Configuring. Response notices a high level of superiority in the opposing commander. Reply: Pawn D(2^2)+1."
"Alright, fine. I thought that was the four moves thing you were doing. It was Queenside, ok? I mess up. _{Bloody AIs.} Pawn to D3..."

Tiruin:

(Tiruin: kudos for flavor!)

Agreed, I love the story you're weaving here, was it created unique for this (and the previous) game?  It's really brilliant and obviously well thought out.

It came on a whim, actually Based partly on a fantasy world I'm making--however you people are unique, both in the roles you play and in your character definitions though.

As for the previous game and the relation to this, it is mostly based on the numerous spin offs on the normal plot line I've conceptualized from it--more of a 'what happens on the sidelines' idea which leads to major events unfolding. Devil in the little details and all that. But to try to explain better, my thought process focuses more on visualizing stories or text-ish things in a really (and by that I mean realistically to the ninth power) vivid way.

This also explains my aversion to many things gross or uncouth in writing. Eheh...because yeah. My mind works that way. All of this is just what I imagine, for the enjoyment for the readers and nothing more. Only offset is English =/= native language but meh.

After watching this thread with almost childlike impatience, when it actually starts I'm at church.  Of course. 

Sorry, timezones. But I do appreciate the enthusiasm, really.

[RangerCado]

...Wow... how did i miss that... Ugh, this is what i get for staying up till midnight looking over legal documents.

Vector: Thought it was just you voting... oh, shinigami also did... and so did griff... Theres 4 on Lenglon. UNVOTE theres no point to having that many votes on him.

Lenglon: Requesting reads from a player when we're only 4 or so hours in isn't going to get you accurate information, Especially when a third of the players haven't even posted yet. Your even starting to do what Vectors doing. If your going to go after someone for not questioning others, then you should be questioning people.Griff: What are your thoughts on Lenglon and Shinigami given your known information from the last BM to now? (specifically play styles) As for the questions/banter, i was trying to catagorize everything for myself. Doesn't have to be accurate as i was just trying to keep my answers out of my questions.

Shinigami: Since you have the most hands on experiance with Lenglon... i think, do you think his behaviour reflects that of last game, or does he seem to be acting differently? And whats your take on the Vector, Lenglon... situation for lack of a better term?

Griffinpup: Although being godfather would confuse the cop, acting scummy in play would still get his vote on you. A cop would only fully trust his results if the godfather was already dead, or if the result was: Target is Mafia. Godfather can only give you a bit of wiggle room, not a free pass.

[Tiruin]

And as a note to all, because it seems my flavor is hinting it...

Rules

• Voting - Votes are cast in red and should include the name of the targeted player. Other colors may be ignored.
  
  • Tiruin,
  • Vote Tiruin,
  • Tir,
  • Vote Scumbag Tiruin,
  Are all acceptable ways to cast a vote if the target is clear enough.If you want to remove your vote, you may put unvote in red text. You must explicitly state this.  It is possible to put the name of the player you were voting afterwards, but it is not recommended as it can lead to confusion.
  

> There are no hammers in a BM. The day always ends on a timer--use it wisely!

PPE: Ranger

[Vector]

. . . You're trying to claim that I'm scummy because I was asleep and didn't post until Griffionday had already voted you?  Now you're just digging.

For curiosity's sake, why is it that you don't respond to my accusations unless they have a question attached?

You did eventually get around to asking someone else a question, but only after I pointed out what you were doing. That seems either scummy because you dont want to distract people from a potential wagon, or just plain lazy. and clearly you arn't lazy.

Hey, check the post times:

Do you honestly think you're going to make anyone worried about your line of questions if you're completely clear about how they're supposed to react, and that you're not interested in killing anyone, and that you're playing defensively from the get-go?

How exactly is this pro-town, and how will it help you get a clear read?

Vector: Why aren't you asking any RVS questions... at all? don't you want to get a read on the other players?

Would you look at that!  I had already asked someone else a question before your vote.

Furthermore, here's me forestalling a bandwagon:

But Cado, here's my question to you: what is the purpose of your third vote on Lenglon?

Shinigami_King, what do you think about Lenglon's reply to your question?  Why did you leave your vote on him in this post?

Your even starting to do what Vectors doing. If your going to go after someone for not questioning others, then you should be questioning people.

RangerCado, what is it exactly that I'm doing?  If I'm being scummy, then why aren't you voting me--and why did you vote for Lenglon if you agreed with his case, rather than mine?