Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[10ebbor10]

@Ebbor: Look, sorry to tell you this, but the airship program is likely short-lived with the beginnings of the four-engine aircraft.

I'll see you again when you manage to stuff a 20 ton radar on an aircraft; (Well, yeah, EWAC's exist, but not yet).

Also, airships survived the coming of 4 engined craft for quite a long time. As said before, they were used against submarines with great effectivines (WWII, 70.000 ships escorted, only 1 sunk). And well, the major problems with airships were weather problems, something we haven't gotten much trouble with.

You forget about the fact we also want to keep it precise too. Just because we can make it cheaper doesn't mean it's going to be able to be done easily.

Still, cheaper is easier than making something compact. Just replacing the parts with larger stuff. Hell, you don't need to touch the radar installation itself, just by cutting corners on cooling and power systems you can make a profit easily.

Note: I know there's much place for airships in warfare. Not anymore, finishing this ship will probably be the last airship related discussion.

[Brood]

Or just use cheaper materials.

[Taricus]

You can't use cheaper materials in something and expect it to keep the same level of quality brood.

[Brood]

Was an example and it depends what your using a cheaper material for.

[10ebbor10]

The electronics are a decent example. You can very easily cut cost there by using larger materials.

[Brood]

Or using cheaper metals for the outer casing.

[RAM]

The RPG and Assault rifle I'm voting for.... yeah yeah bring on the rigging crap. I'm picking them because it requires minamul man power and both can be produced in high numbers in a short time giving a largevimmediate impact on the fighting.

The 78mm cannon I'm voting on because I like the design a lot and don't see any need to change it.

Hrmm, wondering why someone would post saying that they will decide the votes...

 Regardless, neither the automatic rifle nor the 78mm cannon will be available in sufficient numbers to contribute appreciably to a war at the end of the year, so neither is in accordance with the requests from our superiors. Although it is only fair to admit bias based upon hatred of their vile calibres. Although, the 78mm is clearly excessive, it will be expensive to produce, expensive to field, expensive to arm, carry less ammunition, and a less ambitious armament would be almost as effective in the current environment, probably more effective when one factors in rate of fire and ammunition concerns.

Guys, we need the simple upgrade for the radar. I highly doubt we'd able to get even half as many as we need if it's got the compact one instead (And we can make it more compact via research later too.)

Long range will similarly reduce the difficulty of fielding them in sufficient numbers, in fact, given that it is based upon diameter rather than area it will produce far more than twice the coverage per unit produced, and will further enhance penetration into enemy territory and ease the difficulties of finding suitable positions. It is worth noting also, that there are costs involved in constructing housings, be they hidden shacks, heavily defended bunkers, or massive airships, reducing the number required would likely prove far more cost effective than reducing the cost per unit. Finally, it is likely that the coordination of fewer facilities would be easier than more numerous local facilities. While it may have a detrimental effect upon permeation of the information to all our forces, due to increased centralisation, none of the options are likely to disseminate information on a small enough scale to make much difference, unless 20 tons is enough to give fleets and divisions each their own mobile R.A.D.A.R. systems, which may well be possible if we can find a land or air chassis capable of fielding 20 tons of equipment. While long-ranged and compact are going to produce an expensive product, they really would produce a massive improvement in performance...

[Taricus]

Co-ordination shouldn't be a problem, and the radar systems will be mounted on purpose-built towers. Long-range isn't going to matter much, considering we need these to track airborne targets more than anything. The precision of these towers is paramount to avoid shooting down our own aeroplanes while retaining full effectiveness against enemy aircraft. Naval radar is also a non-issue for us at the moment, as the Capian navy effectively keeps our larger vessels in port. And our divisions do not need the RADAR system in any way, since most aircraft will be in visual range by the time our Hydra can target them

And while neither of those will be able to at the end of THIS year, that doesn't mean they cannot have an effect on the war. A lot of weapons and such are designed after field results come in. Cost-wise, we have no reports on that yet, same with it's munition capacity. The Morovians have also built a tank destroyer, wich is almost certainly a casemated AT gun built to counter our heavier tanks, and the odds are of that being uparmoured are pretty high. We will need a gun that can penetrate it's armour with ease else our armoured unts will suffer.

[tryrar]

..you're assuming the HVG-40 STILL can't pen them, and that a high-velocity 80mm(which would be MUCH simpler to develop) wouldn't be able to pen them. Dude, you're trying to dvelop a modern day cannon in the 1930's it won't work

[mesor]

Somebody said we should explain why we are picking what we pick to vote on, so I decided to explain why I picked those projects to vote for.

The chopper I picked because it's a field nobody else is in so if we get it running it's a big edge for us until other factions manage to make it work.

As for the guns, if they are upgraded quickly enough they can go into production right away and this war is likely to require 3-5 years minamum to win, we can produce a lot of rifles and rpg in 3-5 years to give us a massive edge in infantry combat and anti armor.
An AT gun is built to kill tanks, it has almost no defense against a soldier with an RPG.



It can work perfectly fine tryrar we have the basic tech, it may not come out as strong as he'd like but it'll still top anything else.

[tryrar]

Not an 80mm based on the new high-velocity AA gun

[Taricus]

..you're assuming the HVG-40 STILL can't pen them, and that a high-velocity 80mm(which would be MUCH simpler to develop) wouldn't be able to pen them. Dude, you're trying to dvelop a modern day cannon in the 1930's it won't work

Actually, it's not a modern day gun. Those are generally larger calibers to deal with the heavier armour on MBTs nowadays.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

http://www.panzerworld.net/armourpenetration

That's a table of penetration from actual WW2 German tests on nice quality steel plates (better than Russian tanks had)  at 30° angle (quite large slope)

Basically that new gun with weird caliber aims to outperform all anti tank 75 and 88 mm guns (If you do not count expensive as hell tungsten shells)

Tank guns are more impressive, but I am reasonably sure that neither Panther's gun, nor late Tiger's gun had towed versions  because they are heavy as hell

[RAM]

Co-ordination shouldn't be a problem, and the radar systems will be mounted on purpose-built towers.

Purpose-built towers will be easy for aircraft to destroy, and if aircraft can't get close enough to attack them then the radar probably isn't doing anything more than acting as a deterrent.

Long-range isn't going to matter much, considering we need these to track airborne targets more than anything.

Airborne targets used by the enemy typically travel quite quickly and at fairly high altitude, which takes time to intercept, detecting them sooner is going to matter much. I do not think that we are going to get radar-guided missiles without some sort of computational revolution, which means waiting for a relevant research breakthrough. I suppose that some sort of primitive computer or purely mechanical system of veering towards radar signal might be possible, but practicality seems so remote...

The precision of these towers is paramount to avoid shooting down our own aeroplanes while retaining full effectiveness against enemy aircraft.

Seriously, these systems are about tracking their movements so we can get interceptors out, not tracking individual planes. Now I agree that precision would be fantastic, as it would allow us to allocate proportional responses. But assuming that "Co-ordination shouldn't be a problem" we should be able to predict with some accuracy the function of a flight based upon where it is headed. And we should be able to keep track of our own aircraft so that we know when they are due and what routes they will be taking. Certainly, enemy aircraft might find out that we can't tell the difference, and then may try to predict what our flights were up to, and then attempt to match the flight patterns of our aircraft, and do so without any forward positions reporting them in from a visual identification, but it seems that we should be able to get by without precision for now.

Naval radar is also a non-issue for us at the moment, as the Capian navy effectively keeps our larger vessels in port.

Ocean is a big place, unless they have their own detection systems, or can blockade our ports, we should be able to send out small raiding parties without issue. Especially if our groups can detect the enemy before the enemy can detect them.

And our divisions do not need the RADAR system in any way, since most aircraft will be in visual range by the time our Hydra can target them

There is a certain advantage to being able to change formations, deploy towed guns, get behind something, and point all your guns in the correct direction before you can actually see the thing shooting at you. And if you can track targets as they return to their bases then so much the better...

And while neither of those will be able to at the end of THIS year, that doesn't mean they cannot have an effect on the war. A lot of weapons and such are designed after field results come in. Cost-wise, we have no reports on that yet, same with it's munition capacity. The Morovians have also built a tank destroyer, wich is almost certainly a casemated AT gun built to counter our heavier tanks, and the odds are of that being uparmoured are pretty high. We will need a gun that can penetrate it's armour with ease else our armoured unts will suffer.

We have capable penetration weapons, and should be able to out-manoeuvre the heavy units. It certainly could get messy, but I don't really see a situation in which we will be driven back by an unstoppable wall of heavy tanks. The simple fact is that the proposed design is for penetrating late-World War II armour when we shouldn't be expecting much early-World War II armour. This cannot come without some sort of cost in weight and cost per round and weight necessitates a certain difficulty of handling. So in short, it would be effective, but, in practical terms, not very effective, and very inefficient. As for the assault rifle, it is going to be a limited-run item unless we sacrifice a lot of production to it. But mostly I just despise the 7.62mm round with a raging furious passion. On account of it being real-world technology, completely unnecessary, will require additional reworking of factories and book-keeping, and has far too many digits...

[Ukrainian Ranger]

There is a certain advantage to being able to change formations, deploy towed guns, get behind something, and point all your guns in the correct direction before you can actually see the thing shooting at you. And if you can track targets as they return to their bases then so much the better...

You forgot the most important thing - call for fighters sooner
I prefer simple for the time being because I don't care much about our forces or navy, I care about  our industrial targets

We have capable penetration weapons, and should be able to out-manoeuvre the heavy units. It certainly could get messy, but I don't really see a situation in which we will be driven back by an unstoppable wall of heavy tanks. The simple fact is that the proposed design is for penetrating late-World War II armour when we shouldn't be expecting much early-World War II armour.

To add to this, we got a nice infantry weapon to immobilize heavy tanks...
Most likely in the current war we'll never face thick skinned tanks and it will be ended long before Tigers will start to appear ( or there are will be few of them)

I just despise the 7.62mm round with a raging furious passion. On account of it being real-world technology, completely unnecessary, will require additional reworking of factories and book-keeping, and has far too many digits...

+1...  I tried to push 6mm assault rifle earlier, but BMA chose to try to recreate AK-47 (funny thing = it's a bad caliber for an assault rifle, AK-74 switched to smaller round when that became oblivious)