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[Hamiltonz]

Wish me luck.  After searching and searching I've finally generated an island that I can embark on that is completely surrounded by water.  I had to adjust the size of the embark zone to 15x9 just to get the game to load.  Stonesense crashes the game so I'm not going to be using stonesense for this fortress.

Tropical Savanna biome (Hot) for the majority of the island (all murky ponds start out dry).  There is an aquifer so I should be okay.  Not starting with a pick.  Instead I'm starting with 23 stones of magmatite and 92 stones of marble (and an iron anvil), enough for seven complete sets of steel armor.  Yes, I am aware that the mining pick cannot also be used as a military pick at the same time.  Also, none of my dwarves will be starting with any points in skills.  Had to be done so that I could bring all that stone and at least some supplies.

I'm expect that I may never see a trade caravan nor any immigrants due to there being no solid ground along any edge of the screen.  That is why I've embarked with all that steel making supplies.

Dhydration will be my first obstacle to overcome.  Strike the Earth!

[Centigrade]

Perhaps there is something that I misunderstand, but how is being isolated a challenge? From my understanding your isolation from trade routes also means there will be no sieges; and, as to thirst you ought to be able to handle that with brewing above ground plants.

[joeclark77]

I predict your fort will succumb to FPS death.  15x9 is too big for the game to sustainably run.
And what do you need all of that steel for, anyway?  You won't have any invasions, and I'm not sure you'll even have any wild animals before you breach the caverns.  In sufficient numbers wooden crossbows should be enough to handle the wildlife... and eventually there will be candy even if no other ores exist.

[TripJack]

yea 15x9 is a monster embark... but i guess that means you'll have plenty cotton candy when the times comes right? 

[Hamiltonz]

The challenge is about surviving without trade and without immigrants.

I like to imagine the the ship ran aground on a deserted island and no one knows where these guys are. 

I will still have to contend with all the underground stuff.  I also understand that as soon as I open up a cavern that connects to a screen edge all the above ground fun will start happening as well, just underground.  I've never had a trade caravan appear in a cavern before.  I'm expecting that to happen if I live long enough.  Just now a flock of vultures ran off with all my food, and they continue to steal every above ground plant that I gather.  I'm not going to be able to brew any replacement alchohol once my initial stocks run out.  This may be a short game.

<Curses the Vultures while waving his fist in the air, defiantly>.

On the bright side I really lucked out and I have a yak cow and a yak bull.  If I survive I will have a meat industry.  As long as I don't have to butcher them to feed my guys.

Looks like starvation is my new first challenge.  I'm really missing that initial pick right about now.

Edit: I routinely run 12x12, my system can handle things as long as I don't do anything crazy.  The steel is for the FB and HFS, later.

[slothen]

FPS death won't happen for a long long time with 7 dwarfs and 0 migrants.  However, I would caution OP, I've heard stories of rectangle embarks behaving strangely, you could get migrants and caravans popping out of thin air.  Assuming that doesn't happen though, the biggest problem would be keeping all 7 of your dwarves alive for the 15-30 years it will take to get a sustainable breeding population.  But with no invaders and no large land mammals spawning (again, assuming they won't) you have plenty of time to go afk while the game runs.

If you're tight on embark points, I don't see the point of needing all that steel.  Bronze is easier and you can make more of it faster and bring more of it, plus once you want to upgrade, you have gobs of adamantine on your map.  Assuming you have surface plants, trees, and soil, you should have a good time.  You can ignore all cavern-threats indefinitely anyway.

PS, since you're aware of the issue with miner uniforms, do you have a workaround that will allow your miners to wear armor while mining?  Does off-duty military with mining as a civilian labor work?

edit:  you can use all that marble and iron to build an enclosure for your food, deconstruct and turn to steel later.

[Hamiltonz]

If you're tight on embark points, I don't see the point of needing all that steel.  Bronze is easier and you can make more of it faster and bring more of it, plus once you want to upgrade, you have gobs of adamantine on your map.  Assuming you have surface plants, trees, and soil, you should have a good time.  You can ignore all cavern-threats indefinitely anyway.

PS, since you're aware of the issue with miner uniforms, do you have a workaround that will allow your miners to wear armor while mining?  Does off-duty military with mining as a civilian labor work?

edit:  you can use all that marble and iron to build an enclosure for your food, deconstruct and turn to steel later.

I'm working my way up to embarking into a Terrifying zone with an Aquifer.  These easier challenges are practice.  That said I think I will down step to Bronze.  The problem is that steel takes 172 units of fuel to craft 7 sets of steel weapons and armor.  I'm running with over half my guys as lumberjacks and I'm still taking too long.

Cotten Candy takes even longer and it is simply easier to carbonite the clowns.

My solution is to make one guy a part-time miner.  It's been working with a lumberjack/miner.  I'll probably create a uniform without a weapon, or with a wooden one so that the pickman will drop his pick for the miner to pick up.  I was hoping to reach some metal ore before then.  Run with 5 active duty mace/axe men and recruit in the pickman after I found metal ore.  We'll see.

The Vultures ran off on their own.  Not before delaying my brewing until it was too late to save two of my guys.  One died with his head in a barrel of longland wheat.  If only he had lasted a moment or two longer.

I did use the marble for my first workshops to get things rolling early.  I had plenty of wood and I needed to floor the entire ceiling to block vultures.  I built a 14x14 enclosure to hold the farms, the stockpiles, and the worshops.  Total wood needed was 196 (one wood is a door).  Oh and one more for the ramp.  It's a learning experience.  Next time weapons not walls.

The Seven have become Five.  My farm enclosure is 3/4s of the way done, not that it matters now.

[joeclark77]

Be sure to make bronze from ore instead of bars.  With casserite and copper ore you get 8 bars of bronze for the cost of one fuel, a fantastic bargain.
Although I think your problem would have been solved best by making wooden crossbows and bolts immediately on embark.  You don't need full sets of armor to drive off nuisance birds, and seven crossbows are better protection for your food than a huge wooden surface structure.

[Hamiltonz]

The expedition leader just went berserk and killed two other dwarves.  One was the only remaining male.  She's currently not moving, parked some distance away from...no wait, she sees someone.  Well, not long now.

The question is: Do I reclaim or start over?

I'm leaning toward starting over from the embark screen.  I want to try this again with a better strategy.  a 10x10 enclosure made with the stone and/or wooden crossbows.

If I start over I'll start a new thread.  Call it 'Mark II'.

Edit: oh how lame, the berzerking dwarf died of thirst.  She was drinking when she went crazy.  The herbalist only lost a toe.

The Five have become Two.

[Centigrade]

A roofed enclosure seems like it would solve all your problems. Whether this is by constructing an above ground structure or by digging into the ground. Why not bring a pick, or at least forge some of your starting materials into picks? It seems you stand to lose far less by sacrificing a few embark points.

[slothen]

if you have an aquifer... why did they die of thirst?

with a large embark and bronze, the idea is you can do bronze immediately, and switch to adamantine in the first year or two to deal with forgotten beasts.

war dogs do quite well against vultures if you pasture them over your stockpiles

bringing a pick saves you a few seconds, with some stone (need that fire-safe building material, caused me some headaches), some logs, and some cassiterite and copper nuggets, you can have picks out very fast and start digging a ditch, or bring extra wood/stone and start pumping out blocks.  The mining/blocks/bar changes really are a boon to resource-tight embarks.

[joeclark77]

a 10x10 enclosure made with the stone and/or wooden crossbows.

Is living above-ground part of the challenge?  Because I'm still not sure why you're building an enclosure instead of digging in.  Moving all the supplies from the wagon to an indoor stockpile will probably take less time than constructing an above-ground enclosure.  On the other hand if you're pursuing an above-ground challenge, then a mere 5x5 enclosure should be sufficient to cover up the wagon and all the stuff in it.

[evictedSaint]

I would personally restart, if I were you.

With no opportunity for reproduction, you've doomed yourself to a slow, slow, slow death.  I have always entertained the thought of creating a fortress that is entirely self-sustained, but I was never sure how far it could go.  I modify the maxage so that dwarves mature after two years and live to be 12 or so to speed up the process.

But with only a maximum of five or six dwarves, it sounds like a boring, boring game.

[Hamiltonz]

I am bringing enough stone to build a 10x10 enclosure with ceiling.  I worked it out: three 3x3 farms (longland, strawberry, and prickleberry); four 3x3 stockpiles one for each farm, one for wood; two workshops, carpenter's and still.

First move will be to clear the 10x10 area of all plants while turning one stone into the carpenter's workshop, then the three logs from the wagon into axes, then cut all the trees in the 10x10.  Build the Archery and Craftdwarf's workshop outside the enclosure for making crossbows and ammo from wood.

The herbalist just went berzerk.  I'm going with the reclaim option because I want to see what happens to the scattered items when there is no path from the edge of the screen.
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Reclaim_fortress_mode

Scattered items seem to only be placed on walkable paths from the edge of the map. Walls and raising drawbridges (in the up position) block the scattering of objects. This can be exploited to concentrate reclaimed items in a small area

Edit: Nothing moved.

To answer the 'why not dig in' question:  I couldn't afford a pick with all that ore and I figured I could make a pick easy enough.  I didn't have the time before the vulture attack and then it was a race to avoid starvation.

The dehydration was just bad timing.  I had the booze for them but they didn't come back until after their current job was completed.

Somehow the last remaining dwarf escaped the berzerking Herbalist.  I'm going to abandon now instead of waiting this out.

[slothen]

if you're not bringing a pick, bring lots of logs.  Never not bring lots of logs.