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Author Topic: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions  (Read 201735 times)

smakemupagus

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #345 on: June 24, 2013, 03:16:44 pm »

dunno about dragons? a lot of creatures have that, it lets them grow at different rates in different parts of their life, they're supposed to hit each of the milestones. i don't know whether they grow linearly between each point or something else. 

once you know the name of the tag, wiki generally explains it pretty well. 
Spoiler:  body_size (click to show/hide)

Praying labor is "prayer" in game and in therapist, and the profession name is
[PROFESSION_NAME:STRAND_EXTRACTOR:apostle of armok:apostles of armok]
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 03:19:08 pm by smakemupagus »
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vcordie

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #346 on: June 24, 2013, 03:19:10 pm »

dragons grow in stages. anyways. What tag determines how many babies a mammal will have? I see some animals have littersize in their raws, but not all of them. Do the ones without littersize only have 1 child?

Seems you can't push up the prayer skill at embark then. Bug or working as intended?
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smakemupagus

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #347 on: June 24, 2013, 03:28:53 pm »

Yes, [LITTERSIZE].  I don't know what the default behavior is if it is absent, but it's not just 1.   Orcish dreamwalkers (who have neither LITTERSIZE nor MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE, iirc) will have twins fairly commonly and sometimes triplets.  I don't remember ever seeing quads.

>> Seems you can't push up the prayer skill at embark then. Bug or working as intended?

If it's not there, my guess is: not exactly working as intended, but limitation of what is possible to mod.  I dunno, have to wait for Meph to chime in.

>> dragons grow in stages.

Oh i see.  I think most creatures do, too.  Not sure.

Putnam

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #348 on: June 24, 2013, 03:32:34 pm »

Quote
snip
Stats are in the raws (object/item/shield~armor,) mostly different in coverage, block chance and UBSTEP. 
I erm, don't know how to interpret, open, read, or even know what the hell the raws even are.

okay

jimboo

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #349 on: June 24, 2013, 03:36:20 pm »

I think that jimboo, you were looking at Max_Edge while Vcordie was looking at Shear_Yield.  I'm sure Edge comes into play somehow too, but Shear_Yield seems to be the primary stat that determines whether a blade made of material A will penetrate an armor of material B.

For a slash attack, of a certainty.  I was playing around with the new glasses you listed and while they shatter pretty much as expected against strong armor, they’re surprisingly effective at penetration attacks (á la Kobolds and those annoying, sometimes-surprisingly effective copper daggers), not seeming to fracture as expected with point blows -- tempered crystal glass in particular.  I was looking at Max_Edge and the Weapon Effectiveness formula from the 40d page along with … some possibly improper penetration assumptions drawn from the http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/File:Projectile.png flowchart. 

The enchanted bloodsteel shows up in the orcfort_magic raws as well; does that mean your WAAAAAAAAGH!Mongers are going to show up one day against the dwarves with something much better than Deep Bronze?   :)
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vcordie

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #350 on: June 24, 2013, 03:45:54 pm »

Yes, [LITTERSIZE].  I don't know what the default behavior is if it is absent, but it's not just 1.   Orcish dreamwalkers (who have neither LITTERSIZE nor MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE, iirc) will have twins fairly commonly and sometimes triplets.  I don't remember ever seeing quads.
Interesting. !!Science!! will have to be done but based on just the raws, it seems that for meat the best animal to take are moleweasels. how huge litter, decent grow time (half size in a couple hundred days and grows to a max size of 3200 in a year), combine that with the stupid clutch size of horned cave turtles for food and sacrifice the blood to armok from slaughtering the moleweasles (Armok's brew is better then bloodwine), bones from food...its entirely possible to not have to farm at all. Ever. It's actually seems to be quite easy.

Edit: Moleweasles also hunt vermin. So don't take frill lizards.
I just wonder what the butcherable remains are in terms of bones/skulls/skin. Where can I find that in the raws?
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 03:48:08 pm by vcordie »
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vcordie

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #351 on: June 24, 2013, 03:52:20 pm »

Another question, im filled with a lot of them

I heard that battle picks mine faster then regular picks. Is that true?
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Billy Jack

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #352 on: June 24, 2013, 03:59:42 pm »

I prefer Leatherwings for pets because they hunt vermin and can be sheared for leather.

I also always bring at least one Golden Goose for the gold bars. Praying for soft metals also provides gold sometimes.

My carpenter knocks out a few beds, tables, and chairs, then starts making the parts for the Guildhall.

In my current game, I've created a mason, smith, farmer, merchant, fisherdwarf, and craftsdwarf before the first caravan showed up.
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Give a dwarf a fish, you feed him for a season.
Give a dwarf a Fishpond, couple of buckets, build a Fishery, and enable Fishfarming labor; you feed him for a lifetime. (And get someone to clean and prep the fish)

vcordie

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #353 on: June 24, 2013, 04:19:45 pm »

I prefer Leatherwings for pets because they hunt vermin and can be sheared for leather.

I also always bring at least one Golden Goose for the gold bars. Praying for soft metals also provides gold sometimes.

My carpenter knocks out a few beds, tables, and chairs, then starts making the parts for the Guildhall.

In my current game, I've created a mason, smith, farmer, merchant, fisherdwarf, and craftsdwarf before the first caravan showed up.
Good point about the golden goose being used to mint coins, I hadn't thought of that. Praying for soft metal will also make silver and platinum show up sometimes, which is nice. I disagree on leatherwings. You get 1 piece of leather a year from them, and I can have raised 2-7 moleweasles in that time which I can then butcher for meat, turn the blood into trade goods/weapons via armok or turn it into bloodwine, use the bones and skull for drink, hell, I could use the meat for special plants but theres a 20% chance only of it turning into plants so I won't.

Anyone got a list of poisons that you can make/aquire and coat your weapons with?
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vcordie

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #354 on: June 24, 2013, 04:20:29 pm »

Quote
snip
Stats are in the raws (object/item/shield~armor,) mostly different in coverage, block chance and UBSTEP. 
I erm, don't know how to interpret, open, read, or even know what the hell the raws even are.

okay
s
I did in fact google that, if you read some of my earlier posts. :D
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Repseki

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #355 on: June 24, 2013, 04:23:41 pm »

Siege by Gnomes? That shouldnt be possible, they have exactly the same ethics as dwarves. The rest sounds hilarious though. :)

Are you using the expedition system a lot?

Been really busy the last few days and totally forgot to check back.

No I haven't been using the expedition system at all, don't even have it set up yet, as the first 2-3 years of the fort were mostly spent desperately trying to keep up the booze stockpile and expanding my farming (first time playing with harder farming). I really have no idea why the gnomes were mad with me, besides maybe a diplomat or two that got jumped on his way out. I have since made peace with the human civ that we were at war with, and an elven civ that I didn't even know I was at war with, so I might actually start getting caravans on a regular basis again. I use the Bridge trick to force them in a safe place, but even then a goblin troop jumped the last Elf caravan.

It's 8 years in and I only just dug down through the cavern layers to reveal the magma sea and some candy, so now I'm finally setting up a real forge and working on a minecart tower to increase the speed at which the candy gets to the forge. Then i get to cast around the 5 or so layers that are in magma and work on the 40 or so levels under that until the circus. Yay.

All I want is for the goblin ambushes to stop showing up so often. When they are on the map it cuts my fps from 150~ to 60~ and they have started getting being more reluctant when it comes to entering through my drowning pit. They've also made it near impossible to finish the roof on my top level and recently picked off 3 dwarves and a baby before they could get back inside. I'm just waiting for another Dragon to show up and fly in, luckily the last one didn't breath any fire.
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Darkond2100

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #356 on: June 24, 2013, 05:09:25 pm »

So I'm having a problem with migrants.
I'm not getting any.
I got two waves of three migrants each and after that nothing.
Since DFHack is open, I figured out how to force migrants person
STILL NO MIGRANTS

Why is this?
For now, I'll fix this by having dwarves give birth to quadruplets and growing up to adults in two years. But, I'd like to know if this is a bug in my fort, or the world, or the civ. The Civ info does give a nice list of probably-living nobles. And my oldest dwarf is 140 with a bit of history behind her, so it doesn't sounds like the dwarven race is extinct, besides the fact that I'm getting no migrants.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 05:11:02 pm by Darkond2100 »
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Billy Jack

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #357 on: June 24, 2013, 05:21:35 pm »

I prefer Leatherwings for pets because they hunt vermin and can be sheared for leather.

I also always bring at least one Golden Goose for the gold bars. Praying for soft metals also provides gold sometimes.

My carpenter knocks out a few beds, tables, and chairs, then starts making the parts for the Guildhall.

In my current game, I've created a mason, smith, farmer, merchant, fisherdwarf, and craftsdwarf before the first caravan showed up.
Good point about the golden goose being used to mint coins, I hadn't thought of that. Praying for soft metal will also make silver and platinum show up sometimes, which is nice. I disagree on leatherwings. You get 1 piece of leather a year from them, and I can have raised 2-7 moleweasles in that time which I can then butcher for meat, turn the blood into trade goods/weapons via armok or turn it into bloodwine, use the bones and skull for drink, hell, I could use the meat for special plants but theres a 20% chance only of it turning into plants so I won't.

Anyone got a list of poisons that you can make/aquire and coat your weapons with?
Leatherwings are shearable four times a year.
  • 1 breeding set will produce 8 leather per year.
  • no need for nest boxes or egg management to insure they are giving birth.
  • female is able to hunt vermin instead of sitting on an egg for a season. (useful for Studding)
  • Maturity of one year.
  • I'm swimming in meat, bones, and blood from standard hunting.
  • As far as I know, leather goods are worth more for trade.

Just be sure to plant some Hide Roots in the spring to make the oil.

I guess I'm just pro-leatherwing.  :D
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 05:28:15 pm by Billy Jack »
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Give a dwarf a fish, you feed him for a season.
Give a dwarf a Fishpond, couple of buckets, build a Fishery, and enable Fishfarming labor; you feed him for a lifetime. (And get someone to clean and prep the fish)

Repseki

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #358 on: June 24, 2013, 05:32:02 pm »

Just got another invasion by Gnomes. Gnomes riding War Tigers and War Grizzly Bears. I don't know what I did to piss them off, but these Gnomes seem pretty badass. To bad I'm going to drown them all...
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vcordie

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Re: [DWARF] - Gameplay Questions
« Reply #359 on: June 24, 2013, 05:48:42 pm »

I prefer Leatherwings for pets because they hunt vermin and can be sheared for leather.

I also always bring at least one Golden Goose for the gold bars. Praying for soft metals also provides gold sometimes.

My carpenter knocks out a few beds, tables, and chairs, then starts making the parts for the Guildhall.

In my current game, I've created a mason, smith, farmer, merchant, fisherdwarf, and craftsdwarf before the first caravan showed up.
Good point about the golden goose being used to mint coins, I hadn't thought of that. Praying for soft metal will also make silver and platinum show up sometimes, which is nice. I disagree on leatherwings. You get 1 piece of leather a year from them, and I can have raised 2-7 moleweasles in that time which I can then butcher for meat, turn the blood into trade goods/weapons via armok or turn it into bloodwine, use the bones and skull for drink, hell, I could use the meat for special plants but theres a 20% chance only of it turning into plants so I won't.

Anyone got a list of poisons that you can make/aquire and coat your weapons with?
Leatherwings are shearable four times a year.
  • 1 breeding set will produce 8 leather per year.
  • no need for nest boxes or egg management to insure they are giving birth.
  • female is able to hunt vermin instead of sitting on an egg for a season. (useful for Studding)
  • Maturity of one year.
  • I'm swimming in meat, bones, and blood from standard hunting.
  • As far as I know, leather goods are worth more for trade.

Just be sure to plant some Hide Roots in the spring to make the oil.

I guess I'm just pro-leatherwing.  :D
Okay, leatherwings versus any birds except the kavernkeet (eggs+wool just too good to pass up, domestic cloth production is just shitty to set up with harder farming so you want to get cloth anyway you can) leatherwing wins hand down. Leatherwing versus horned turtle is more difficult to assess. Leatherwings cost less, they also hunt vermin, give leather quater annually. Horned turtle lays 1-5 eggs quarter annually, take two years to mature, and give shells upon butchering, in case of that one fucking strange mood. You know the one. Prepared food>leather trade. Try trading a barrel of prepared food sometime. You can actually buy out a caravan filled with more food then you just traded them for, plus seeds. there is almost little reason to trade anything else that aren't insanely valuable goods. I stopped bringing stone crafters with me on embark because prepared food. So leatherwings versus horned turtles: personal opinion. I get shit all from hunting to be honest, I just don't have very many wild animals appear, I do bring a hunter in the beginning because I can easily swap him to my first marksdwarf after the initial 10 or so animals that are on the map are hunted and my first migration wave shows up, so I can see how the leather can be an asset. However, needing oil to  make it better is a bit...annoying. I don't like farming. Not to mention it takes a while to turn that leather in to useful goods, whereas I can turn eggs into prepared food in a single step.

Now, leatherwing versus moleweasel? Moleweasel wins, hands down. The fact taht leatherwings hunt vermin: Moot point. So do moleweasels. Moleweasels grow larger then leatherwings, in the same time span. moleweasels have a litter size of 4-7. That means they always give birth to anywhere from between 4 to 7 new moleweasels. Also, im pretty sure they have skin in their butching returns due to this line in the raws: [PLUS_TISSUE_LAYER:SKIN:BY_CATEGORY:THROAT] meaning they also produce leather. Assuming the minimum litter size, butchering them after they grow to full size in 1 year, I get: 4 pieces of leather. In 1 year, you also get 4 pieces of leather. I get more meat, I have a chance of getting MORE then 4 pieces of leather, etc. If you could train  leatherwings the way you can train hawks, you might have a case, but when it comes to moleweasels versus leatherwings, moleweasels win. it seems a golden goose, moleweasels, a few horned turtles and kavernkeets are the ideal pet layout. alternatively drop the kavernkeets and add some dogs to wartrain. You can't pull off both a golden goose and mastiffs with a 1274 point embark and still be able to fit in enough stuff to have a successful fortress.

Honestly you could just request dogs/mastiffs/kavernkeets from your mountainhomes liason though.

Nest boxes cost a few pieces of wood/stone. not exactly something that isn't in plentiful supply (unless you're on a glacier), and what you call egg management I call a door and a single tile of digging for the nest box. assign nestbox to bird, wait for bird to be inside, lock door. Bird's dont need a pasture to graze so they won't starve.
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