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[Owlbread]

The Chechen Republic of Ichkeria (the Chechen government in exile i.e. Prime Minister Akhmed Zakayev) is making claims that the recent bomb attacks in Boston are simply too good to be true for Putin and the Kremlin. In a series of newspaper articles and interviews, Zakayev has brought up the idea that Tamerlan Tsarnaev may have been a puppet of the Kremlin.

With Tamerlan Tsarnaev having entered Dagestan in January 2012, Zakayev finds it intriguing that the Russian security services did not choose to detain him when they could, especially since they were so interested in him in 2011 when they requested that the FBI question him (they were the "foreign government" quoted by the FBI). He apparently disagrees though that they were out-and-out agents, nor does he suggest that they were trained by militants like Dokka Umarov. His implications are that by "pulling strings" (i.e. not aggressively pursuing people like Tsarnaev) the Russians have allowed something like the Boston Bombings to happen. It is especially opportune for Putin's government that the bombings would happen just a year before the Sochi Winter Olympics that will take place in Circassia, North Caucasus. Wouldn't it be great if the USA provided security services?

Indeed, he makes the following point: "“Three years ago Putin said that Western nations granting political asylum to Chechens will have problems with these Chechens.” This is in reference to Putin's comments on the media attention Zakayev received when he avoided extradition to Russia.

Besides his very careful comments here, he has also made claims in the past that Russian security services have been involved in every terrorist attack attributed to Chechen Islamic extremists, including the 1999 Moscow apartment bombings, a view shared by John McCain and the internationally renowned Russian journalist Anna Politkovskaya, assassinated under mysterious circumstances in Moscow. Christopher Hitchens was also quite open to the idea.

Articles:

http://amanpour.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/23/chechen-opposition-leader-denies-ties-to-tsarnaev-brothers/

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/04/22/boston-bombings-a-gift-to-putin-says-chechen-opposition-leader.html

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2013/04/26/judge-bombing-suspects-not-chechen-people/LyUVAGczZxa13cok5FjdYO/story.html

I also have a link to his twitter page here, along with a speech he made at the Oslo Freedom Forum in 2009:

https://twitter.com/AkhmedZakayev

Speech

I would have posted this in the Boston Bombings thread, but it has been locked.

[Il Palazzo]

Just to make sure you know what can of worms you're opening - you are aware that this argumentation works perfectly for 9/11 too?

[Owlbread]

Just to make sure you know what can of worms you're opening - you are aware that this argumentation works perfectly for 9/11 too?

I am fully aware, and I have not said I endorse his opinions on this particular subject (though with respect to the wider issue of the Chechen cause I do). I'm just giving you his point of view, which is important given we've had Ramzan Kadyrov's point of view and also Putin's. Given that they're quite colourful I found it interesting enough to show you fellows.

[DWC]

The Russians would stand to gain nothing from such a plot, other then a 'See? Told you so!' regarding the chechens.

We are not going to be provoked into war over this, and the US gov't already knows these chechen Islamist militants are dangerous, we've encountered them in Iraq and so forth.

No conspricy is needed, two wannabe jihadists set off a couple of simple explosive devices, big deal.

[Owlbread]

The Russians would stand to gain nothing from such a plot, other then a 'See? Told you so!' regarding the chechens.

We are not going to be provoked into war over this, and the US gov't already knows these chechen Islamist militants are dangerous, we've encountered them in Iraq and so forth.

No conspricy is needed, two wannabe jihadists set off a couple of simple explosive devices, big deal.

Though popular opinion in the USA and to a lesser extent abroad (at least among those formerly ignorant of the North Caucasus) has turned quite firmly against the Chechen opposition. It's remarkable that I can count about 6 or 7 Americans on various videos on youtube calling for genocide (one guy literally said "Stalin was wright" sic) of the entire country when 2 years ago I'd have to google translate Russian comments to get that kind of stuff. Putin has also made a statement either yesterday or the day before that he hopes for "greater cooperation" between the Russian and US governments against terrorism. If Putin is vindicated on his most morally dubious platform (his policies on Chechnya), that's actually quite important for him.

When you say "two wannabe jihadists set off a couple of simple explosive devices, big deal", that's exactly the way it should be. It isn't though - the implications are much wider because of the terrorists' links to the North Caucasus. Things are probably going to heat up in 2014 too when the world's eyes are on Sochi, especially since the Olympics are going to occur on the anniversary of the Circassian Genocide carried out by Imperial Russia. There will undoubtedly be large-scale demonstrations carried out by the Circassian community who are scattered across the world.

[ChairmanPoo]

The russians don't need to do such a thing - they already killed off every Chechen leader who wasn't an islamic fundamentalist, so the remaining ones do the job of discrediting themselves for free.

[Owlbread]

The russians don't need to do such a thing - they already killed off every Chechen leader who wasn't an islamic fundamentalist, so the remaining ones do the job of discrediting themselves for free.

Here here, with alarming efficiency too. It's remarkable Zakayev survived. Maybe they should have trained the Americans and British in the art of missile strikes and assassinations, we could have killed insurgent leaders in the middle east much sooner.

[misko27]

Fact: Youtube != America.


Just keep that in mind. I could use the same argument to imply America endorses Communism, Socialism, Fascism, Nazism, Forced Homosexuality, Feminism, Misandry, Misogyny, Misanthropy, Aliens, Evangelicals, The Middle Class, Genocide of any of the Races/Major religions, Austerity, Libertarian-ism  the Gold Standard, The Destruction of Canada, The Dissolution of the Union, The Downfall of NAFTA, the Demise of the UN, Lighting farts on fire, , The nyan-cat overlorders, and Cat-on-Alligator Violence.


Also, the Chechans are as biased as the Russians in this matter. It had nothing to do with either of them.

[Owlbread]

Fact: Youtube != America.


Just keep that in mind. I could use the same argument to imply America endorses Communism, Socialism, Fascism, Nazism, Forced Homosexuality, Feminism, Misandry, Misogyny, Misanthropy, Aliens, Evangelicals, The Middle Class, Genocide of any of the Races/Major religions, Austerity, Libertarian-ism  the Gold Standard, The Destruction of Canada, The Dissolution of the Union, The Downfall of NAFTA, the Demise of the UN, Lighting farts on fire, , The nyan-cat overlorders, and Cat-on-Alligator Violence.


Also, the Chechans are as biased as the Russians in this matter. It had nothing to do with either of them.

Are you honestly telling me that there is no significance to the fact that there are far, far more Americans on youtube criticising Chechnya and the Chechen movement than there were before the bombings?

[misko27]

Yes, Yes I am.

In a month no one will remember what Chechnya is. We'll have moved on to our latest tragedy. Hopefully, one with an equally interesting twist, and possibly a happier ending. Maybe something with fire this time. And then there will be a statistically significant number of people blaming the Firefighter Unions.

[Cthulhu]

So, beyond the cui bono reasoning of "Putin would benefit from inflaming American sentiment against the Chechens" and the failure to detain Tsarnaev, which is circumstantial at best, what's the evidence of Russian involvement?

[Owlbread]

Yes, Yes I am.

In a month no one will remember what Chechnya is. We'll have moved on to our latest tragedy. Hopefully, one with an equally interesting twist, and possibly a happier ending. Maybe something with fire this time. And then there will be a statistically significant number of people blaming the Firefighter Unions.

I'm going to wait until I hear formal statements from Obama on that matter clarifying what their response to Putin's calls are.

So, beyond the cui bono reasoning of "Putin would benefit from inflaming American sentiment against the Chechens" and the failure to detain Tsarnaev, which is circumstantial at best, what's the evidence of Russian involvement?

There is no strong evidence or the international community would have put sanctions on Russia by now. You may call it circumstantial "at best", but what circumstances would lead to a man, once considered so important to the Russian secret services that they would actually request that the FBI formally question him, not being detained at all and being allowed to walk free? At a time when people were being detained for protesting against Putin in church?

[misko27]

The fact that seizing people on US soil is considered a no-no. By which time he was on.

[Owlbread]

The fact that seizing people on US soil is considered a no-no. By which time he was on.

You misunderstand, good sir. I am making reference to his trap to Dagestan in January 2012, well after the correspondence between the FBI and the Russian government.

[Leafsnail]

If they wanted to let him perform the attack wouldn't they just not warn the FBI at all?