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[Owlbread]

They might be Islamists (probably lone wolves in that case, due to the lack of announcements) who just happens to be from Chechenya. Or they might just be two ordinary crazies who happen to be from Chechenya.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/19/tamerlan-tsarnaev-american-life-of-dead-boston-bomb-suspect

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/19/boston-suspect-dzhokhar-tsarnaev-school

They are Islamists (apparently freelance) from Dagestan, although of Chechen descent. I hope to christ the USA doesn't start working with Putin now in stamping out the insurgency or, god forbid, raises a finger in the UK government's direction over Zakhaev.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/19/boston-bombing-link-chechnya-unprecedented?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

According to this article auld Dokka Umarov asked for help from Chechens abroad 3 weeks ago. I don't quite see how making the USA hate Chechnya and the North Caucasians who have legitimate claims to independence is going to help your cause. The Chechen people would do well to be rid of that man, but I suppose Moscow like him too much. He makes all Chechen separatists look bad and he gives Russians a reason to be in Chechnya supporting Kadyrov, so why rush? The Spetsnaz can wait until he is no longer useful.

[misko27]

My mom, as professional as she is, can be odd at times. I mentioned to her one of the bomber's ran at the police, who, guns drawn, are firing at him and his brother, intending to detonate a suicide vest. So she asks, "is he still alive?".


Interestingly, he survived to get to the hospital, under cardiac arrest, with blast and multiple bullet wounds.

EDIT: Onion has decided to congratulate CNN on it's reporting: http://www.theonion.com/articles/cnn-releases-photos-of-3-obese-mexican-women-suspe,32112/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=standard-post:headline:default

[RedKing]

It is kinda... 'funny', for lack of better word, that 2 individuals can shut down everyday activities/businesses for +500k? people for more then 12(?) hours...

Is it like some form of martial law?  It does seem like it...

When they're dealing with people who are not above strapping a bomb to their chest, I think a bit of martial law is justified.

But for how long? You can't keep a city the size of Boston locked down indefinitely. And to be honest, I'm concerned about the long-term ramifications. If they're successful at catching Tsarnaev inside Boston, it'll provide a powerful precedent for locking down an entire damn city in order to do a manhunt. 

[tahujdt]

It is kinda... 'funny', for lack of better word, that 2 individuals can shut down everyday activities/businesses for +500k? people for more then 12(?) hours...

Is it like some form of martial law?  It does seem like it...

When they're dealing with people who are not above strapping a bomb to their chest, I think a bit of martial law is justified.

But for how long? You can't keep a city the size of Boston locked down indefinitely. And to be honest, I'm concerned about the long-term ramifications. If they're successful at catching Tsarnaev inside Boston, it'll provide a powerful precedent for locking down an entire damn city in order to do a manhunt. 

I hadn't thought of that. Damn. Hopefully they would restrict such action to dealing with terrorists.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

You can't shut down a city without the compliance of the people. Right now, the people who are disrupting their daily lives for this want to do so because a guy who might have a suicide vest is running around. This lockdown will quickly break apart in the next few days if he isn't caught.

[RedKing]

It is kinda... 'funny', for lack of better word, that 2 individuals can shut down everyday activities/businesses for +500k? people for more then 12(?) hours...

Is it like some form of martial law?  It does seem like it...

When they're dealing with people who are not above strapping a bomb to their chest, I think a bit of martial law is justified.

But for how long? You can't keep a city the size of Boston locked down indefinitely. And to be honest, I'm concerned about the long-term ramifications. If they're successful at catching Tsarnaev inside Boston, it'll provide a powerful precedent for locking down an entire damn city in order to do a manhunt. 

I hadn't thought of that. Damn. Hopefully they would restrict such action to dealing with terrorists.

And "terrorist" is such a well-defined label....>_>

What if he pulls an Eric Rudolph and goes into hiding for months? At some point (pretty damn soon) they're gonna have to start lifting restrictions or narrowing the geographical scope. The economic damage to Boston may be bigger from the lockdown than from the bombing.

[Loud Whispers]

A big rule of guns is that you never shoot to wound. You always shoot to kill. Especially in cases of crowded areas (that police often have to deal with), you can very easily miss and hit a bystander. You don't try to shoot someone in the leg, arm, or anywhere but the center of mass. People can shrug off basically everything with enough adrenaline (and/or drugs). You don't shoot for anything but the best guarantee when it's the difference between life and death. Shooting accurately is difficult enough outside of a life and death situation. If you shoot to wound, and miss, then they're going to shoot you or another person.

The reason you don't shoot to wound is because you cannot shoot to wound. The idea that you could shoot someone in the arm or leg and they'd be fine is a stupid notion that relies on sheer dumb luck and is ignorant of the fact that bullets are very good at killing things.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

There is not a part of the body that does not house some section of a major artery. Police shoot the upper body because it provides the highest chance of hitting.

I suspect that if the fellow in the black hat was shot as many times with rubber bullets as he was with real ones he would be down for the count.

The biggest risk I would consider with using lethal force and less than non-lethal force is that you run the risk of shooting an innocent person. This happened in London once during the terrorist hunts.

[Beardless]

My understanding is they have a well-defined area and are already most of the way through searching it door-to-door. I assume they'll find the guy before the end of the day, but I suppose it's possible that he may have slipped past somehow. All public transport is shut down, but in my neighborhood (nowhere near Watertown) there is some sort of roadwork going on and I hear a certain amount of traffic... the shelter-in-place order isn't keeping everyone in, and if it lasted more than a day, I doubt people would respect it. Me? I'm staying in because A)my work is closed and B)I can't stop obsessively following the (lack of) news.

(As I write this, the director of MEMA has apparently told reporters that people at work should go home. Apparently it's safe enough to drive as long as you don't pick up strangers. And aren't in/going to Watertown.)

As for economic damage, well, there's emergency funding for that. I assume it'll be available to businesses shut down today as well as those stuck in the "crime scene".

EDIT: The Onion truly has been one of the best news sources I've seen this week. Links in the spoiler:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

http://www.theonion.com/articles/authorities-sadly-there-are-many-people-who-could,32071/
http://www.theonion.com/articles/fbi-you-know-youre-desperate-when-youre-asking-the,32109/
http://www.theonion.com/articles/internet-comes-up-with-85-million-leads-on-potenti,32095/
http://www.theonion.com/articles/breaking-no-news-breaking,32113/
http://www.theonion.com/articles/breaking-still-nothing,32114/
http://www.theonion.com/articles/breaking-has-the-word-breaking-lost-all-its-meanin,32115/

I could have sworn there was also an article about the FBI combing CNN reporting for factual information but coming up dry, but I can't find it now. It was one of my favorites.

[nenjin]

CNN's banner made me chuckle. "Live coverage of the manhunt." I pictured reporters and camera crews running down the streets behind the police and military shouting "What about that guy? Is that him?"

[Neonivek]

Sadly there is no market for good news coverage.

[misko27]

The continung coverage of terrible covereage continues. Now it's TMZ: http://observer.com/2013/04/new-hashtag-pokes-fun-at-tmzs-totally-racist-coverage-of-the-boston-bombers/

[RedKing]

The continung coverage of terrible covereage continues. Now it's TMZ: http://observer.com/2013/04/new-hashtag-pokes-fun-at-tmzs-totally-racist-coverage-of-the-boston-bombers/

I think this was my favorite:

BREAKING @TMZ reporting that the mother of the alleged terror suspects instructed them to knock you out. #tmzreports

That's mocking it old-school.

[Another]

My full condolence to all whom those bastards killed or injured.

To put things into perspective - such police operations happen in Dagestan about once every month for the last 10 years. Frequent fatalities among police/special forces and much less city lockdowns.

What is interesting is that in the last 5 years or so neighboring Chechnya gets much less terrorist attacks and special operations. In 2000 there were around 1000 to 5000 fighting armed men under various commanders that declared their goal a Sharia law state on all Caucasus. By now  some of them are dead, some had surrendered, were officially pardoned by Putin's decree and are currently enlisted by Kadyrov, some retired and some flew abroad including new generation young people indoctrinated by their friends or relatives with solid practical experience in terrorism.

[Owlbread]

The man who once said that he would rather box for America than Russia. That's because Chechnya isn't independent though, as he said.

He also sought US citizenship and seemed to be on a path of Americanisation. I really hope they catch his brother so we can find out why he went completely postal.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

That Chechnya wants to become a breakaway state doesn't mean a god damn thing, Owlbread. The area is a hotbed for breeding Islamists like these guys.