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[griffinpup]

Let me specify.  Do you want to hear Dariush's reply before or after I respond to your case?

[Shinigami_King]

Hmmm... I don't know. I think Dariush would be capable of making a creative rebuttal no matter what so letting him hear other thoughts and opinions shouldn't affect his response too much. Okay. Fire away pup.

[Tiruin]

PFP

Shinigami_King:
May I comment on your case against Dariush?

Never ask permission, it makes you look scummy dude. Just say what you want.

Not necessarily scummy, but it gives the impression that you need something instead of utilizing your free will.

On another note: Smells like verbal-ability use here on the 'May I comment...' thing.

What's up, Griffin?

...Because you think house numbers are the key?

Because

There's most likely a cop or vigilante who operates on house numbers, and any scum would be very reluctant to give out their house number.

An asteroid of death on day three comes to mind.

...That would make little sense. If someone were to claim house number, how would that affect a hypothetical cop/vigilante's pick? Expound

Also, you're mentioning Ford why?

...Who isn't speaking. Somehow.

Let me specify.  Do you want to hear Dariush's reply before or after I respond to your case?

How does this matter? You're in a position to respond, aren't you?

[griffinpup]

PFP

Shinigami_King:
May I comment on your case against Dariush?

Never ask permission, it makes you look scummy dude. Just say what you want.

Not necessarily scummy, but it gives the impression that you need something instead of utilizing your free will.

On another note: Smells like verbal-ability use here on the 'May I comment...' thing.

What's up, Griffin?

I don't really understand your question.  I want to say my ceiling, but that's not what you're looking for.  What are you looking for?

...Because you think house numbers are the key?

Because

There's most likely a cop or vigilante who operates on house numbers, and any scum would be very reluctant to give out their house number.

An asteroid of death on day three comes to mind.

...That would make little sense. If someone were to claim house number, how would that affect a hypothetical cop/vigilante's pick? Expound

It makes sense.  A there's likely a cop or vigilante power that works on house numbers, not names.  A vigilante that destroys a house, but not a person, for example.  Sounds familiar?  It seems only logical that there's a cop with the same restriction.  When a cop with this restriction knows who lives in a house number, they get a confirmed townie or scum or whatever if they inspect it.  That means that there's more incentive for them to inspect houses they know the occupant of.

Also, you're mentioning Ford why?

Because if his claim it true, he acts as a form of vigilante.

Let me specify.  Do you want to hear Dariush's reply before or after I respond to your case?

How does this matter? You're in a position to respond, aren't you?

When I scumhunt, I usually prefer for the person in question to respond to my points first.  It allows me to see what they actually think, and doesn't let them piggyback off of other arguments.  I was wondering if Shinigami cared.  It looks like I won't have time to bring up the things that I wanted soon anyways, so it doesn't really matter.

[Leafsnail]

One thing that debunks that case. You're believing his first statement: Ye Claim. Where I see it: you're believing his claim, and then attacking him for an error due to something related to the claim. Said error equals stalling in the form of suspicious actions due to knowledge along the lines of 'I must attain this objective by meeting [SPECIFIC_GENDER].'

I'm not believing his first statement, I'm saying I don't believe it!  I'm really not sure where you got that impression from.

His defense: 'Guaranteed kill'. When actually, it could be the chance of them picking him (which I guess is part of your basis). From this statement, I could judge that he believes the mafiakill to be a house visit-thing judging by his speculation on roleblocks/redirects: here. At the first day, we had 16 people and 14 houses, there was bound to be places which had either extras, or homeless people at game start. One area got bully-evicted, the other got...quit-closed. Now? It would be 14 people, 12 houses. Which is what we've got now. We have the case of dual pairing here: me and Deathsword; whoever the other two in our houses are, either won't claim, or (as I think of it), are probably bullies or the original homeless players. (Though..beginning the game with a bully in the same house? Too much theoretical thinking at the moment.)

His defence is bullshit.  If he was worried that revealing his number would make him a target for the mafia then what he actually should have done was not claimed at all.  If we are to believe his claim then he claimed even though he gained absolutely no benefit by doing so.

Again: let's imagine that Cado's claim is true, and also that there's a town boy out there, and he believes Cado, and he decides he wants to help him.  Without Cado's number he can't do shit.  Cado still has the same, random chance of meeting a boy in the night as he did before.

Anyway: Panic..going back to the main point: he's thinking it's a sure kill on the mafia side. I'd agree with you on the lying about role thing, but I can't see in any other way on how that'd be formed as a lie (relying on gender..that's one thing to look out for. Lenglon mentioned some romance point in her PM, something which is also vaguely hinted in mine..somehow). Plus: it would be such a glaring act requiring the gall to claim such (and then flail afterwards) to still be scum after your own plan has been foiled..by yourself.


Which would, in its essence, be a totally horrid waste of time, equaling a very flail-y third-party. While I'm pretty annoyed at his antics, it doesn't match up when you mark him as a mafia member ('Hey guys let's do x and y and do z and a on Day 2 so...') because that would either mark him as a true actor, or someone who has messed up the communication lines.

I agree that Cado probably wouldn't be smart or bold enough to make up a claim like that, but the thing is he doesn't need to be.  I'm starting to suspect that one of his partners created the claim for him, and then he hamhanded the execution by adding contradictory details to it and not properly thinking through what someone with his claimed role would actually want to do.

The motive would be to make people trust Cado due to the "I don't think Cado could make up a claim like that" factor.

I say nay, my dear snail. His inspect marks a number. Whether house number or number of people in a house targeted (I blame grammar for claim reasons, or my own comprehension is dipping low due to time of day here..), I leaned on the latter when I answered him back.

Because he tells the truth. I am in house 7 (in which my ability of today is useless to help with), and I've got some guy with me who stayed the night over, in a cordial peace. Or as far as I could tell anyway.

When I say "pseudo-cop", I mean the ability of the claimed role to detect whether a male player is town or not.  I don't mean the inspection ability he claimed, which is terrible.  It's worse than simply visiting a house, in fact - if you visit a house you get a headcount and silhouettes.  The only "advantage" is that you don't show up at the scene, which barely counts.

Which would also equal to something that goes between threat, and neutral possibility. He's a third-party, and I've no qualms to disbelieve that (But if he IS mafia, then either his buddies got my location; that dude with me is one of his buddies..which really strikes me weird because of how the silhouette looks or something else, which doesn't really make much sense to me).

You're saying that the silhouette you saw looks town, or something?  I really don't think you can tell alignment just from a silhouette.

If a player is in a house, that is only when an ability can work: Said abilities affect either the house, or the location, or people in transit. I've no ability at the moment which does any of the above but I'm really believing that abilities must act in such a manner:
> The ability user must be stable in a house and not in transit.

I'd like to ask you what you think about the mafia faction and their factional kill given that you've proposed a plan such as that. I'm guessing they've a factional kill--used by one of their members each night--and the others can roam around freely with their abilities and whatnot. They can appear harmless, but then they'd know which silhouettes belong to who and watch the thread for what subtle claims exist (as I'm pretty much singled out now, but in that way I'm backing up Ranger's claim).

I understand your point now.  I think there'd still be protective value in the plan, though - I'm pretty sure mafia members would not be able to go to one house and kill somebody in another, because that would make the entire system essentially meaningless.  So regardless of how they use their factional kill this would either stop them from using it or make it much easier to identify who is doing it.

[RangerCado]

Leafsnail: Okay, yet there is still a big problem with what your doing, regardless of my alignment. Your tunnelling me like Dariush is. Your aren't avoiding peoples questions (from what i can see) and your actually thinking about your case on me. I'm leaning-town on you for this, but if your convinced i'm scum, search for the others too.

[zombie urist]

RangerCado: Please please please learn the difference between "your" and "you're".

Just to get this right, you originally voted me for not responding to your questions in my next post?  My post that amounted to one question?  You then reiterate your vote AFTER reading this?

Yeah I did. What are you gonna do about it. 

Regardless, I'll answer your questions.  I've been busy unusually buys in RL, so I haven't been able to put in enough time to justify me placing my vote on someone.  I've mostly been focusing on Cado because that's pretty much all that's happened today.  I'm not sure about his actual alignment, as his actions are illogical both from a town perspective, a third party perspective, (the third party he claimed.  He may be a SK or something that didn't want people to freak out when he was found third party.  His lack of elaboration on his flavor seems to agree with this.), and scum perspective.  Apart from the obvious mistake in his case, it's fairly accurate, and I agree with most of his points.
Any more questions?  From anyone?

Do you believe his claim? What obvious mistake? Also what do you have to say about your post that basically repeated Dariush's post?

[ToonyMan]

Vote Count

(1)Griffion - Zombie Urist
(2)Leafsnail - Notquitethere, Tiruin
(0)Captain Ford -
(0)Toaster -
(0)Tiruin -
(2)Dariush - RangerCado, Shinigami_King
(0)Zombie Urist -
(0)Phantom of the Library -
(0)Shinigami_King -
(4)RangerCado - Toaster, Dariush, Deathsword, Leafsnail
(0)Deathsword -
(0)Notquitethere -
(0)Solifuge -
(0)Birdy51 -

(5)Not Voting: Giffion, Captain Ford, Phantom of the Library, Solifuge, Birdy51

Day 2 will last until Monday 6/17 at 11 PM EST

[Dariush]

Phew, the worst of the exams are over. Technically I have two more, but they are a much lesser problem. _{Seriously, who thought putting both history of Ukraine and history of Ukrainian culture as two separate subjects for computer sciences is a good idea...}

Cado, you're fuckdamn stupid. In case you haven't noticed (or rather noticed, but chose to ignore it, because you're fuckdamn stupid), my secondary target aka Solifuge has been lurking his ass off and I drew everyone's attention to it. But you ignored it, because you're fuckdamn stupid, and continued accusing me of tunneling. My tertiary target aka Shitnigami is being ruthlessly ignored by me oh wait no I am actually addressing to him the majority of my posts, but you ignored it, because you're fuckdamn stupid.

Oh, and on the subject of tunneling - the textbook definition is 'relentlessly attacking someone without any or extremely weak reasons'. And yet the only defense you have presented to me is that I am only attacking you. Except I am not, but you ignored it, because you're fuckdamn stupid.

Also, in your relentless pointing out to big bad Dariush and big bad Leafsnail that they are not doing anything except attacking poor little Cado (which isn't true, but you're fuckdamn stupid) you also completely accidentally missed the fact that you aren't doing absolutely anything else. Your best case is 'Y U ONLY ATTACK ME'. Your only 'suspects' are people who are attacking you for completely valid reasons. You don't even attempt to explain your behaviour beyond 'You only attack me (this is untrue,  but you ignored it, because you're fuckdamn stupid), therefore I don't have to defend against your accusations'. You are literally of no worth to the town (and this subforum, to be honest) because all you're doing is wasting space and throwing votes randomly, harming the town. Oh, and you're a fuckdamn stupid hypocrite, but you probably already guessed that.

Shitnigami, if you think I am going to read all that crap you threw at me, you're deeply mistaken. You didn't address me a single time during the entire game (or maybe you did, but it was RVS questions, because all your content was RVS questions, so that doesn't really matter), you randomly slung RVS questions at people and the moment someone reacted, you immediatly voted him and revealed deeper meaning beyond the manifestation of your laziness, like some kind of an expressionist 'artist' calling two scribbles art and vomited a completely pointless WoT that probably quoted every single of my posts and explained how every single one shows I am scum, Antichrist and an alien simultaneously without bothering to as much as hiccup in anyone else's direction at any point in those proceedings. Good going, scum.

[Dariush]

Also, as of right now, Solifuge has made 42 posts in the 10 days he has been completely absent from this thread. Those posts were neatly spread over the space of those ten days, as opposed to being gathered together. He found time to do posts like this, this and this. Between all those WoTs (with pictures) he didn't find time to drop a single note here. According to Toony, he has been prodded several times. If that is not intentional hardcore scum lurking, I don't even know what is.

[griffinpup]

Dariush, I'm pretty sure prefixing swear words WITH swear words still counts as swearing.

[Toaster]

Tiruin:

Toaster

Tiruin:  My read on Ranger is that he's full of poop.  Disinterested (as opposed to pro or anti town) third party is my definition of his claim- not that I believe it.

"And? I can obviously see you're disagreeing with him. But what have you other than a general prod in his direction?"

--

Toaster: What do you see in Ranger? His motive, guessing what mud you're seeing on him?

At best, he's unhelpful third party.  At worst, he's a mafia member (if so, you're probably his buddy by how far you're going out of your way to defend him.)  His motive is trying to get himself not targeted/lynched.  As has been said multiple times, his claim and his actions do not match up.

PFP Query to those voting Ranger: "How would a claimed Third-Party (despite his antics) be seen as scum due to his flippety-jumpyness? He also has an inspect--something of which would be fairly deadly in scum's hands, but if he flips scum (wherein I read flailing non-mafia), then it would prove that bullies attack via houses--Is that mainly the case on Ms. Cado?"

The first sentence simply makes no sense.  Why are you so ready to believe his claim?  And what?  How the hell would his flipping scum prove anything other than he's a lying liar who lies a lot?

Confirmed third-party

I think you need to reasses your definition of the word "confirmed."

All that, and the notion that most votes on Ranger stem on the probable house-fishing, as well as reluctance to claim his house number. Where's the scumminess in that? None of you voting for him state how.

This is chainsaw-defense level of obtuseness.  It's been said repeatedly why this makes no sense- he claims he needs someone to VISIT HIM to win, and yet he won't give out his house number, hiding behind the ridiculous notion that scum might want to kill him, a claimed non-town.

"Come on, Leafsnail-san, you've had all this time to think about the notion, and you come up with a probability? Explain how that could be a lie, because at best, your case leads to suspicions and not sure footing.

BZZZZZZZZ FIRE UP THAT CHAINSAW


Ranger:

Toaster: When i win its locked, Just like the empty houses... atleast i don't think we can action those. And yes i'm afraid i would be NKed, i have no protection against it.

Okay, I misunderstood you there.

Toaster: You've made no attempts to figure out my alignment beyond, he's backtracking get him. What is your opinion of me now? Who besides me do you think is a bully? Why haven't you contributed anything to the day besides pokes at me?

Because I'm quite convinced, and everything you (and at this point, Tiruin) post just further confirms it for me.  Like I said, the only risk to lynching you is lynching a useless alignment instead of a scum one.  Nerjin/IG/Birdy is likely scum, and Tiruin is looking worse and worse.

NQT: For now atleast. And letting me win only helps town to a certain extent. Town still loses a vote helping them, but they'll gain a confirmed Townie if a male visits me alone.

And who will confirm that townie?  Not you, since you'll be gone.  We also have no guarantee that said male will return (your word on it is worth nothing.)

-Why don't you go scum hunting for a bully instead of taking the lazy route like Dariush? Your killing me for not being town, because theres no reason not to? You lose a vote trying to help the town!

"You should be scumhunting someone other than me" is not a valid defense.


Speaking of Birdy, I need to read his material, but let me get this out first.

[Toaster]

Oh, that was lazy of me.  He's done nothing but defend Ranger, so yeah, probably scum.

[Tiruin]

PFP

That's quite the narrow viewpoint you've got there, as well as the lack of definitives, Toaster. I take it you're not seeing my context on him when you accuse me of 'defending'? Explain how I would go out of my way to defend someone flailing like that, given your take on me.

[Phantom of The Library]

Request replacement.