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Author Topic: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Scumteam Wins!)  (Read 45663 times)

borno

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #75 on: April 13, 2013, 12:19:02 am »

Nerjin:
borno: I’ve seen you around before. Do you feel previous experience has prepared you for future mafia games? The previous is yes/no so have another question: What is the single most important piece of information you’ve learned in mafia so far and why?
Kind of. While I am definitely better than I was, say, a few months ago, I still don't feel all too confident in my abilities. I think that the most important thing I've learnt is to just keep my cool. If I stay calm then I'm able to contribute to scum-hunting better and people will generally have a more townish-read from me whereas if I get angry (see: last BM I was in) I'm very likely to mess up my own game and people will think that I am scummy.
swordsmith04:
swordsmith04: You’re scum and one player seems uncomfortably close to figuring you out. However he has also been dropping a few scum-tells himself. How do you react?

Attacking my questioner will only confirm to them that I'm scum. Even I do manage to get the town to lynch the guy, he'll flip town and that will draw attention to me. It's really a question of 'Do I want to die now, or tomorrow?' The answer would be 'Let's take a townie with me.' Ideally, I'd argue effectively enough that everyone would assume the scummy townie had a bad read, but I don't believe for a second that I'm capable of diverting attention like that at my current skill level.
But if you were to be lynched would all your cases not be dismissed when you flip scum?
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RangerCado

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #76 on: April 13, 2013, 12:22:04 am »

Nerjin: *long whistle* Thats a toughie. RoleClaiming Doctor at anytime seems a very scummy thing to do and i would pose heavy questioning of anyone tried this.

 Can't post anymore without it seeming silly as i'm not very lucid when tired. (long day at school then tons of homework and helping paint the inside of my house) See you all when the bunnies come out or whatever obscure reference i'm trying to make.  ciao?
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Scelly9

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #77 on: April 13, 2013, 12:37:33 am »

Griffionday (0) --
RangerCado (0) --
borno (0) --
Imperial Guardsman (2) -- Spectr, Deathsword
Okami No Rei (1) -- Griffionday
swordsmith04 (1) -- Okami No Rei
Spectr (0) --
Nerjin (1) -- RangerCado
Deathsword (0) --
--------------------------------------------------
Day will end at 16/04/2013 (DD/MM/YYYY) at 18:00 GMT. There are 48:00 hours left.
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Imperial Guardsman

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #78 on: April 13, 2013, 06:35:07 am »

Imperial Guardsman:
It is N1, and you are the cop. There are two players you are debating over investigating, a lurking player and an active yet scummy player. Who do you choose to inspect?
the scummy player. if he was ACTIVElurking, then the lurker
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Imperial Guardsman

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #79 on: April 13, 2013, 06:38:49 am »

Imperial Guardian when trying to find scum what are the telltale signs you look for?
Active lurking ( trying to look active )
Bandwagoning ( voting just because that person has the most votes }
OMGUS ( voting because the person voted you )
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Imperial Guardsman

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #80 on: April 13, 2013, 06:40:41 am »

Imperial Guardsman, how do you plan to hunt scum?
See my answer to spectr
if i see those signs, i will point them out.
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Imperial Guardsman

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #81 on: April 13, 2013, 06:44:10 am »

Imperial Guardsman: Your skills seem a little high up for a mining job… If you had a power role for either mafia or town which role would you want the most? Why?
scum godfather, town cop
cop, so i can see who is scum and thin numbers
godfather, for its ability
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Imperial Guardsman

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #82 on: April 13, 2013, 06:46:18 am »

Deathsword,You are a mafia godfather and you are going to roleclaim
Do you roleclaim Townie, Cop, or Doctor? Why?
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Nerjin

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #83 on: April 13, 2013, 10:15:37 am »

Quote from: Imperial Guardsman
=posts several times in a row=

[[Please try not to post multiple times like this in a row. It makes it harder to follow and it makes it look like you don't think out your posts. It's fine if you mess up from time to time I'm just saying try not to do this.]]
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Teneb

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #84 on: April 13, 2013, 11:16:38 am »

Deathsword:
Right, my bad.

Wasn't replacing the Doctor with a Jailer suggested as a way to level the playing field and make the game more difficult for scum?  How does this work in your opinion?
It makes the game harder for scum since in a setup like this one, if the cop claims the doctor (if there is one) will protect the cop every single night. This means every other player is completely unprotected, meaning the scum can kill anyone they want. With a jailor, the player with that role can choose to protect the cop... but it will prevent the cop from acting. Instead that player will try to protect other players, or even try to hit scum with their ability.

DeathSword, do you prefer to be town or mafia? How do you play as the team you least prefer?
Town, but I don't really mind either team. I (try) play both the same way. Playing a different way when you are scum is generally a bad idea. Scum should try to play like town.

Deathsword: You’re an IC too. Nifty. From how the game has been played what are you feelings on the new players? Your fellow IC? Yourself?
It's a bit too early to say. Some of the new players are doing well. Some, not so much. All of them could, and should, improve. As for you, too early in the game to say. As for myself, I am myself.

Anyone who wants to answer a hypothetical question: This is a simple thing I’m curious about. I won’t expect an answer though as it’s not too relevant. You can stop reading now: Day 4 and no night kills have occurred. How do you react? All players are fairly active.
The scum could be not perfoming kills, the doctor (or doctors, assuming there are any) could have been very good with their protecting. Either way, scumhunting should proceed as normal.

Swordsmith

snip
Why is the N1 save the least important?

N1 save is the least important in my mind because there are more members on N1 than there are on subsequent nights. Whether the save is made N1 or not, the balance of town to scum is still largely in favor of town, but the longer the game goes the less town members there are, and the more pressure there is to get the save right. It's not that the N1 save isn't important, it's just that the later night saves are more important.
{The only way to "waste" a protect (try to use this term insteado "save") is to not use it at all. I'd say the best target for a N1 protect is a player that has neither been very agressive nor scummy. Scum often hit those players.}

swordsmith04: You’re scum and one player seems uncomfortably close to figuring you out. However he has also been dropping a few scum-tells himself. How do you react?

Attacking my questioner will only confirm to them that I'm scum. Even I do manage to get the town to lynch the guy, he'll flip town and that will draw attention to me. It's really a question of 'Do I want to die now, or tomorrow?' The answer would be 'Let's take a townie with me.' Ideally, I'd argue effectively enough that everyone would assume the scummy townie had a bad read, but I don't believe for a second that I'm capable of diverting attention like that at my current skill level.
{Never say you are not good enough until you tried to do it. Often attacking is the best solution, and you can simply explain his flip by pointing out his scumtells.}

Imperial Guardsman:
It is N1, and you are the cop. There are two players you are debating over investigating, a lurking player and an active yet scummy player. Who do you choose to inspect?
the scummy player. if he was ACTIVElurking, then the lurker
Why?
{Even if people don't ask why, you should give reasons. Otherwise you'll get lynched quite fast}

Imperial Guardsman, how do you plan to hunt scum?
See my answer to spectr
if i see those signs, i will point them out.
{Ok. Let me tell you something. Just waiting for others to slip is bad. VERY bad. Horrible bad. Doing that will earn you votes against you, and I am keeping my vote as a player on you due to that. It is lazy and scummy. You should go and hunt, instead of sitting around activelurking. Yes, what you are attempting to do is activelurking. And that's terrible}

Imperial Guardian when trying to find scum what are the telltale signs you look for?
Active lurking ( trying to look active )
Bandwagoning ( voting just because that person has the most votes }
OMGUS ( voting because the person voted you )
Are these the only scummy things to you? Why are they scummy to you? Why are they more scummy than other things?

Deathsword,You are a mafia godfather and you are going to roleclaim
Do you roleclaim Townie, Cop, or Doctor? Why?
If I was a mafia godfather and it was a massclaim, it would depend on who has claimed yet. If everyone but me has claimed and there is no doctor, I might claim doctor. But most likely I'd claim townie.

Also, make a single post. Like this one.
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Griffionday

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #85 on: April 13, 2013, 01:22:26 pm »

Imperial Guardsman:
scum godfather, town cop
cop, so i can see who is scum and thin numbers
godfather, for its ability
Do you think the role-blocker is more or less powerful than the Godfather to the mafia's cause?  Why?


RangerCado:
Nerjin: *long whistle* Thats a toughie. RoleClaiming Doctor at anytime seems a very scummy thing to do and i would pose heavy questioning of anyone tried this.

 Can't post anymore without it seeming silly as i'm not very lucid when tired. (long day at school then tons of homework and helping paint the inside of my house) See you all when the bunnies come out or whatever obscure reference i'm trying to make.  ciao?
The bunnies have come and gone...


Swordsmith;
N1 save is the least important in my mind because there are more members on N1 than there are on subsequent nights. Whether the save is made N1 or not, the balance of town to scum is still largely in favor of town, but the longer the game goes the less town members there are, and the more pressure there is to get the save right. It's not that the N1 save isn't important, it's just that the later night saves are more important.

So you measure the importance of the role by how likely it is to be successful?  I'd define that as usefullness, and say that I think the importance of a role is what it's capable of doing, in the case of a doctor allowing the town an additional day to scum-hunt.  Now I've not gotten to the late game, so I don't know if an additional day right before lylo is more valuable than one right at the beginning.  Do you think that by this definition of importance, N1 is still the least important?


borno:
But if you were to be lynched would all your cases not be dismissed when you flip scum?
Why would you dismiss a case just because it was held by a scum?  What if the scum were involved in attempting to distance each other, and arguing against the other?  Wouldn't it be a good idea to be MORE careful when examining their cases rather than just lynching?


Nerjin:
Do you find that asking everyone questions at the same time gets you through the awkward stage of RVS quicker or if focusing on a handful is a better strategy in these (BM sized) games?  What about larger games?
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swordsmith04

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #86 on: April 13, 2013, 05:55:57 pm »

Swordsmith;
N1 save is the least important in my mind because there are more members on N1 than there are on subsequent nights. Whether the save is made N1 or not, the balance of town to scum is still largely in favor of town, but the longer the game goes the less town members there are, and the more pressure there is to get the save right. It's not that the N1 save isn't important, it's just that the later night saves are more important.

So you measure the importance of the role by how likely it is to be successful?  I'd define that as usefullness, and say that I think the importance of a role is what it's capable of doing, in the case of a doctor allowing the town an additional day to scum-hunt.  Now I've not gotten to the late game, so I don't know if an additional day right before lylo is more valuable than one right at the beginning.  Do you think that by this definition of importance, N1 is still the least important?
'Important' and 'useful' are practically synonyms in this case. As for whether N1 is still the least important, yes, I think so. Early game, there's less information to discern the scum. An additional town-member at that time is only another theory. Later in the game, there's more possible evidence, more chances for the scum to slip up have occurred, etc. Another town member at that point might mean the difference between a town and a scum victory.



swordsmith04:
swordsmith04: You’re scum and one player seems uncomfortably close to figuring you out. However he has also been dropping a few scum-tells himself. How do you react?

Attacking my questioner will only confirm to them that I'm scum. Even I do manage to get the town to lynch the guy, he'll flip town and that will draw attention to me. It's really a question of 'Do I want to die now, or tomorrow?' The answer would be 'Let's take a townie with me.' Ideally, I'd argue effectively enough that everyone would assume the scummy townie had a bad read, but I don't believe for a second that I'm capable of diverting attention like that at my current skill level.
But if you were to be lynched would all your cases not be dismissed when you flip scum?
Depends on the town, but if one player was on to me, the rest probably wouldn't be far behind.

Nerjin

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #87 on: April 13, 2013, 09:37:35 pm »

Nerjin:
Do you find that asking everyone questions at the same time gets you through the awkward stage of RVS quicker or if focusing on a handful is a better strategy in these (BM sized) games?  What about larger games?

Asking everyone questions at once is much better than just handful in my opinion. You may ask yourself why? Well the simple thing is that it gives me a read of some sort on EVERY player at once. If I focused on a handful I'd get less info. I've done this in every game to my recollection aside from the bastard mod I'm in right now.
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Griffionday

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #88 on: April 13, 2013, 11:17:20 pm »

Swordsmith:
'Important' and 'useful' are practically synonyms in this case. As for whether N1 is still the least important, yes, I think so. Early game, there's less information to discern the scum. An additional town-member at that time is only another theory. Later in the game, there's more possible evidence, more chances for the scum to slip up have occurred, etc. Another town member at that point might mean the difference between a town and a scum victory.
But wouldn't a blocked scum kill at any point provide the town with one more member for each successive night as well as another pair of eyes to pour over the tells in the thread?  Thus wouldn't it make sense that the doctor is more important N1 when he can keep the scum from offing the best hunters?

Depends on the town, but if one player was on to me, the rest probably wouldn't be far behind.
Attacking my questioner will only confirm to them that I'm scum. Even I do manage to get the town to lynch the guy, he'll flip town and that will draw attention to me. It's really a question of 'Do I want to die now, or tomorrow?' The answer would be 'Let's take a townie with me.' Ideally, I'd argue effectively enough that everyone would assume the scummy townie had a bad read, but I don't believe for a second that I'm capable of diverting attention like that at my current skill level.
You seem awfully concerned that your scum game isn't up to snuff.  Nervous about this game or trying to make us complacent?


Nerjin:
And how useful do you think those reads typically are?  You say some sort of reads all at once; what I'm wondering is if the people who cycle through the players tend to think they get more solid reads on the select players they talk to.
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borno

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Re: BM XL: Miner's Mafia (Full)
« Reply #89 on: April 14, 2013, 12:07:19 am »

Griffionday:
Why have you decided to only ask Nerjin questions about asking everyone a question in RVS, even though I did it too? Are you doing what you said earlier, attacking your scumpartner so that you look like you've distanced yourself from him?
borno:
But if you were to be lynched would all your cases not be dismissed when you flip scum?
Why would you dismiss a case just because it was held by a scum?  What if the scum were involved in attempting to distance each other, and arguing against the other?  Wouldn't it be a good idea to be MORE careful when examining their cases rather than just lynching?
You would dismiss a case held by scum because the mafia aren't exactly a trustworthy source. There is about 50/50 chance of mafia attacking their scumbuddy or a random person. Sure, you could start up a new case against them, but it isn't good to use a proven mafia's case against someone. Remember Nuke in cult mafia? He did it except in reverse and got the guy lynched. I'd bet that if he were to be lynched before Daruish his case would of disappeared, and Daruish wouldn't have been lynched.
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