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[Toaster]

Tiruin:

Basically it's based off reads and gut, but the whole "we're brothers and win if the other wins" bit was the clincher.  That was confirmed by Web in lover chat, stated clearly and unequivocally.

This states stuff. General stuff, but you're pointing back again to the Brothers' bond. Like, that tipped the scales due to that thinking--if he was scum and you were not, and scum was lynched: win. You don't have to die as you've fulfilled your wincon.

Now let me restate it. Can you tell me why TolyK is town to you? How much scumhunting did you do anyway? It's all intangible to the eyes of us who choose to be single.

Basically, once I went to get a read on him (late D1 when I was making all those references to digging) I went down all his posts and tried to get a read on him.  It came back fairly null, so I pretty much skipped him to come back later.  Before later came, I got clarification from Web that the Brother wincon was either/or with town.  I pointed out to him that there was zero reason to claim anything other than actual alignment, and he reaffirmed his townhood.  That was good enough for me.

First, because my drunk self was a bit too blunt about my opinion of TolyK.  Second, because drawing a line from claimed vig to SK when the game doesn't end with the death of the last mafia member is a pretty obvious logical leap.  Third, I fully expected the game to be over now so I wasn't thinking too hard.

Can you think hard now?

About TolyK?  He's town because he'd be an idiot to not tell me if he wasn't.


Griff:

Toaster:

First, because my drunk self was a bit too blunt about my opinion of TolyK.  Second, because drawing a line from claimed vig to SK when the game doesn't end with the death of the last mafia member is a pretty obvious logical leap.  Third, I fully expected the game to be over now so I wasn't thinking too hard.

It's a pretty obvious logical leap unless you're 100% sure that he's not scum of any sort.  I'm assuming this means that while you know each other will win with the other, the brother win-con doesn't explicitly state what alignment the other is?

Right.  The Brother wincon is "You win if TolyK wins" without any further detail.

[Tiruin]

I pointed out to him that there was zero reason to claim anything other than actual alignment, and he reaffirmed his townhood.  That was good enough for me.
[...]
About TolyK?  He's town because he'd be an idiot to not tell me if he wasn't.

...So he just said that he's town, and that you believed him straight there? :/

You know, whether you're scum, or he's scum--the townie one of you would still win if scum dies, however if scum lives, then we'd all have to die to get him to win, except for his brother...

There's a situation there.

[Toaster]

Plus, if one of us was scum and the other was town, we wouldn't really give a shit who won or lost.

[RangerCado]

Tiruin: By what you see i'm assuming my lynch protect. First i wanted to save it for use on someone who i thought was town. Second, it protected against other hostile abilities during the day (auto) so if someone had a day kill i'd rather the protects be activated by that rather than people trying to lynch me.

[Tiruin]

Plus, if one of us was scum and the other was town, we wouldn't really give a shit who won or lost.

That's my point :/ If town--the death of your brother benefits the masses, though.

Tiruin: By what you see i'm assuming my lynch protect. First i wanted to save it for use on someone who i thought was town. Second, it protected against other hostile abilities during the day (auto) so if someone had a day kill i'd rather the protects be activated by that rather than people trying to lynch me.

Yeah, Comes off as strange to me. You pleaded for life @D1, did nothing during N1, and then later inspected based on...a claim.

Questions are:
> Why'd you pick your targets during that time?
Why'd you pick your targets...

> Answer my question here.

>

Day 2- Day inspected NQT

Night 2- Used redirect on NQT and Vector

So as you got a Town read on NQT, Why would you redirect Vector to NQT?

>

-Either will activate on myself if their conditions are met.

So that means you 'protected' TolyK because conditions are met, huh.

[Vector]

I'm a Charismage.  I've none'd every night.

I have an auto that means I can't be night-killed (I'm too han'some!),
an ability that lets me move one person's vote to the target of my choice per day,
and a one-shot that lets me give everyone else the first ability for one night.  It's a bardish sort of a thing.

I'm saving the last one for if we fail LYLO.

I tried to get TheWetSheep to hammer himself the other day because I was pretty fucking sure he was scum, but that didn't work so well.  Apparently there's some limitations.  Also, apparently he wasn't scum.


Anyway, I still think TolyK is some sort of scum, (leaning SK) as I've said, and I wouldn't be surprised if the scum weren't trying to get us via attrition (... especially me, because I'm obviously playing with less and less strength).  It would be unusual, but it'd certainly be a valid way to win.

It's a long shot, though.

[Tiruin]

Charis?

Anyway, actions from the past days? Only targeted TWS?

Anyway, I still think TolyK is some sort of scum, (leaning SK) as I've said, and I wouldn't be surprised if the scum weren't trying to get us via attrition (... especially me, because I'm obviously playing with less and less strength).  It would be unusual, but it'd certainly be a valid way to win.

How would this work? Not NK'ing and boring us out?

[Vector]

Oh, sorry.  My element is "social skills."  I'm basically a motivational speaker type... haha, at the time I chose it because Imiknorris said he was taking mathematics, so I took what I saw as the "rival element."

I've only targeted TWS, yeah.


Well, okay.  If I were scum and following that tack, I'd have a list of people I considered weak--I'd have to have a plan of who I was going to try to drop, and how--and try to make things slightly more difficult for them.  I'd have to have well-established town cred, and possibly be a bit worried about the NK getting bounced back to me, or about being detected.  Basically, I'd have to feel like my day game was better than my night game.

The problem is with that theory, though, that most of the attrition has affected the scumteam.  It'd probably have to be someone who was frustrated with that and decided to get even.

Eh?

[Tiruin]

Hmm, reasonable there--scum died out on replacements and time...would be pretty funny to see town bickering and killing each other. Still, why didn't you act during one of the nights back them if you can aid a vote/lynch? It's just like TWS' power, if I'm not mistaken.

[Vector]

Huh?  No, it's a day action, and it doesn't just give me an extra vote--it takes away someone's.  D2 TWS hammered against my knowledge (remember, wasn't paying that much attention to the vote counts?) and D1 the lynch was tight between two people I was ambivalent on.  D3 it didn't frickin' work.

I'm not into the school of thought that says vigs should kill every night, and stuff like that (like, you know, TolyK's "LOL poisoned someone").  You should use your power when you're pretty sure it's going to be pro-town.

Basically, what I'm trying to say is that there are games when I'm really sure of myself, and games when I'm not; in general, in the latter sort I'm very careful with my power roles.  The air is kind of muddy in this game, so I've been more stingy with my abilities.

[Tiruin]

PFP

Do you know if your revive protects you from a lynch? And if it does would we get to see your role in that case?

...I have no idea. It says it takes twice more to bring me down but I'm guessing that it only pertains to actions and not the lynch? PM'd Web.

Got the PM.

Nope, it works just like that game before--I revive upon anything that would kill me. Anything, even the lynch.

No, you wouldn't get to see my role (but you'd see a lot of chat in the deadchat when I die), but what you would see is me reviving. So...yeah.

I tried to get TheWetSheep to hammer himself the other day because I was pretty fucking sure he was scum, but that didn't work so well.  Apparently there's some limitations.  Also, apparently he wasn't scum.

Could you give that ability then, non-verbatim? Limitations don't sound good seeing as TWS' power only lay in that he can't be redirected. Somehow, 'redirect' meant his vote, too...I think.

[Vector]

Once per day, I can change someone's vote target.

It doesn't say the word "redirect," though.  Seriously, I have no idea why it didn't work.

[Griffionday]

Vector:

Once per day, I can change someone's vote target.

It doesn't say the word "redirect," though.  Seriously, I have no idea why it didn't work.

Oh. For those wondering about why Vector's ability didn't work, my auto is that I can't be forced to do anything, such as change my target or be forced to do an action. I also can't be persuaded.

Sorry about the incomplete claim, I was rushing.

Do you have any idea why you're featured so prominently in the flavor? Do you think it has any relevance to the game whatsoever?

I found at least one useful thing while hunting through Wuba's flavor:
BAM! Validation of her claim. At least part of it.

[Vector]

Why I'm featured so prominently in the flavor?  Well, my element IS social skills.  That would make sense.  I also think that I used to be a lyncher to Imiknorris.

Otherwise, not really... ?

[Griffionday]

Why I'm featured so prominently in the flavor?  Well, my element IS social skills.  That would make sense.  I also think that I used to be a lyncher to Imiknorris.

Otherwise, not really... ?

Spoiler: Captain Ford (click to show/hide)

Ah, so I guess the idea was that UI had your mathemagem. I wondered about that, since Wuba searching the people he's knocked out implies that there was a single individual who had your gem, and not a group.

So when UI died, your wincon changed to...?

And why didn't you mention this in your fullclaim?