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[Toaster]

Notquitethere:  Talking to you here.

NQT:

- Why am I saying all of this? Knowledge is town's weapon. Without it, we mislynch. Scum already know who to kill so telling them information doesn't help them very much. The more we know, the better chance we have at winning this. Obviously, you all have to weigh up the risks and benefits yourself, but if anyone has any other pertinent information that you don't think you'll be killed for saying then please share.

Okay, Mister Information, why don't you tell us what you did last night, then?

[Griffionday]

Zrk2:

Do you have another ability that lets you read the names of the abilities to match?  How is this intended to work if you can't get the names of their abilities?

If I can't get the names of abilities then I'm in trouble.

That doesn't answer my question.  Obviously you don't want to answer it, why?

I mean that you have been all over someone in one post, and then ignored/softballed them in the next. It's like you can't orient yourself or feel confident in your vote. You scumhunting being iffy is in and of itself a result. It means you aren't comfortable in that role and that means you can't be town.

So your case on Tiruin is that she is doing a poor job scumhunting?

You are still missing several points of this post.

Hapah:

I do actually have a couple other statments I'd like truth tested:
This is a game with X Mafia and Y 3rd parties where X>1 & Y>=0.
There is no cult.
We are not in a like bastard mod.

But I'll accept getting a confirmed town/scum read if you'd prefer.

[TolyK]

Now for content

TolyK

I have information that would be helpful to you, NQT.
Not claiming anything yet, though.

You had my hopes up there for a moment! I can understand your reticence. Let's see if I can convince you otherwise.

It's not only that I don't want to tell you quite yet, it's also that I'd be telling everyone.

Funny thing, you're mentioning it. Now you're teasing the fishing line.

It's also that you'd have been better off not mentioning it in the first place. Why do you keep on coming back at it?

He was interested, and thus I explained why I'm not completely cooperating.

PPE:
Hapah, I'd prefer to get the Total Town Thing.

[Hapah]

PFP

I only get a single statement to confirm, though. I could maybe take the cult one if everyone would prefer, but the others don't give us immediately useful and actionable info like the confirmed read does.

PPE: Do you mean the read on Toaster or people claiming they are town?

[Tiruin]

Zrk: Is that all you've got on Tir?

I had a whole post, but I deleted it and I haven't had the time to make another solid one. NO exam tomorrow so I'll be able to do it then.

I'd be expectant of it.

As for now, I really suggest you take it off and focus on your studies...Because exams. We've an extend going in anyway.

Zrk - Wat.

On Tiruin:
You have been inconsistent on your scumhunting, most notably on TolyK, then you have tried to minimize/deflect the cases presented against you instead of addressing them. Your scumhunting has been hit and miss and your responses have not been conducive to good scumhunting by others.

Oh dear me. You conclude much without even giving me anything of your own questioning! Very interesting how you're gauging my scumhunting without any conclusive evidence; or evidence at all on the ideas. Then you give a twisted detail on the case (singular) presented against me.

Hey, smarty. Read what I said. I'm addressing TWS. If my scumhunting has been hit and miss - what results are there for you to work on? Where is the conducive evidence that so condemns me?

Because this is even worse than anything you did D1. What do you mean by inconsistent scumhunting and how does that apply here?

I mean that you have been all over someone in one post, and then ignored/softballed them in the next. It's like you can't orient yourself or feel confident in your vote. [...] It means you aren't comfortable in that role and that means you can't be town.

And yet nobody asked regarding what you see right here. Let's all jump! Jump jump jump to conclusions~

And no. The proceeding sentences after #1 make/have no sense regarding that case there.

It means you aren't comfortable in that role and that means you can't be town.

This in itself is a total fallacy. "You aren't comfortable in this role = You aren't town." @bolded part: I am confident in my vote, good sir. And I know where the direction of this ship I'm steering is headed despite not having a conventional compass.

I've got the stars and mine eyes to follow. Anyway.


So you're going on the psychology that scum/third-parties are implied to be uncomfortable in their role...why? Same goes for town but in the vice versa example.

Lastly:

You scumhunting being iffy is in and of itself a result.

You delusional man. Have you even asked me anything regarding my anything? No. You jumped. You jumped to conclusions like everything else you poked at me from that last time. See what I did? Vagueness. Let me clarify.

You jumped to conclusions instead of asking me my reads, anything regarding my finds on the people I've scumhunted (and by that I mean making a good case out of what I said) and are just trying to undermine it by giving this scathing opinion here which would settle itself as it's contradictory.

You see my scumhunting as iffy? So do I on yours, but I've reasons behind them and yours on mine? It's more of a continuation from yet-to-be-proven ground.

Let's all conclude that the absence of questions, despite the apparent presence of suspicions, mark scumhunting. Yes. That would be the day.

PPE: Griff, TolyK and Hapah. In that order.

[Griffionday]

Hapah:
We could also do a "Everyone who claimed town between post (###) and (###) is telling the truth" or "The claims of being town on posts(###),(###),(###) and (###) are true" type of statement.  Yeah, not as likely to be clear, but could cut things down.

Heck we could even just have him say he and Tiruin are town.

Tiruin:

PPE: Griff, TolyK and Hapah. In that order.

What is this a list of?

[Griffionday]

Hapah:

Further thoughts and questions on your ability:
If there is a cult wouldn't a confirmed town read only be true until the night?
Does it require the teller to know the truth of his statement? 
Can we use it to predict statements about the future and force the town to win by clever use of the ability?

[TolyK]

Heh. That actually is a pretty neat idea, Griff...
Who's up for that? (We should have a control group of 3 or 4 people).

And Griff, what's with you and cults?

[Griffionday]

Someone needs to keep it in mind as a possibility.  I don't want there to be a dramatic reveal day 4 that SURPRISE there was a cult no-one saw coming.

[Toaster]

Soo... what do we do if we do, say, four people, and it turns out they're not all town?

[TolyK]

Well, those people become suspects, and even more so to each other.

Webadict, can you answer these questions about a truth-checker ability?

Hapah:

Further thoughts and questions on your ability:
If there is a cult wouldn't a confirmed town read only be true until the night?
Does it require the teller to know the truth of his statement? 
Can we use it to predict statements about the future and force the town to win by clever use of the ability?

[zombie urist]

Gonna get a quick post in before lunch:

I am town.

GriffonDay: I was asleep.

Tiruin: No I'm going to do it later.

NQT: If you think one of them is scum, why don't you report the results now? Also if one of them were scum, why wouldn't they not kill you and keep their cover?

I think the best way to determine if there's a cult or mafia is to lynch a cultist or mafia.

Flavor probably doesn't mean anything, since this wasn't advertised as a bastard game.

[Griffionday]

Soo... what do we do if we do, say, four people, and it turns out they're not all town?

This is why I think we should do two or three people at most, this ups the probability (according to some numbers from ~3/12 to ~1/3, 1/2 for the people who are selected) so it would be more practical.

ZU

Gonna get a quick post in before lunch:
-snip-
GriffonDay: I was asleep.

You still need to answer the questions posed.  I'm expecting a post with a proper response sometime today.

[Vector]

Nope, I didn't receive a PM.

[notquitethere]

Toly

My argument is this: 1. I'm immune to kills from lovers. 2. The lovers wouldn't have known this. 3. Scum lovers would have a big incentive to kill me before I out them. 4. The results of the night are consistent with me being targeted by scum lovers. There are of course many other possible occurences, but until I have further info, I can't rule out the possibility just described.

I am exactly asking about point 3. WHY do they have a big incentive to kill you? What if they think you don't have reason to out them, because they're not scummy? You're going from the assumption that they know that you know they're scum (double assumption ftw/wtf?), because otherwise either (a) you won't be poking them out (if you don't think they're scum), or (b) they won't expect you poking them out. Also, by you dying the maffer would lose "loyalty points" to the other lover (since why otherwise would scum kill you, if they could get info on the dual-town-pair from you?).
What are your arguments for this?

I see your point. I hadn't considered how a town-scum pair would behave with each other/whether they'd suspect one another if I died in the night. Hmm.

Mistake in speech. I meant, where did you even get the idea?

It was just an IF- I don't know anything about Zrk2 other than he's a belligerent fellow.

Griff

NQT:

I thought it might be useful for town to know about the targeting, but I don't think it's necessarily in town's interest to know how I know. Hopefully, you'll understand.

There are a couple reasons why it might not be in the towns best interest to know; however, can you at least tell us why you cant tell us?

Essentially, if I give away too much about the mechanics of some of my powers, scum will have a better handle on how to get rid of me.

Tiruin

More details on this thing you saw. Was there anything regarding what you saw?

No. All I can say is what I already said. Vector targeted or was redirected to Zrk2 last night, but might not have actually used an action. I've got no reason to doubt what Vector said. It's a shame the info wasn't actually very useful in the end.

This is fallible in the way in that the one fact is they're the informed minority. While you could say who the lovers are - how do we even know they're scum unless any conclusive and reasonable case is presented?

How does it look like a scum lover targeted you? You keep drifting to that topic and yet there are many (count: more than 10) other people who might've acted. Roleblock. Doc/+1 life. Divert/Nullify. Delay.

You make some good points and it's precisely because there are so many grounds for doubt that I haven't and do not yet plan to out the lovers.

Zrk2

YOU said YOU thought they were scum because YOU think they tried to kill YOU, so maybe YOU should out the people that YOU are convinced are scum.

Someone's getting heated! Everyone, can you see this guy! I never claimed to be certain or convinced of anything here, hence why I haven't outed anyone.

Toaster

Okay, Mister Information, why don't you tell us what you did last night, then?

Not in town's interests to say yet.

(Will answer outstanding questions when not at work, later)