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[SalmonGod]

MSH, as for the stuff about Iceland, I admit that I don't have a lot of detailed knowledge to back it up.  I'm just very inspired by their recent social movements.  When their economy crashed in 2008, they gathered in front of their capitol building and threw food at it for a few days, causing their entire government to resign.  They have genuinely arrested and punished people whose corruption was found to be responsible - the only place in the world where I'm aware this has happened.  They've refused to cooperate with the FBI in conspiring against Wikileaks, and this has culminated in banning the FBI from their country.  It's evidence of a culture that I would feel comfortable with, which I think is the most important factor in the experience of living somewhere.  Everything I read about them is an indication of people with integrity.  The law does not matter in the slightest if the culture responsible for upholding it does not have the will to do so.  When I looked it up after your post, for example, I saw that Iceland does have laws about porn, but they're completely unenforced.  The application of warrants doesn't mean much on its own, as there may be any number of other protocols relevant to arrest procedures.  They have punishments for mocking religion, but they also have those for public ridicule on any prejudiced basis.  I admit it's something I feel uneasy about, but it also looks like they're the best place in the world if you're LGBT, so maybe they're doing something right there.  Regardless, it wouldn't effect me in the slightest, as I don't ever plan on being a dick.

[Tyg13]

It's true we have harsher sentences, and higher rates of violent crimes, which leads to large amounts of prisoners. The War on Drugs also helps to massively inflate the number of people incarcerated for frankly stupid reasons. You also can't deny the harsher treatment of non-whites by the prison/judicial system. I'm not saying our prison system is good, it's downright deplorable. But to claim that people are being whisked away for no reason because some powerful person wants them gone on a frequent basis is just silly. I can't even think of a single instance where that's happened.

[Boea]

What was the 1960's

[SalmonGod]

It's true we have harsher sentences, and higher rates of violent crimes, which leads to large amounts of prisoners. The War on Drugs also helps to massively inflate the number of people incarcerated for frankly stupid reasons. You also can't deny the harsher treatment of non-whites by the prison/judicial system. I'm not saying our prison system is good, it's downright deplorable. But to claim that people are being whisked away for no reason because some powerful person wants them gone on a frequent basis is just silly. I can't even think of a single instance where that's happened.

Not even a single instance?  Start reading up on the experiences of activists, especially whistleblowers.  I'm not going to go hunting down a big list for you to prove my point.  My family is demanding my attention right now.  But for a quick demonstration, here's another post I made on this forum a while back about the suspension of rights and mercenary behavior of police at protest events, because someone else challenged me on the subject in a similar manner.

What was the 1960's

Or the japanese internment camps

[Tyg13]

Man, it's like they were almost yesterday. They were only, what, 50 years ago for the 60's and 70 years ago for the 40's?

And all I got from your post concerning illegal arrests is that the police arrested a lot of people, but nearly none of them were charged. Yeah, I see that as a major inconvenience to a lot of people and they shouldn't have to be put through something like that, but it's not like they actually got punished for nothing. But I was unaware of this even occurring, so thank you for making me aware of it.

I could argue this all night, but I too have to go. It's nearing 5 AM in the morning.

[SalmonGod]

So the fact that our government accepts payment to arrest people illegally, sometimes hundreds at a time, doesn't bother you or back up any of the claims you were challenging me on?  *shrug*

[Boea]

What is Monsanto, and the 1990's, and the Patriot Act.

[Shades]

Clearly the best solution is to make our own country. I'll get the paper mache and duct tape.

Considering the kinds of things people end up doing in their fortresses do you think that is wise?

[Boea]

Clearly the best solution is to make our own country. I'll get the paper mache and duct tape.

Considering the kinds of things people end up doing in their fortresses do you think that is wise?

What is Abu Dhabi.

[Skyrunner]

Can you stop asking questions with no content or context? :/

[Sigulbard]

Can you stop asking questions with no content or context? :/

What is context?

[Strife26]

OMGOMGOMGOG AMERICA IS SOOOO EVIL
It's almost like we have sensationalist media that's primary motivation is scoring rating by presenting the most negative views, followed by a tech savvy society that makes those negative events really super visible. All that besides partisan media doing their best to reinforce the world view of their partakers.


Yeah, we're not the goddamn city on the hill, but guess what? No one is, and, quite frankly, there's lots of places much worse than we are, for all of our giant, hyper-powery mess ups. America bashing is one of the easiest sports in the world, but one that's not terribly constructive, either towards promoting a world-view, or to try to push the country a little higher up on that hill.

[misko27]

I could argue this all night, but I too have to go. It's nearing 5 AM in the morning.

What is insomnia?

Questions with no context! Its time for a round of jeapordy! This Country is widely villified by various liberal groups in NA, Europe and Australia for it's centrist leanings.

[Strife26]

Venezuela?

I dunno, that was my first guess, but listing two continents, then Australia makes me want to go with somewhere in Oceania.


Venezuela or New Zealand?

[GlyphGryph]

Strife, I'm not sure to the extent which it is "America bashing" rather than "blindness" bashing. Tyg13 has tried to argue "the US is pretty good", which it's not. You are 100% correct though, most places aren't. Even the best places tend to be fairly bad compared to how they should be. That's realistic.

But in a thread based around "What do you think is the best at being both free and non-corrupt", I think it's a stretch to put America out there. America has a lot going for it, and they are a lot better than a good chunk of the world, but I think its facetious to say they are the most free or the least corrupt. Especially, as with Tyg13, when the basis for your claims is that you, personally, are pretty good, mostly due to the fact that you've never tried to rock the boat or upset anyone more powerful than you, so the country must be pretty good, and you ignore all the evidence to the contrary. I like the USA, but I think getting complacent and thinking "things are fine the way they are now" is basically the worst thing a person can do for their country, when there are real problems we could be out there fixing. At the very least, recognizing those problems and trying to support those who do something about them is important.

I think the best thing the US has going for it is a pretty awesome set of ideals we should be trying to live up to, and trying to insure out country lives up, and it frustrates me to see someone who professes to like our country so willing to throw those out the window and give up on them because "things are fine because the problems don't effect me personally" or simply close their eyes and plug their ears as those ideals are worn away.