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Author Topic: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.  (Read 213250 times)

10ebbor10

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #780 on: December 25, 2013, 08:47:10 am »

On a side note, there's some kind of Christmas event going on. Opinions?
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Naryar

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #781 on: December 25, 2013, 08:51:11 am »

As long as tasks doesn't get more time-consuming I may do the ground target one.

Also Ju87 bonus in HB is playable... though the flying is kinda painful.

Jopax

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #782 on: December 25, 2013, 02:46:12 pm »

Why does anyone play HB???

Seriously, the few matches I've played were 90% tedium and 10% fun.

Best example is battle of the Bulge. I'm in my Bf-110 and go for the B-17's, I manage to shoot one down, and damage another one before having to go back because "fuck you you only brought one clip of ammo" nonsense. By the time I'm up and running they've all ran away. It could be the lack of players or something but I honestly can't say it's enjoyable, so for the time being I'll stick to Arcade, mostly because people play that.
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Naryar

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #783 on: December 25, 2013, 03:04:40 pm »

Lol, HB gives LESS rewards than arcade now.

ukulele

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #784 on: December 25, 2013, 10:43:29 pm »

Why does anyone play HB???

Seriously, the few matches I've played were 90% tedium and 10% fun.

Best example is battle of the Bulge. I'm in my Bf-110 and go for the B-17's, I manage to shoot one down, and damage another one before having to go back because "fuck you you only brought one clip of ammo" nonsense. By the time I'm up and running they've all ran away. It could be the lack of players or something but I honestly can't say it's enjoyable, so for the time being I'll stick to Arcade, mostly because people play that.

The same reason why some people play ARMA instead of battlefield. Or dota instead of LoL, or dwarf fortress instead of farmville basically.
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Flying Dice

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #785 on: December 25, 2013, 11:06:19 pm »

Why does anyone play HB???

Seriously, the few matches I've played were 90% tedium and 10% fun.

Best example is battle of the Bulge. I'm in my Bf-110 and go for the B-17's, I manage to shoot one down, and damage another one before having to go back because "fuck you you only brought one clip of ammo" nonsense. By the time I'm up and running they've all ran away. It could be the lack of players or something but I honestly can't say it's enjoyable, so for the time being I'll stick to Arcade, mostly because people play that.

The same reason why some people play ARMA instead of battlefield. Or dota instead of LoL, or dwarf fortress instead of farmville basically.

To be elitist pricks because they don't want to admit that they're bored stiff?

I'm barely even going to start with how flawed that response was. The issues with HB aren't related to it being more sim-y than Arcade, but rather (primarily) with the fact that there are so few people (both within matches and in MM) that matches take a long time to find, and when you do, they often consist of you spending twenty minutes scanning for targets because there are only ten or so enemies and half of them died in the first few minutes. Unless you're trying to argue that tedium is part of what makes flight sims fun, in which case I'll cheerfully put you in the same drawer as the hardcore milsimmers who make ARMA communities so much like the real military that it stops being fun.
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RedKing

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #786 on: December 25, 2013, 11:49:42 pm »

What they said. I'd love to do more HB, but I'm not waiting 5 minutes for a match in which I will likely spend five minutes flying to the battlefield, then die horribly and that's that.
The one upside to me for HB is that bombers can't pull 14G acrobatic manuevers and 400mph dives, which is a bit of an unfair advantage in arcade. However, since I tend to fly bombers and ground attack aircraft....
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sluissa

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #787 on: December 26, 2013, 12:56:03 am »

I used to do HB somewhat frequently(still mostly did arcade though, as HB really didn't give much reward compared to the time input). I did it for the slower pace, The better chance to get setup and the fact that you had more room to work with. The pace of it was less like a fist fight and more like chess. I could see my defeat coming for me and often because of a mistake I'd made before that I only recognized now. On rarer occasions I could smile as I watched someone witlessly fly into my trap. Even flying biplanes in HB was an incredibly interesting experience. Those same biplanes which were almost inevitably overpowered by the russian reserve aircraft and chaikas in arcade actually stood a chance if you knew how to use them right. You maneuvered in order to put the battle at your advantage. Fight in the terrain you wanted, at the altitude you wanted, at the speed you wanted. You used the clouds to your advantage, because there was enough room to actually hide in them.

Even the lack of ammo could make it interesting. I rarely flew as part of an organized team, but I'd had some success, even after ammo depletion, acting as bait, or trying to herd enemies into areas where friendlies were. You get on someone's tail, and they know you're there, they're going to try to get you off, even if you spend 5 minutes there without firing a shot. Either they want to kill you themselves, that bad that they'll waste all their advantage going after you, a harmless toothless plane, or they'll not realize there's no danger and waste their energy trying to dodge.

HBs were also the only time I EVER got to land on a carrier. Surviving to the point where I needed to was rare, but it's something I love to do to the point where I"ll even load up a test flight with a navy plane and just practice half a dozen, or a dozen takeoffs and landings.

It was just a different experience, and while I won't say arcade wasn't fun, I had my enjoyment there too, that really never felt like combat so much as some strange 3 dimensional sport in the sky where you weren't supposed to tackle, but it happened often nonetheless. HB was... well, I know people will argue about the realism, but it felt more real and I doubt anyone will say that it is more realistic than arcade.  It actually felt like there was more at stake, you were part of a team and the team, even a random assortment thrown together and half of them maybe not even understanding your language, were still a team and needed each other to win. There were people who could do well, but the person who could carry a game in HB on their own was exceedingly rare. There were consequences to losing your plane. Everyone has one shot to help out, and if they lost that one shot without contributing, it made it harder for everyone else. And even without counting team consequences, when you spend 5 or 10 minutes just preparing to fight and you're just a stray bullet away from being out of it, that at least is some investment in the battle and some risk attached to it. It promotes more cautious play. It seriously discourages reckless tactics such as head on passes and ramming. It changed the effectiveness of planes when you weren't willing to depend on the stalinwood or the brokenfighter anymore to protect you and those same planes which might be overpowered in arcade turned into still potentially powerful but much more limited in their effectiveness.

So yeah, with that someone incomprehensible rant, I'll just say that HB/RB just as with arcade and the rest of the game has been made significantly less fun now.
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Naryar

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #788 on: December 26, 2013, 05:03:29 am »

Yeah, the problems with HB are :

- Overly long flight back to the airbase, or flight down to the battlefield... whee, i'm having fun /sarcasm
- Long loading time and you just have 1 life after that
- Gets less xp than AB
- One life only and battles just as long as arcade => nearly all battles will be either quitted before or waiting for 10min because you want these bonuses


The good things however:
- Less absurd acrobatic Wellies and B25J's
- Generally better player coordination, no ramming, better newb help
- Better for money grind than Arcade
- Slower pace... nearly too slow however
- Less problems of brokenfighters, OP Yaks and other things like that

Will attempt to get that russian premium plane though, if ground target tasks become too difficult or out of my range...
« Last Edit: December 26, 2013, 05:05:43 am by Naryar »
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Jopax

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #789 on: December 26, 2013, 05:13:27 am »

That's exactly the thing though, I wouldn't mind the realism bits in arcade style matches at all, they're interesting and fun to work with (and around). What I do mind is how tedious it is since not many people play it, when it's been obviously balanced for a larger number of players.
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TheBronzePickle

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #790 on: December 26, 2013, 12:47:24 pm »

Also, when you suck bad enough that you get about the same amount of kills in Arcade and Realistic, the latter's a /much/ better choice for XP. (And before you say 'that's not possible' keep in mind that pretty much every American plane is completely useless in Arcade when they can actually hold their own in Realistic.)
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Sonlirain

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #791 on: December 26, 2013, 01:10:10 pm »

Also, when you suck bad enough that you get about the same amount of kills in Arcade and Realistic, the latter's a /much/ better choice for XP. (And before you say 'that's not possible' keep in mind that pretty much every American plane is completely useless in Arcade when they can actually hold their own in Realistic.)

Aircobras aren't useless for they are the engines of death and destruction only rivaled by Yaks.

And speaking of destruction... i finally got the ammo clip for my 50 mm cannon.
Now i can finally lay down the hurt on people.
Last game in it ended up with me tearing a wing off a B-17 (that took 2-3 shots tho) and devastating 2 Brokenfighters in rapid succesion.
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sluissa

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #792 on: December 26, 2013, 01:12:49 pm »

I disagree, I think you underestimate the potential power of sustained fire from 6-8 50 cals with incendiary rounds. It's a lot harder to get explosive one hit kills(but even pilot kills happen fairly frequently because you're pumping out so many more shots than cannon wielders that you have a better chance of hitting the pilot.) But if you're willing to pick targets which aren't popular, and be a bit patient and let fire/equipment failure take them down you can do well. One of my favorite American planes in the P-47 without any ground attack hardware. The bombs have their uses, but without them it's a pleasure to fly in the air. Probably the best BnZ plane I've come across outside of the Bf-109s.

The big problem is simply finding targets which don't already have 2-3 other planes attacking them. And RB are much better for that.

I respect the cannon, but I think that people that just go after bigger and bigger calibers are missing the whole picture.
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Sonlirain

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #793 on: December 26, 2013, 01:30:58 pm »

I disagree, I think you underestimate the potential power of sustained fire from 6-8 50 cals with incendiary rounds. It's a lot harder to get explosive one hit kills(but even pilot kills happen fairly frequently because you're pumping out so many more shots than cannon wielders that you have a better chance of hitting the pilot.) But if you're willing to pick targets which aren't popular, and be a bit patient and let fire/equipment failure take them down you can do well. One of my favorite American planes in the P-47 without any ground attack hardware. The bombs have their uses, but without them it's a pleasure to fly in the air. Probably the best BnZ plane I've come across outside of the Bf-109s.

The big problem is simply finding targets which don't already have 2-3 other planes attacking them. And RB are much better for that.

I respect the cannon, but I think that people that just go after bigger and bigger calibers are missing the whole picture.

That's because in arcade some planes just WONT die if all you have are flimsy MGs.
Sure you will make them all black and ridden with holes but they will stay in the air for a LOOOOONG time while someone using a cannon will simply rip them apart in a burst or two.
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Anvilfolk

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Re: War Thunder. Casual Dogfighting MMO.
« Reply #794 on: December 26, 2013, 01:54:34 pm »

Why does anyone play HB???

It all depends on what you are looking for... like someone said, it's all about the experience that you want. If all you want is to play a game that lets you level as fast as possible, you're probably not going to get what you want.

If you want to get closer to the simulation aspect of World War II air warfare, you'll enjoy it. I recently got back into IL-2 Sturmovik: 1946... I remember sorties that took over one hour, where I didn't fire a single shot. I remember other sorties where we flew 9 plane formations of TBF Avengers, with it taking up to 20m en-route to target, to drop a single torpedo, then turn back for the harrowing flight back to the carrier. All the while, we could do nothing but stay close and try to survive the swarms of A6M Zeros that buzzed around like flies.

Those were some of the most amazing times I had in any online game - but they were about feeling like you were there, not grinding your way to the next plane (no such concept in IL-2 '46).
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