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[Nienhaus]

Hey I have always been interested in joining SS13 am I ok to join you lot ? Is the server public or just for bay12 ?

Just wondering how long do games normally last for ?

Yep, we'd gladly welcome a new player. We're a semi private server, meaning that we don't advertise outside of Bay 12, but we won't turn outsiders away who stumble upon it.

Hell, I'm pretty much an outsider, I don't even use these forums.

[Isdar]

We need people on the server! Join uuuuusss!

[rabidgam3r]

Become one of us!

ONE OF US! ONE OF US! ONE OF US!

[Flying Dice]

I will, now that finals are more-or-less over. It'll probably take me the rest of the day to get BYOND working and archive-binge the wiki, though.

[Hanslanda]

... There's a full medkit in Cargo, the Bridge, a variety in Medbay storage, probably half a dozen O2 Deprivation kits in emergency lockers around the station, the little bit of supplies in the Rec Room, and the Chaplain's bible. Also, the Cargo bay can order INFINITE medkits.

Seriously, I guess I'm not getting through here. The fucking space suits are a nigh-forbidden item, in fucking space. Am I insane for thinking that is utter idiocy...? Like, seriously, I cannot comprehend how anyone could put any form of logic to that, expense or not. o.O

THERE IS A REASON EVA IS ONE OF 3 LOCATIONS WITH AN AI MOTION SENSOR. IT HOLDS SOME OF THE MOST VALUABLE EQUIPMENT ON THE STATION.

• Jetpacks
• RCD
• Magboots
• SPACE SUITS. WHICH ARE RARE. THAT'S WHY ONLY FOUR WERE ISSUED FOR A CREW OF 82. USED ONLY IN EXTREME EMERGENCIES.
• Important tools and materials. Including plasteel. Which is quite expensive for NT to make

If anything, EVA is ludicrously underdefended. Considering you break two windows and you're in. I've done it even as a clown.

... Game logic, this is... Vaguely acceptable as a justification. Vaguely.

But. We. Are. Talking. About. SPACE. The environment that you know, boils your blood in seconds, irradiates you, simultaneously scorches you to ash and freezes you to rock solid ice, and oh, also can just instantly rupture your lungs so that instead of a nice set of air-CO2 transference apparatus, you suddenly have a nice set of gory stains trying to crawl out your throat while you drown in your own blood that happens to be BOILING INSIDE YOUR BODY NOW.

No one, ever, in the history of the most insane, stupid, poorly thought out justifications in all of history, would ever go, "Well, we can't give the crew more space suits because space suits are expensive. More expensive than the likely BILLIONS of dollars it takes to get a person trained, prepared, and actually INTO space to work on a space station. Not to mention the hideous amounts of lawsuits that would follow the INSTANT someone got spaced without a space suit or even a pressure suit and died gorily, thus giving our numerous enemies, including the Syndicate, a HUGE way to waste our money and resources. Nope, totally way more expensive to just put a space suit in everyone's locker. In space. Yep."

I'm not arguing that there aren't objectives in EVA. Which is in fact the case. But bolting down EVA because there is expensive stuff in there DOES NOT FOLLOW ASIMOV LAWS. Asimov does not say, "Oh hey, protect the shiny shit, and then maybe later, you can worry about not letting the bartender vomit his lungs up all over the place as he freeze-dries, but definitely don't let him get the space suit. Shit's expensive yo." If an AI was properly following the laws, they would BOLT EVA OPEN, so everyone could have access to a space suit. The problem we are discussing is not, 'There's stuff in EVA that people can steal though!' the problem is that, 'The AI is keeping people from protective equipment during a freaking emergency situation.' Regardless of whether the station is breached or not yet, the AI should realize that the infinite vastness of space could be potentially more dangerous than one crewman having a set of magboots.

Anyways, I don't really understand your opposing position whatsoever. The argument is about the AI bolting down a place with safety equipment inside it. Just, right there, the AI is violating Law One. So, I don't know now? I'll just forget it all, and continue ordering the AI to unbolt everything he opened in every round I play in as Captain, because obviously I'm deeply wrong about this on some fundamental level that I can't even begin to grasp. 

[Karlito]

As long as the station hull isn't breached, I don't actually see how it's a Law 1 violation for EVA to be bolted shut.

[Glloyd]

It isn't. If the AI didn't unbolt in an emergency, then it would be.



Also, from the current sandbox round:

That's Fluffles.
A sanity-destroying otherthing.

[Android]

Frankly, I am going to start deleting bolted doors when I see that happening in a excessive meta fashion. Deal with that security issue.

[Twiggie]

how about instead of bolting eva the ai bolts all the non-necessary airlocks until needed? seems like a much better way of preventing harm, and the only ones that are actually needed are mining, solars and escape - the only one thats used regularly is mining.

ofc then you get issues with the ai going afk and nobody able to open escape

[miauw62]

I will, now that finals are more-or-less over. It'll probably take me the rest of the day to get BYOND working and archive-binge the wiki, though.

Don't do that. Just have the wiki open as you play and search the relevant guides. That's how I do it.

E: By the way, Hans. I don't think your "money" justification really fits, considering that we're in a time when most people likely /LIVE/ on space stations. I don't think it's very expensive to get them space-ready. And NT is makes their own laws, so they could pretty much dispose of an entire crew if something goes wrong (and they have done, see deathsquad) and not have a single lawsuit coming their way because they're in SPESSH and have the most advanced technology in ever.

[Aklyon]

I usually have three things open for SS13:
1. Byond, of course.
2. The Construction page on the wiki, since its probably one of the more useful ones in general.
3. A relevant guide if I need it. Otherwise this defaults to the robotics page, since I tend to favor roboticist.

[BigD145]

No one, ever, in the history of the most insane, stupid, poorly thought out justifications in all of history, would ever go, "Well, we can't give the crew more space suits because space suits are expensive. More expensive than the likely BILLIONS of dollars it takes to get a person trained, prepared, and actually INTO space to work on a space station. Not to mention the hideous amounts of lawsuits that would follow the INSTANT someone got spaced without a space suit or even a pressure suit and died gorily, thus giving our numerous enemies, including the Syndicate, a HUGE way to waste our money and resources. Nope, totally way more expensive to just put a space suit in everyone's locker. In space. Yep."

NASA has lost quite a few expertly and expensively trained crew to cheap parts and budget outsourcing.

how about instead of bolting eva the ai bolts all the non-necessary airlocks until needed? seems like a much better way of preventing harm, and the only ones that are actually needed are mining, solars and escape - the only one thats used regularly is mining.

As an engineer I use airlocks all the time. I have access to them. I would go ballistic on any AI if airlocks were bolted because I would feel my life and my job were being threatened. Pinhole breaches often occur in areas engineering does not have access to and asking permission and going through all the bureaucracy wastes time and atmosphere.

I usually have three things open for SS13:
1. Byond, of course.
2. The Construction page on the wiki, since its probably one of the more useful ones in general.
3. A relevant guide if I need it. Otherwise this defaults to the robotics page, since I tend to favor roboticist.

A second monitor or second computer is great for this.

[Hanslanda]

Right, okay, gang up on Hans now for suggesting human safety should be more important than money. Sorry guys.  Whatever, you're just going to piss me off, so can we drop it now? Admin Glloyd told me I'm wrong so we can move on. Fact stands that I will always ALWAYS tell the AI to unbolt anything it bolted because that's meta and you can't change my mind on that.

[Glloyd]

Right, okay, gang up on Hans now for suggesting human safety should be more important than money. Sorry guys.  Whatever, you're just going to piss me off, so can we drop it now? Admin Glloyd told me I'm wrong so we can move on. Fact stands that I will always ALWAYS tell the AI to unbolt anything it bolted because that's meta and you can't change my mind on that.

I think an AI bolting areas is meta and uncool. My point was that there's a ton of expensive "high risk items" in EVA, and this is considered a secure area.

[BigD145]

Right, okay, gang up on Hans now for suggesting human safety should be more important than money. Sorry guys.  Whatever, you're just going to piss me off, so can we drop it now? Admin Glloyd told me I'm wrong so we can move on. Fact stands that I will always ALWAYS tell the AI to unbolt anything it bolted because that's meta and you can't change my mind on that.

Not at all. I think EVA should be unbolted and used a hell of a lot more than it is now, which is never. The motion sensor is fine as a quick, "hey someone's in there" and "should they be?" They have access and a legitimate reason to be in there? Fine. Carry on.