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[Onyxjew944]

"noob juices" is now a word. It is official.

Although, from now on, I may start calling them "secretions". It's more accurate.

Noob Juices slang [noob-joosez]
noun
1. Secretions created by a specialized gland during the nervous phase of early gaming
2. Residue of inexperienced actions

[Flying Dice]

Flying Dice:

In short, I pushed him with what was essentially an excuse, and he became incredibly defensive, to the point of voting me in what I see as an effort to get me to back off.

I could say the same of you. I pushed back because it's what I do when people come at me with bullshit reasons. Then you pushed back, and I pushed back again, and so on...

The fact of the matter is, we were both doing the same thing, but I can tell it was scumhunting. So why can't you? Isn't that what you were doing?

Why are you trying to pretend that what you did is somehow different?

I'm not trying to pretend; our actions were different. I neither voted you nor FoSed you. All I did was apply pressure, the source of which was irrelevant. You never claimed that my initial reason for pressuring you wasn't good until I pointed it out. In fact you did nothing but try to push my attention away from you. If you had really thought that my reasons were poor, you would have brought it up as a counterargument before I noted it, and you wouldn't have been concerned about it. At least, if you were town.

More importantly, that pressure yielded useful data, namely that you're nervous and prone to voting people who pressure you. Not town behavior.

Flying Dice, do you stand by your predecessor's actions? Why, or why not?

Not particularly. He was... I honestly don't know what he was doing or thinking, and it doesn't seem very sensible to me.

--

((I wonder if there's a SCP that would fit newb juices...)

[Captain Ford]

So I'm scummy for using my vote to pressure you? And you're not scummy because you didn't use your vote to pressure me?

Why is defending myself a scumtell?

Why is attacking my attacker scummy?

Where do you get that I was trying to push you away? If anything I was trying to get you to push back harder. And it worked. Bravo on not spilling your juice.

This is not my first time to a townie fight. Although you are a lot less batshit crazy than the last townie I tangoed with.

Flying Dice, do you stand by your predecessor's actions? Why, or why not?

Not particularly. He was... I honestly don't know what he was doing or thinking, and it doesn't seem very sensible to me.

That is an impressive defense. Surely much better than my (apparently scummy) complete and thorough backing of my predecessor's actions.

...durr...

[Spaghetti7]

Flying Dice, do you stand by your predecessor's actions? Why, or why not?

Not particularly. He was... I honestly don't know what he was doing or thinking, and it doesn't seem very sensible to me.

What doesn't seem very sensible? What was he doing wrong and what, if anything, did he do right?

[Onyxjew944]

This is not my first time to a townie fight. Although you are a lot less batshit crazy than the last townie I tangoed with.

Wasn't the last Townie you tangoed with actually Scum, just good at hiding it? If I'm remembering my Mild West times correctly.

[IronyOwl]

Extend. Not confident in being available before the deadline.


Onyx:

What I saw of Remuthra in the beginning was definingly subpar, but that could have easily been incredible amounts of pure from-concentrate newb. I don't know Flying Dice outside of this, and I haven't seen quite enough of that yet to make a definite decision, but I would say he is definitely on the list of people worth questioning.

Summary: Scummy, but not yet a lynch-vote.

Seems a bit stock and indecisive, but alright. For now.

What's your take on Ford? He defended Superblast's newb juice well enough, but do you have any lingering doubts or just general suspicion?

I'm interested in FD's case on him, but haven't had time to go back and analyze it properly. I don't have anything of my own on him.

IronyOwl Do you plan on making an appearance today? If not, have something to do tomorrow. You be scum. Yo scumbuddy dead. Little suspicion on you. You make a mistake. What do. </syntax suicide>

I'm sure we could find a planet with a generous enough day to make the answer to that yes.

Depends on the mistake, but the short answer is be confident and uncaring. Certainly admit it was a mistake if necessary, but worrying about mistakes is something scum do. Saying "Oops, oh well" or "Fuck you, that's why" is what townies who don't have time for this bullshit do.



Shakerag:

Shakerag:

IronyOwl:  You're having quite the heart-to-heart with Spaghetti7 over there.  Come to anything conclusive yet?

At the time of you asking me this, no. Well, sort of yes; I assumed he was going to say he misread it as "If you were scum" or similar and that'd be that.

As it stands, the answer he did give is much more interesting. I wasn't expecting it, but it seems sound, at least for a beginner; essentially, he'd prey on the weak because weak people are scum. He's either getting good Scum IC advice or has a somewhat simplistic but reasonably productive and straightforward opinion of hunting.

So, writing him off as town for now.

And so ... you feel the possibility of him getting good Scum IC advice is write-off-able?  I never knew you thought so poorly of Urist Imiknorris.  Also, isn't it worth challenging that there could be strong scum players?

Well, some of that's just that I don't think I can usefully pressure him further over it. He's given his answer, it's an answer with some merit, I don't think I can push a better read out of him with it.


Spaghetti:

Oh, I don't dispute how it could be useful to you. Anything said is useful in this game, I was just saying any future discussion was probably pointless as we were just going round in circles.

What circles? It took us a while to get to the point, but nothing seemed particularly redundant to me.


Ford:

PFP

So... what's your read on Flying Dice at the moment?

Current read? Hmm...

Scummy on gut feeling. But not lynchworthy.

So his case on you isn't anything unreasonable?

Irony Owl: How did it feel being a prince during Prince's Guard? How did it feel to have big burly men fighting over you? And how did it feel to be murdered at the end of it? I'm doing a study, so it's important that you answer honestly. *stares intently*

...I may be a little bit tired...

Fabulous and very inconvenient, respectively.

It was a bit strange initially, because I had this weird position of responsibility and credibility, which made it really important that I do well but really difficult to just sort of jump into the trenches like a good soldier (or at least, I thought it did; that's something of an untested assertion). Later it felt like I suffered the appropriate price for my lack of spine, as a leader has no right to be weak.


NQT:

Whether I was scum or town... hrm. Arguably as scum I'd want to stand behind his Remuthra vote to give me more of an excuse to follow it, but otherwise I don't particularly think my alignment would influence that.

Should we then take this as a minor point towards suspecting Ford?

Given that he had no interest in a Remuthra lynch, I don't really see how it would be.

How much of your intent to lynch borno is confidence that he's scum, and how much is wanting to get the day over with?

I spent several hours analysing posts when I joined this game and Borno was by far the scummiest. Of course, I may well be wrong and I hope I'm not. Of course, I want the game to move at a little quicker pace and it's fair to say I was perhaps a little too hasty.

Would you be in favor of lynching him while he's up for replacement, then?

Unvote.

I'll take this as a no. What changed between shortening to get him dead and get this over with, and unvoting to give you time to read his replacement once he appears?

If you lynch me and then I flip town, what information will team town have gained?

Why do you ask?

Well looks like you're in the clear again Ford. Hmm... it sure looks like I could easily have got you lynched there if I hadn't withdrawn my extension. Good job for you that I'm not actually convinced you're scum yet.

So you're acting very townlike, is what you'd like to point out to all of us and especially your good buddy Ford?


Flying Dice:

In short, I pushed him with what was essentially an excuse, and he became incredibly defensive, to the point of voting me in what I see as an effort to get me to back off.

Sample quotes?

IO: Are you voting borno because he looks like scum, or to pressure him into not giving up?

I think it was some looking like scum, but I actually don't recall. Whichever it was, the other goal was to prod him into facing the game, which of course ideally meant not giving up.

[Spaghetti7]

Spaghetti:

Oh, I don't dispute how it could be useful to you. Anything said is useful in this game, I was just saying any future discussion was probably pointless as we were just going round in circles.

What circles? It took us a while to get to the point, but nothing seemed particularly redundant to me.

There was a lot of backwards and forwards about what question I had answered, then answering the real question before going straight back to the bit which was a response to nothing. Perhaps yo-yo-ing might be more appropriate.
I'm wary to extend again, so I'm just going to hope we can end the first day. I'm going to Vote Flying Dice because of what I saw from Remu, considering there's more of that. He failed to answer questions a fair amount, argued about the relevance of questions without even trying to answer them and made some odd decisions, such as:

So you have no reasons of your own? Your just following Irony?

I'm voting because he hasn't posted much, and he seems the best person to pressure.

I don't see how someone who isn't posting much is the best target. This seems like an attempt to appear to be scum hunting to me.

[notquitethere]

Ford

In fact, maybe you should restate your case on [borno] completely.

Fair enough. The short of it is that Borno's voting and unvoting and revoting of Nerjin and Blast struck me as a particularly erratic. There was a lot of other stuff that might just be play-style. To get any sort of solidity to this read, I'll need to see what the new Borno is like. Hence, my vote is going elsewhere for now.

Dice

NQT: What do you think of the interactions between borno and Captain? Why do you believe that a D1 no-lynch is a good thing for town?

I haven't studied their conversations intently but Borno seemed to have a lot of aggression that Ford inherited from Superblast's interactions. Then something interesting happens, over the course of several walls of texts, Ford essentially befriends Borno and they withdraw their votes on one another. From the depth of their interactions, I think it's unlikely that they're both scum, and it's at least plausible that they might both be town.

Did I say a D1 no-lynch would be good for town? I believe I said I'd wait to see if the tie would be broken by someone else before breaking the tie myself. In the last BM I did actually favour a D1 no-lynch, as the current lynch target was certainly not scum, and right enough they were lynched and turned out to be town. I had very good reasons in the last BM for believing the lynch target was innocent. I have seen no such compelling reasons in this game.

IronyOwl

Would you be in favor of lynching [borno] while he's up for replacement, then? What changed between shortening to get him dead and get this over with, and unvoting to give you time to read his replacement once he appears?

Perhaps when I was more sure, as if a player is guilty, they're guilty whether they're playing or not. However, I'm not longer so convinced that my case against Borno is as strong as it was before. What changed was I went back and re-read my reads. I keep them all in an excel document (which I use for keeping track of vote patterns) and I went and updated it and came to the conclusion that a lot of my earlier reads could conceivably be generated by a nervous town player. Be under no illusion, I still think Borno is among the most suspicious players at the moment.

If you lynch me and then I flip town, what information will team town have gained?

Why do you ask?

I want to make sure that if I am lynched, then town still benefits. I'd rather not be lynched, of course, but if I am I want it to at least be useful. I still win if we win when I'm dead.

Well looks like you're in the clear again Ford. Hmm... it sure looks like I could easily have got you lynched there if I hadn't withdrawn my extension. Good job for you that I'm not actually convinced you're scum yet.

So you're acting very townlike, is what you'd like to point out to all of us and especially your good buddy Ford?

I merely wanted to point out that Ford's extension-related case against me no longer held up in light of my recent actions. Maybe this wasn't a prudent thing to do. Perhaps I should have waited until Ford worked it out himself or someone else pointed it out. Blowing your own trumpet looks bad in this game. Ford's a good guy but he hasn't buddied me this game.

[notquitethere]

I've been umming and ahhing on who looks scummiest. I probably don't have as finally honed scum-senses as the more seasoned players. My style is to look at the concrete and try to learn from the games I've been in. Though it was a different game mode, I think there might be some meta-data lessons to be learned from the recent masons game. In that game, I was scum and no one else kept track of voting patterns. This worked in my favour then because there were several meta-tells that were easily spotted.

Over the course of the whole game I had the most people vote against me (I had at least 18 votes and six fingers of suspicion from nine different players) and most of the scum, myself included, random voted each other or FOS'd each other as harmless distancing.

Given these insights, who looks most scummiest in this game?

Remuthra/Flying Dice has gained the most votes from the most people across the game, with ten votes and 3 FOS's from six players, compared to Nerjin/Silver Dragon with eight votes from four people. On a purely wisdom-of-the-crowd view, Remuthra/Flying Dice is the most guilty.

I am anticipating a huge backlash here. Whenever I bring up anything half-way logical, people hate it. Here are two objections I'd like to forestall:

1. "Wouldn't scum concentrate their vote, and so someone who has a lot of votes on them is probably town?" My experience is that, in wanting to distance themselves, scum don't concentrate their vote. What they often do is vote for one another on Day One. This is Day One and we can expect that whoever scum is, other scum are likely to have random-voted them or at least FOS'd them. It's not a major tell, but Shakerag has been the most liberal with the Fingers of Suspicion so far.

2. "Why don't you make your own read instead of relying on everyone else's?/You're bandwagoning/You're lazy scum-hunting." This is, if not entirely reasonable, at least wholly expected, so to appease you here are some independent reasons why Remuthra/FD could be scum:

- Remuthra openly stated that they didn't find Borno suspicious and yet still voted for him
- Remuthra had a very standoffish approach to scum hunting at the beginning
- Flying Dice is obviously a lot more competent than Remuthra, and we haven't interacted as much, so there's not much I can say here.

If there's one thing I hate the most, is mislyching. Drawing on past experience, I think my method here is sound. However, I also know that I am a fallible human being and I make mistakes sometimes. So if you've got a really good reason why I'm off-base here, I'd like to here it. I'm looking at the IC's IronyOwl and Shakerag here: this is, after all, supposed to be a learning game.

[Teneb]

SilverDragon(0):
Onyxjew994(0):
Captain Ford(2):SilverDragon, Flying Dice
borno(0):
notquitethere(2):Captain Ford, IronyOwl
Sphagetti7(0):
Flying Dice(3): Onyxjew994, Sphagetti7, notquitethere
Shakerag(0):
IronyOwl(0):

Not Voting: Shakerag, borno (UP FOR REPLACEMENT)

1 votes for extension. 3 needed.

DAY ENDS TODAY AT 22:00 BRT (GMT-3)

[Teneb]

The doors open, the chief battlemagister steps through.

"Have you chosen?"

"Yes, Flying Dice is the traitor!", notquitethere shouts as he steps foward.

"So be it. Flying Dice, you are hereby accused of treason against the Arcane University. The penality for such an act is death."

"I'll die before betraying the Patriarch!", he shouts and, before anyone can do anything about it, cuts his own throat open.

As he lay dying, the marks all Cabal members posssess appear across his body, he whispers "This is not over"

"We can go now, can't we?", IronyOwl says as he too steps foward. "We found the traitor."

"I am afraid not. Evidence found implies that there were two infiltrators. You will be escorted to rooms prepared for you and, at dawn, you will be brought back here"

Flying Dice has been lynched. He was an Illusionist.

Night ends at 12th of March, 22:00 BRT (GMT-3) or when all actions have been submitted.

[Teneb]

Though weakened by the loss of their illusionist, the Cabal was far from defeated.

Found dead in the hallway outside his room was Captain Ford, whom, after careful examination of his body and the marked page on the spellbook he carried, was found to be a Healer.

The surviving magisters were escorted back to the same room in which Flying Dice’s fate had been decided one day earlier. There they would stay until dusk.

Captain Ford has died. He was a Healer.

Day ends 14th of March, 2013 at 22:00 BRT (GMT-3).

[notquitethere]

'Perhaps now that foul Illusionist is dead, people's forms will stabilise?' pondered Magister NQT, stroking his illustrious beard.

'Curse them though,' he continued, 'how could they have known that Captain Magister Ford was our resident Unctious Ointments specialist?'

I think a collective pat on the back is in order. It's a damn shame they got perhaps our most useful player (if there isn't a cop). I'm pretty chuffed that my reasoning held up. Now we should look at the posts by Superblast/Ford and Remuthra/Flying Dice with a closer eye, looking at people that were on Superblast/Ford's case unreasonably and signs of distancing by and to Remuthra/Flying Dice. I know that that's what I'm going to be looking at now.

[Captain Ford]

Yay! I made myself a huge hulking target. While playing the doctor. Go me!

I now await the rest of you in the afterlife. I'll keep a cup of tea warm for you.

[notquitethere]

I think we might be able to compensate for the ridiculously long Day One by nailing the game on Day Two.

There was no reason for scum to bus Flying Dice on the first day in a beginners game, right? Dead people can be ruled out, as well as inactive players (else, who would have sent in the kill order?).

Above Suspicion
Onyxjew994
Spaghetti7
notquitethere

Dead
Flying Dice
Captain Ford

Inactive
Borno
SilverDragon

So our list of suspects are the IC's!

Worthy of Suspicion
Shakerag
IronyOwl

AND SO IT BEGINS

Shakerag, you had no less than a random vote, a finger of suspicion and a pressure vote on Remuthra/FD at various points. Reasonable suspicion, or scum distancing?

IronyOwl, you've been quite hands off the whole game, finally settling your vote on me and putting the game into a tie right near the deadline. Why would you do that? Bearing in mind that your tie-vote would have saved Flying Dice had I not have intervened.

I- I think we've got it!