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Author Topic: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!  (Read 1778575 times)

Sheb

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20445 on: September 22, 2015, 08:33:32 am »

What? He's been supporting Assad since the start, it's nothing new.
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Europe consists only of small countries, some of which know it and some of which don’t yet.

Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20446 on: September 22, 2015, 08:41:55 am »

I am confused why Russia sends Air Superirity fighters to Syria. Not something you need to deal with ISIS and other rebels.
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War must be, while we defend our lives against a destroyer who would devour all; but I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend.

Sheb

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20447 on: September 22, 2015, 08:53:30 am »

To make sure the West doesnt decide to topple Assad, now that the strains of refugees on Europes borders is goading our leaders to act. Same reason they sent S-300.
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20448 on: September 22, 2015, 09:02:48 am »

Well... Anyway, If I was a Russian Pilot I'd worry not about West but about Israeli Air Force raping Russian SAMs and Russian aircrafts one more time.
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War must be, while we defend our lives against a destroyer who would devour all; but I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend.

Sheb

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20449 on: September 22, 2015, 09:06:52 am »

It would be nice to see what the much-touted Russian SAM are worth against modern aircrafts. Still, I guess the ROE are designed to avoid engagement with Israel: Israel so far has been willing to limit its engagement to bombing arms convoys to Hizbullah, and Assad has wisely decided not to react.
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Quote from: Paul-Henry Spaak
Europe consists only of small countries, some of which know it and some of which don’t yet.

Antsan

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20450 on: September 22, 2015, 09:08:43 am »

Antsan, I think I know what you mean. All this effort to slag politicians off for being slags and haramful to society does lead to the question of so what? What does it matter to someone's legislative skill and political finesse if they're throwing bunga bunga parties and porking it all night long?

The obvious counterpoint is is that it's funny.
That's not all of it. My point is rather that politics still has this veneer of respectability and professionalism, which is often enough used to shut criticism down, with cries about how you can't even have an idea about the complexities of international politics and how important all those connection are and all the networking and background knowledge and whatever else people use as an excuse why normal people are not qualified to take part in more serous policy discussions.
But then you look at all that professionalism and respectability and it turns out that the average emotional maturity of politicians is so low that international politics seem to be less about actual problems and more about petty bickering between people who are completely removed from reality and also absolutely overwhelmed with their tasks (or not, because they don't care). "Political finesse" reads like "being manipulative", "legislative skill" reads like "debating skill" (and has nothing to do with any actual knowledge about what they're legislating). "Getting stuff done" seems to be something close to "herding cats", and because it's so hard nobody seems to care anymore what actually gets done, as if just getting anything done at all would be good enough or even better than not doing anything – "at least we tried".

Animal protection is full of that stuff, where bleeding hearts, who seem to never have seen an animal before in their life, come up with all kinds of laws which kind of force the owners of those animals to torture them.
The whole "organic food" thing once was about being closer to nature, treating animals, plants and consumers with respect, now we've got organic farmers who let parts of their life stock die of some easily cured disease, only because giving them the medicine they need would maybe disallow them from selling their meat as "organic". It's now harder for someone to treat his animals with respect and show that to his customers than not doing so and pretending to.
Yes, such issues are complex, but the complexity mostly is made worse instead of easier. It's already a running joke with me that bureaucrats are the evil twins of programmers, with how they tend to introduce complexity, seemingly on purpose, where programmers seek to remove it. It's absurd how much redundancy is in what they do and sometimes, when reading some official document I wonder whether it would be a good idea to hire a batallion of mathematicians to cut down on superfluous language and make that whole mess simpler. It's just obvious that many of the people in charge of formulating official stuff haven't got the least idea about how logic or set theory works. It's like watching discussion on some kind of philosophy forum, full of contradictions, hidden assumptions, repetitions and sometimes even stuff that looks like it just snuck in there out of habit, not due to some kind of actual need or conscious decision.
Explaining the motivation of something is mixed up with the explanation of how it works, while explanation on usage is omitted, incomplete or contradictory. Everything seems carelessly slapped together, without some kind of editing process or anything at all which might ensure that what is published is actually usable. Most school assignments seem better thought through than that! How can I take this seriously if the people who do it don't put any effort into it? Please remember that "time" and "energy" is not the same as "effort".
It's always about how important all that stuff is, but it's not treated with reverence by the very people who, by their very own admission, should know best.

Most politicians are more concerned about their appearance than anything else. Pretending like that somehow is the fault of democracy as such is kind of absurd, when the mass media already make such a good job of distorting the picture so much that making actually intelligent and dedicated people look approachable should be a breeze in comparison. But then you probably can't do that through omission and reframing, so nevermind…
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20451 on: September 22, 2015, 09:19:38 am »

It would be nice to see what the much-touted Russian SAM are worth against modern aircrafts. Still, I guess the ROE are designed to avoid engagement with Israel: Israel so far has been willing to limit its engagement to bombing arms convoys to Hizbullah, and Assad has wisely decided not to react.
I'd say it is interesting to see what modern Russian SAMs can do with modern EW warfare.

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War must be, while we defend our lives against a destroyer who would devour all; but I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend.

Loud Whispers

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20452 on: September 22, 2015, 10:56:42 am »

That's not all of it. My point is rather that politics still has this veneer of respectability and professionalism, which is often enough used to shut criticism down
This isn't exactly the imperial court of the forbidden kingdom m8, I've never seen anyone balk at the opportunity to slag off politicians - in Britain far from avoiding criticizing bigmans because they're professionals we slag them off because they professional career politicians.
with cries about how you can't even have an idea about the complexities of international politics
No, this is perfectly valid. It's like saying you couldn't possibly understand the complexities of the economy. No one really understands what's going on, no one really understands the full picture and has access to all the information.
and how important all those connection are and all the networking and background knowledge and whatever else people use as an excuse why normal people are not qualified to take part in more serous policy discussions.
Especially bad in Birtonistan since all of our politicians come from elite Universities and so come out left or right with the same elite attitude of "I know what's best for you more than you, trust me." Except UKIP, since most of theirs are work people who didn't go to Uni, but they're touted by our media as an example of why normal people are not qualified to take part in more serious policy discussions. Can't win m8
But then you look at all that professionalism and respectability and it turns out that the average emotional maturity of politicians is so low that international politics seem to be less about actual problems and more about petty bickering between people who are completely removed from reality and also absolutely overwhelmed with their tasks (or not, because they don't care).
Cameron fucking a pig is not international politics
"Political finesse" reads like "being manipulative", "legislative skill" reads like "debating skill" (and has nothing to do with any actual knowledge about what they're legislating). "Getting stuff done" seems to be something close to "herding cats", and because it's so hard nobody seems to care anymore what actually gets done, as if just getting anything done at all would be good enough or even better than not doing anything – "at least we tried".
Part of being political is finding ways to get people to agree with things they don't want for the greater good.
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When in doubt, eat your pets
Most politicians are more concerned about their appearance than anything else. Pretending like that somehow is the fault of democracy as such is kind of absurd, when the mass media already make such a good job of distorting the picture so much that making actually intelligent and dedicated people look approachable should be a breeze in comparison. But then you probably can't do that through omission and reframing, so nevermind…
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P.s. democracy is still the least worst system, at least its pandering sometimes makes people feel good before the consequences of them come down

Antsan

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20453 on: September 22, 2015, 11:02:02 am »

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Cameron fucking a pig is not international politics
As I said: The whole debate about Cameron is just this sitcom jumping the shark.

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No, this is perfectly valid. It's like saying you couldn't possibly understand the complexities of the economy. No one really understands what's going on, no one really understands the full picture and has access to all the information.
I know perfectly well that is the case and it is valid to claim that people don't have the whole picture. What bothers me when people claim that politicians are any better equipped to deal with it.
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da_nang

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20454 on: September 22, 2015, 12:31:20 pm »

Poland, Finland, WTF?! We trusted you to push common sense into EU!
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20455 on: September 22, 2015, 01:01:58 pm »

Cameron fucking a pig is not international politics
Speak for yourself, I consider this the prime rib story of the year.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20456 on: September 22, 2015, 01:04:17 pm »

Quote
The BBC's Europe correspondent Chris Morris said it was highly unusual for an issue like this - which involves national sovereignty - to be decided by majority vote rather than unanimous decision.
Lel it's cute, Yuropoors think their opinion matters to the EU

smjjames

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20457 on: September 22, 2015, 01:05:07 pm »

Poland, Finland, WTF?! We trusted you to push common sense into EU!

*looks at the graph on that page* Doesn't Spain still have a really bad unemployment problem?

Also, how did the other countries vote? I don't see that in there.
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Sinistar

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20458 on: September 22, 2015, 01:10:24 pm »

Poland, Finland, WTF?! We trusted you to push common sense into EU!
Term common sense is a fickle one.
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mainiac

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Re: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!
« Reply #20459 on: September 22, 2015, 01:47:42 pm »

Poland, Finland, WTF?! We trusted you to push common sense into EU!

Politics 101: anything I want is common sense.
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