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[Helgoland]

Nope, the IMF head has already ruled out that possibility.

Because Greece's problems are caused by being in a currency union with you.  For the umpteenth time.  It's the cost of having a goddamn currency.

It's not like we forced them into it, you know.

[Sergarr]

Apparently there's a kickstarter for Greece bailout.

"The Greek Bailout Fund campaign page is experiencing some issues due to its astonishing popularity. It should be back up shortly."

[nenjin]

The idea on its face is pretty unbelievable. It'd have to be the most successful crowd funded project of all time, orders of magnitude higher, to even begin to be a drop in the bucket for what they need.

[mainiac]

It's not like we forced them into it, you know.

Germany wasn't forced into it at gunpoint either.  Germany in fact was the country that pushed for the interest rates that made this necessary when no one else was pushing for inflation that low.

The idea on its face is pretty unbelievable. It'd have to be the most successful crowd funded project of all time, orders of magnitude higher, to even begin to be a drop in the bucket for what they need.

Yuuuuup.  Too hard to mobalize that many people.

[Helgoland]

Germany in fact was the country that pushed for the interest rates that made this necessary when no one else was pushing for inflation that low.

Could you elaborate? I've got a feeling that you aren't talking about the 2% inflation target, and I don't understand...

[nenjin]

Yuuuuup.  Too hard to mobalize that many people.

And more to the point, why should the rest of the world pay for Greece's pensions? So they can....not change a thing? Maybe I feel that way because I've been hearing for the last 20 years how my pension is already fucked pretty much.

I feel like Greeks should be angry at their own government for putting them in this position in the first place.

[andrea]

honestly, I would pledge for a greek bailout campaign, even if it would achieve little.

[mainiac]

Germany in fact was the country that pushed for the interest rates that made this necessary when no one else was pushing for inflation that low.

Could you elaborate? I've got a feeling that you aren't talking about the 2% inflation target, and I don't understand...

https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/CP0000DEM086NEST

There is a "close to but under" 2% target.  Even 1.5% would be considered a failure on those terms.  But even considering 1.5% as "acceptable" despite what the charter said, that leaves German prices 15% lower then the charter target in 2008 before the shit hits the fan.

In order to hit the charter in accordance with stated EU policy laid out in the charter to which Greece entered the EU, Germany would need to accept inflation above 2% for a number of years to correct this imbalance.  This did not happen.  Germany enjoyed the fact that by pressuring the ECB to break the charter, they could shield themselves from the effects of the crisis.  This came at the cost of making it so that a difficult adjustment for greece was impossible.  And it made it so that an easy adjustment for Spain was made very, very difficult.

You criticize Greece for breaking the rules but Germany broke the rules on a scale that dwarfs Greece.  And Greece has cleaned up it's act.  Germany on the other hand is saying "Fuck you, we are going to keep doing this and you are going to support us in doing it."

The fact that the European economy is still this weak, 7 years after 2008 is ENTIRELY the fault of a German supported policy in the ECB.  If it weren't for that Greece would be able to meet these debt obligations.  Spain would not have a generation crushing catastrophe.  It is the most destructive policy enacted in a capitalist society since the great depression.  And not only do you insist that other people pay the price for these failed policies you refuse to stop them.

[ChairmanPoo]

Not to mention that the sheanigans for which Greece is getting the blame were done by *past* Greek goverments, at the behest of Goldman-Sach. Whose VP back then was none other than Mario Draghi.

[Sergarr]

In order to hit the charter in accordance with stated EU policy laid out in the charter to which Greece entered the EU, Germany would need to accept inflation above 2% for a number of years to correct this imbalance.  This did not happen.  Germany enjoyed the fact that by pressuring the ECB to break the charter, they could shield themselves from the effects of the crisis.

Man, I thought I was joking with that "vampire" stuff a few pages ago!

[Guardian G.I.]

The IMF deadline (00:00 Brussels time) to Greece has passed!

[Helgoland]

There is a "close to but under" 2% target.  Even 1.5% would be considered a failure on those terms.  But even considering 1.5% as "acceptable" despite what the charter said, that leaves German prices 15% lower then the charter target in 2008 before the shit hits the fan.

I hate to break it to you, but the 2% target refers to the whole Eurozone... Also isn't this whole 'cheap money' thing (which, among other stuff, is making realty prices in my town shoot through the roof) the result of the ECB desperately trying to ramp up inflation and failing?

[Loud Whispers]

Now is the time for fear

[mainiac]

I hate to break it to you, but the 2% target refers to the whole Eurozone...

If Germany needs to have inflation above what Greece and Spain have and Greece and Spain aren't going to have cripplingly low inflation rates then Germany needs to have inflation above 2%.  So when Germany agrees to a 2% long term target and inflation is below target in the south due to a credit imbalance, Germany is required by it's treaty obligations to accept inflation above 2%.  That's how averages work, someone is above and someone is below.

[Owlbread]

Has the IMF really ruled out using the 30 day period in which they don't have to report a default?