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[Antsan]

Sorry, I can't treat this drivel seriously.

While it is perfectly fine to disagree, I think it might be prudent to show some respect. If you are not able to do that, you should probably shut up, no matter how right you might ever be. I don't want this thread to be closed.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

EU leaders are already proven to be pathetic, spineless bunch of Ribbentrops and Chamberlains. I wonder how long they will appease Hi-... er, Putin before even they will say "enough is enough".

I think leaders are doing what their population wants. Any European politician would be eaten alive for suggesting basic necessary measures, like tripling military budgets to be ready to counter Russian or establishing embargo on Russian hydrocarbons .

Unfortunately even majority Ukrainians fail to understand what will happen in the coming years, there are no real preparation for the BIG war.

In 2020s, entire central-east europe will be Fun place to be (east of Ukraine is already Fun thanks to Putin). Including where I live. Oh joy.

It is pessimistic but it may happen. Putin is getting older and as his health detpriate he will rush to fulfil his goals. His plan is obivious. Ukraine, then Belarus, then Baltics. Crushing Georgia and annexing Armenia are likely course of events, too.

But to be honest, I think that bunch of sadistic drunkards are not that dangerous and Ukraine alone can stop them... but price to be paid can be so massive Becoming Vietnam or Afghanistan is not fun

[Guardian G.I.]

Putin's actions in Ukraine and elsewhere (or, to be more precise, inaction) shows that he's unwilling to take radical actions that would endanger the profits of his businessmen friends. Russian tanks would stand in Lvov back in Spring 2014 if he had been as bloodthirsty as he is portrayed.

As I've said before, the most likely course of action leading to war in Eastern Europe is NATO launching a "pre-emptive" strike at Russia and its allies from the territory of Poland and Baltic states (and maybe Ukraine or Finland if things get really shitty).
NATO's belief in easily winning a conventional war with Russia is very well known, any public opposition to the war is extremely unlikely because of the anti-Russian sentiment in the EU and America -  lots of people will probably volunteer to fight the Russian zombies. NATO leaders may probably assume that Putin's businessmen friends will prevent him from retaliating with nuclear weapons. The prize is Russian natural resources coveted by Westerners for hundreds of years, at the price of only transportation costs. It all matches up pretty nicely, unlike Putin's alleged plans for invading Europe for some irredentist reason.

No matter what happens, we, Belarusians, will have to rebuild our country from the ground-up once again. A lot of time has passed since the previous devastating visit by friendly Westerners that don't hate the people, but only the government. It's been long overdue.

[Antsan]

lots of people will probably volunteer to fight the Russian zombies.

I don't think so. As far as I can tell, fear of a nuclear war is pretty high as soon as the topic comes up.

[Askot Bokbondeler]

No matter what happens, we, Belarusians, will have to rebuild our country from the ground-up once again. A lot of time has passed since the previous devastating visit by friendly Westerners that don't hate the people, but only the government. It's been long overdue.

yeah, that's right, all westerners are nazis. luckily you guys have champions of freedom like lukashenko and putin to protect you.

[Erkki]

--

As I've said before, the most likely course of action leading to war in Eastern Europe is NATO launching a "pre-emptive" strike at Russia and its allies from the territory of Poland and Baltic states (and maybe Ukraine or Finland if things get really shitty).
NATO's belief in easily winning a conventional war with Russia is very well known, any public opposition to the war is extremely unlikely because of the anti-Russian sentiment in the EU and America - 

---

Russia is widely renown for its love of belief in feeling important. What allies of Russia, you mean Armenia? The whole confrontation of "righteous Russia" vs. "Nazi Europe USA's vassal NATO" is manufactured from the ground up any way. I feel that Russia's current administration will fall to its own impossibility sooner or later I'm afraid, just like the good old USSR, what Europeans actually worry about, Russia being in the immediate neighborhood and all, is what happens before that, how much of the poop will spread across the borders and what are the long and short term economical effects. As we have seen, nobody in the West outside of US Republican Party cares much about Ukraine but instead do care about what happens if Russia is let to proceed doing what it wants to do for whatever reasons along the same road it has chosen with Ukraine. I'm all for economical sanctions that hurt hard, such as blocking Russia from SWIFT.

Also, if necessary, the EU countries stepping too much out of the line(potentially Hungary, Greece) need to be penalized somehow; EU can indeed do that. Say, by removing their right to vote and veto in the parliament and councils.

[Guardian G.I.]

lots of people will probably volunteer to fight the Russian zombies.

I don't think so. As far as I can tell, fear of a nuclear war is pretty high as soon as the topic comes up.

When MH17 happened, the scale of anti-Russian hysteria in many Western media outlets was enormous. The reaction of people on many major bulletin boards like Reddit was very similar - the only people who didn't advocate for a war with Russia were Russians themselves.
Some appropriate media work can easily remove any public obstructions to a war with Russia.

Pardon me if I'm too overreacting about this - my country has a history of being constantly ruined by wars between Russia and European powers: for example, we have very few buildings older than 100-150 years, because our towns and cities were often completely destroyed and rebuilt from scratch several times. The increasing possibility of being caught in a crossfire of a new war is really worrying to me. If I had lived in some faraway country and not in a potential warzone, I wouldn't care about this continuing scuffle at all.

[MonkeyHead]

Putin's actions in Ukraine and elsewhere (or, to be more precise, inaction) shows that he's unwilling to take radical actions that would endanger the profits of his businessmen friends. Russian tanks would stand in Lvov back in Spring 2014 if he had been as bloodthirsty as he is portrayed.

As I've said before, the most likely course of action leading to war in Eastern Europe is NATO launching a "pre-emptive" strike at Russia and its allies from the territory of Poland and Baltic states (and maybe Ukraine or Finland if things get really shitty).
NATO's belief in easily winning a conventional war with Russia is very well known, any public opposition to the war is extremely unlikely because of the anti-Russian sentiment in the EU and America -  lots of people will probably volunteer to fight the Russian zombies. NATO leaders may probably assume that Putin's businessmen friends will prevent him from retaliating with nuclear weapons. The prize is Russian natural resources coveted by Westerners for hundreds of years, at the price of only transportation costs. It all matches up pretty nicely, unlike Putin's alleged plans for invading Europe for some irredentist reason.

No matter what happens, we, Belarusians, will have to rebuild our country from the ground-up once again. A lot of time has passed since the previous devastating visit by friendly Westerners that don't hate the people, but only the government. It's been long overdue.

There is no hunger amongst the EU populace for a war with Russia. None at all. I suspect that this is more propaganda from somewhere. The conflicts in the middle east have made us wary of such things, and our leaders know this. Look how reluctant we in the West have been to intervene in places like Syria recently, or to stand against ISIS, when both cases are incredibly more justifiable than an "everybody loses" war with Russia over some cloak and dagger sabre rattling. There is minimal anti-Russia sentiment too. People generally do not care about economic sanctions. We are suspicious of Russia (though no more so than other nations who at least appear slightly antagonistic), yes, but overtly anti Russia? No, not even close, save for some very marginal fringe elements who nobody cares about. Would we (as in most of us) like the current stance of Russia to change? Of course. Will we be mildly peeved if it does not? Yes. Will we be more than widely peeved? No, as we probably won't even know - Russia is not front page news.

lots of people will probably volunteer to fight the Russian zombies.

I don't think so. As far as I can tell, fear of a nuclear war is pretty high as soon as the topic comes up.

When MH17 happened, the scale of anti-Russian hysteria in many Western media outlets was enormous. The reaction of people on many major bulletin boards like Reddit was very similar - the only people who didn't advocate for a war with Russia were Russians themselves.
Some appropriate media work can easily remove any public obstructions to a war with Russia.

Pardon me if I'm too overreacting about this - my country has a history of being constantly ruined by wars between Russia and European powers: for example, we have very few buildings older than 100-150 years, because our towns and cities were often completely destroyed and rebuilt from scratch several times. The increasing possibility of being caught in a crossfire of a new war is really worrying to me. If I had lived in some faraway country and not in a potential warzone, I wouldn't care about this continuing scuffle at all.

Anti-Russian hysteria is a massive exaggeration. It was more like disgust (at the event first and foremost) that such a thing could happen with potential links or influence from Russia. Suspicion, yes. Hysteria? Not even close. If we are basing our opinions regarding geopolitics on Reddit we may as wall canvas 4chan for social commentary.

You overestimate how much influence the media can actually exert in most western nations. We have so many competing voices saying so many different things, and a fairly free and transparent press (best example: BBC), which would render such attempts less than effective.

[Owlbread]

-snip-

Guardian is trying to drag the thread into the gutter and get it locked with the Nazi references, don't take his bait.

[Antsan]

lots of people will probably volunteer to fight the Russian zombies.

I don't think so. As far as I can tell, fear of a nuclear war is pretty high as soon as the topic comes up.

When MH17 happened, the scale of anti-Russian hysteria in many Western media outlets was enormous. The reaction of people on many major bulletin boards like Reddit was very similar - the only people who didn't advocate for a war with Russia were Russians themselves.
Some appropriate media work can easily remove any public obstructions to a war with Russia.

Pardon me if I'm too overreacting about this - my country has a history of being constantly ruined by wars between Russia and European powers: for example, we have very few buildings older than 100-150 years, because our towns and cities were often completely destroyed and rebuilt from scratch several times. The increasing possibility of being caught in a crossfire of a new war is really worrying to me. If I had lived in some faraway country and not in a potential warzone, I wouldn't care about this continuing scuffle at all.

The same media outlets having their hysteric reaction are frequently made fun of and called out for their stupidity by others or even themselves. Not that that would excuse the hysteria but it certainly changes how far that hysteria can spread through the population.

Furthermore most of the people going to anti-war demonstrations probably think of the cited media outlets as not trustworthy.

[Owlbread]

The same media outlets having their hysteric reaction are frequently made fun of and called out for their stupidity by others or even themselves. Not that that would excuse the hysteria but it certainly changes how far that hysteria can spread through the population.

Furthermore most of the people going to anti-war demonstrations probably think of the cited media outlets as not trustworthy.

Guardian knows all of this, he's just trolling and trying to provoke.

[SirQuiamus]

The same media outlets having their hysteric reaction are frequently made fun of and called out for their stupidity by others or even themselves. Not that that would excuse the hysteria but it certainly changes how far that hysteria can spread through the population.

Furthermore most of the people going to anti-war demonstrations probably think of the cited media outlets as not trustworthy.

Guardian knows all of this, he's just trolling and trying to provoke.

Poe's law just kicked in, yo.

[Askot Bokbondeler]

Pardon me if I'm too overreacting about this - my country has a history of being constantly ruined by wars between Russia and European powers: for example, we have very few buildings older than 100-150 years, because our towns and cities were often completely destroyed and rebuilt from scratch several times. The increasing possibility of being caught in a crossfire of a new war is really worrying to me. If I had lived in some faraway country and not in a potential warzone, I wouldn't care about this continuing scuffle at all.

You say this as if it excused your paranoia, but i really don't feel like "pardoning" you. Every country was involved in some war some decades or centuries ago, and every country has grandparents with stories of struggle against oppressors, thinking that it entitles you to distrust an entire hemisphere is quite insulting for everyone including your peers and veterans. The west was invaded by nazis as well, you know? Many countries sufered under autocratic fascist\soviet regimes propped up by the abusive and prepotent powers of the cold war until little more than a couple of decades ago so most of us are *superficially* worried at the spread of Putins tyranical shit-stain. I say superficial because i don't think many people would be worried about or willing to risk their lives, we derive entertainment from getting angry at news from the east but we're more afraid of the conservative right or the radical left in our own parliaments.
You couldn't start a war until russia invades a couple of nato countries at least, but you'd have trouble convincing people to go die for Gdansk. Fuck, Putin is raping every european border in every way possible like a dog humping a leg and you still talk about nato as if it was the agressor?

[Owlbread]

Askot, you're taking his bait. Rise above it.

In Scottish political news - the SNP has a chance of unseating the Lib Dem secretary of state for Scotland Alistair Carmicheal and winning his Northern Isles seat. I can't quite convey how huge that is. Northern Isles are the safest Lib Dem seat in Britain - it's like a Democrat winning Texas or something, I don't know.

The poll snapshots are still looking very positive for the SNP. The New Statesman are saying the SNP could possibly win 50/59 Scottish seats.

[smjjames]

*sneakily steals G.I. Guardians trollbait and runs away with it*