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[Guardian G.I.]

There isn't a Russia thread anymore iirc, so I'll put this here:

A government official who opposed Putin was shot to death near ("meters from") the Kremlin.

Calling it now, it was orchestrated by Putin (of course he's going to condemn it) or one of his allies. Wouldn't be surprised if it was.

I really don't think the death of Nemtsov benefits Putin in any way. Nemtsov's assassination won't stop the Russian liberals - in fact, he is definitely set to become an internationally recognized "martyr" that will rejuvenate the Russian liberal opposition and will make it stronger. Why would Putin decide to throw such a brilliant propaganda boon to his domestic and foreign enemies? It doesn't make sense.

[Sinistar]

Yeah I mean, while I personally think Putin is far from innocent when it comes to various shady deals, he is not stupid. Despite everything people try to pile on him, he's not some bonkers dictator with a cult of personality behind him and a severe insecurity complex that would make him go into a murderous rage just because some anti-Putin guy cries foul things about him. Imho, he has a strong, spiteful personality, but he's to cunning to order some day-time public execution.

Unless Nemtsov had some real, actual dirt on him and killing him would prevent it from sharing it further. 

[Sergarr]

There isn't a Russia thread anymore iirc, so I'll put this here:

A government official who opposed Putin was shot to death near ("meters from") the Kremlin.

Calling it now, it was orchestrated by Putin (of course he's going to condemn it) or one of his allies. Wouldn't be surprised if it was.

I really don't think the death of Nemtsov benefits Putin in any way. Nemtsov's assassination won't stop the Russian liberals - in fact, he is definitely set to become an internationally recognized "martyr" that will rejuvenate the Russian liberal opposition and will make it stronger. Why would Putin decide to throw such a brilliant propaganda boon to his domestic and foreign enemies? It doesn't make sense.

Because people have these associations: "Putin = dictator" and "Dictators are dumb animals" = "Putin is a dumb animal". As a knee-jerk reaction, don't expect to see any rationality in response.

EDIT: ninja'd.

Also I REALLY DOUBT Nemtzov, of all people, would have any "dirt" on Putin, and if he had one, that he wouldn't immediately publish through common opposition media organizations (which BTW are still fully operational and functional in Russia).

Incidentally, are there any country-wide available pro-Communist media in USA? Just checking.

[MonkeyHead]

I doubt very much that Putin had anything resembling any kind of input into the killing. However, considering the number of people who have represented opposition to him who have met a messy end over the last decade, even if it is a remarkable coincidence, it sure does not look good.

[Helgoland]

Well, the death of Nemtzov itself may not benefit Putin all that much, but it serves to create a climate of fear and intimidation: That explains the very public nature of the crime, as well as it's location right in front of a CCTV camera.
I sincerely doubt that Putin or even someone from his inner circle gave orders to kill Nemtzow; but it should be readily apparent that he has created a climate that encourages or at least openly tolerates such acts. The actual killers probably were not affiliated with Putin, but that does not exculpate him.

Who here honestly believes that the killers will be found and put on trial?

[smjjames]

Incidentally, are there any country-wide available pro-Communist media in USA? Just checking.

Not that I'm aware of. Then again, I haven't actively gone looking for them.

[Sergarr]

Well, the death of Nemtzov itself may not benefit Putin all that much, but it serves to create a climate of fear and intimidation: That explains the very public nature of the crime, as well as it's location right in front of a CCTV camera.
I sincerely doubt that Putin or even someone from his inner circle gave orders to kill Nemtzow; but it should be readily apparent that he has created a climate that encourages or at least openly tolerates such acts. The actual killers probably were not affiliated with Putin, but that does not exculpate him.

Who here honestly believes that the killers will be found and put on trial?

me

[mainiac]

But how are they going to create all those new jobs? Shafting the property tax encourages rich (and middle-class) people to live off their capital gains, so no private investments are forthcoming.

Right now there are purchases that people want to make in Greece but can not because they dont have the money to do so.  If you give them money, they will make those purchases.  One way to give them money is direct transfer payments like the poverty relief proposals Syriza will most likely be passing.  Another way is property tax cuts.  Different programs will give different people different amounts of money but they will be giving people money.

I believe that the property tax Syriza is unhappy with is a particularly regressive one, it tends to inflate rental prices and not affect the rich very much.

me

What would you think if they never were?

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Incidentally, are there any country-wide available pro-Communist media in USA? Just checking.

"pro-Communist media" is probably the wrong way to look at it. Communism is old and unexciting these days, the number of advocates for it are nearing the point where they lose critical mass as a movement that can do things. So the answer to your question as stated is no, but other kinds of deeply anti-establishment productions exist.

The other issue is one of availability. If we're talking about broadcasted media, the answer is no. All the big conglomerates exist within an essentially static range of opinion, this range being Fox News to MSNBC. If we're talking about media that you can get your hands on as a whole, with the advent of the internet you could almost certainly find something in that vein.

[Sergarr]

me

What would you think if they never were?

"never" is a long time. I'm sure we'll hear about them killers getting caught or something of that kind in a week or two.

After all, Putin himself promised to do that!

[MonkeyHead]

Oh, they might be scapegoats, but that might not be the same thing as finding the culprits.

[mainiac]

"never" is a long time. I'm sure we'll hear about them killers getting caught or something of that kind in a week or two.

What would you think if in a week or two this has not happened?

[Sergarr]

"never" is a long time. I'm sure we'll hear about them killers getting caught or something of that kind in a week or two.

What would you think if in a week or two this has not happened?

I would think that they're pretty good at hiding.

[Owlbread]

I think Mr. Kasparov said Nemtsov was shot four times, one for each of the children he left behind.

I think when the main figures in Putin's genuine opposition (i.e. not state clowns like Zhirinovsky or Zyuganov etc), whether they're journalists, dissidents, former leaders in exile or even current leaders stop mysteriously getting arrested and put in prison or murdered in broad daylight or otherwise found dead I'll stop putting the blame directly at his door.

[mainiac]

"never" is a long time. I'm sure we'll hear about them killers getting caught or something of that kind in a week or two.

What would you think if in a week or two this has not happened?

I would think that they're pretty good at hiding.

What would you think if there are no suspects and no apparent urgency to an investigation whatsoever?