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[smeeprocket]

I'm not attacking christianity. I am exposing a double standard.

It was an anti-muslim attack and yes it was religiously motivated, regardless of what he did or didn't shout.

Same with the KKK or abortion clinic bombers.

My point is, those things don't get blamed on the entirety of christianity. But extremists on the muslim end cause people to condemn all of Islam or demand that they make apologies for something they aren't even connected to.

Calm down, I'm not saying your religion is evil, I'm saying neither is Islam.

[TheDarkStar]

Islamic Extremists are a tiny, nonrepresentative subset of Islam. It's just that lots of people don't realize how few of them there actually are.

[Erkki]

I'm not attacking christianity. I am exposing a double standard.

It was an anti-muslim attack and yes it was religiously motivated, regardless of what he did or didn't shout.

I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge only few of Breivik's victims at Utöya were muslims. He planted a car bomb in the front of a government building in Oslo and attacked a summer camp of the local labor party's youth division.

Islamic Extremists are a tiny, nonrepresentative subset of Islam. It's just that lots of people don't realize how few of them there actually are.

Exactly!

[FearfulJesuit]

Islamic Extremists are a tiny, nonrepresentative subset of Islam. It's just that lots of people don't realize how few of them there actually are.

Right. I don't actually think anyone is arguing otherwise.

Where I stepped in was where smeeprocket chastised someone for going after Muslim extremists, and then called for Christianity to repudiate the KKK and abortion clinic bombers.

[TheDarkStar]

Yeah, the KKK is more tied to skincolor. It's bad, yes, but Muslim extremists are worse because they came a few decades later when they could have easier access to things like automatic weaponry and rocket launchers. Muslim extremists are also not as opposed to suicide bombings.

[misko27]

Well smeep I don't think it was communicated well enough. It didn't come accross to me as lampooning a position, and there are a good number of people on the internet who believe that, so it's well worth being clear.

[smeeprocket]

Yeah, the KKK is more tied to skincolor. It's bad, yes, but Muslim extremists are worse because they came a few decades later when they could have easier access to things like automatic weaponry and rocket launchers. Muslim extremists are also not as opposed to suicide bombings.

KKK is a firmly christian organization. It is part and parcel of their beliefs.

I rarely communicate ideas well, it seems.

Perhaps it is because I am accustomed to speaking to a different audience, one that is more likely to understand my intent as it is delivered.

[alway]

I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge only few of Breivik's victims at Utöya were muslims. He planted a car bomb in the front of a government building in Oslo and attacked a summer camp of the local labor party's youth division.

Following his apprehension, Breivik was characterised by analysts as being a right-wing extremist with anti-Muslim views and a hatred of Islam,[175] who considered himself a knight dedicated to stemming the tide of Muslim immigration into Europe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anders_Behring_Breivik#Islamophobia_and_Zionism

So yes, he very much was doing it because he hated muslims.

[FearfulJesuit]

Yeah, the KKK is more tied to skincolor. It's bad, yes, but Muslim extremists are worse because they came a few decades later when they could have easier access to things like automatic weaponry and rocket launchers. Muslim extremists are also not as opposed to suicide bombings.

KKK is a firmly christian organization. It is part and parcel of their beliefs.

I rarely communicate ideas well, it seems.

Perhaps it is because I am accustomed to speaking to a different audience, one that is more likely to understand my intent as it is delivered.

Don't equivocate. Hateful extremists using twisted, heretical ideas to justify murder has absolutely no bearing on a religion as it is defined in and of itself- viz. the Nicene Creed, or sola scriptura if you would like. Don't confuse the religion with heretical offshoots.

[smeeprocket]

Yeah, the KKK is more tied to skincolor. It's bad, yes, but Muslim extremists are worse because they came a few decades later when they could have easier access to things like automatic weaponry and rocket launchers. Muslim extremists are also not as opposed to suicide bombings.

KKK is a firmly christian organization. It is part and parcel of their beliefs.

I rarely communicate ideas well, it seems.

Perhaps it is because I am accustomed to speaking to a different audience, one that is more likely to understand my intent as it is delivered.

Don't equivocate. Hateful extremists using twisted, heretical ideas to justify murder has absolutely no bearing on a religion as it is defined in and of itself- viz. the Nicene Creed, or sola scriptura if you would like. Don't confuse the religion with heretical offshoots.

I am not, I am saying there is a double standard about this. Someone even clarified this for you.

[scrdest]

I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge only few of Breivik's victims at Utöya were muslims. He planted a car bomb in the front of a government building in Oslo and attacked a summer camp of the local labor party's youth division.

Following his apprehension, Breivik was characterised by analysts as being a right-wing extremist with anti-Muslim views and a hatred of Islam,[175] who considered himself a knight dedicated to stemming the tide of Muslim immigration into Europe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anders_Behring_Breivik#Islamophobia_and_Zionism

So yes, he very much was doing it because he hated muslims.

Nope. What you did was essentially stating that Stalin (because skirting the Godwin) killed people who sometimes ate sugar, Stalin ate sugar, therefore Stalin didn't want people hoarding his morning coffee condiments, so he killed them to have more for himself.

That was not an anti-Muslim or anti-Jewish attack, the target was picked because it was a camp of the youth of a left-wing party. Whether or not any muslims happened to die was secondary (although I doubt he minded killing them much, given his views). And, well, it shouldn't be hard to prove, seeing what targets he picked.

So, it was an attack of a nationalist, right-wing nut against his political opponents, and him being the aforementioned nationalist, right-wing nut WAS stated and emphasized, as far as I've seen.

[ChairmanPoo]

IIRC Stalin favored tea, actually.... I believe they have his Samovar at the Stalin museum in Gori

[Mr. Strange]

So, it was an attack of a nationalist, right-wing nut against his political opponents, and him being the aforementioned nationalist, right-wing nut WAS stated and emphasized, as far as I've seen.

This is what I've got from the news as well, that his attack was aimed more towards immigration and tolerance policies that are mainstream politics today in Norway and EU.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Islamic Extremists are a tiny, nonrepresentative subset of Islam. It's just that lots of people don't realize how few of them there actually are.

I'd believe that if mainstream Islam would actually fight extremists. It doesn't. Why?

[Baffler]

The ones who are predisposed to violence end up grabbed by the extremists, would be my guess. Further, the ones who aren't don't want to rouse the ire of the ones that are, and in the middle east at least there isn't generally much to recommend the groups that tend to pose the only credible threat to the extremists that will actually recruit such a person.