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[Erkki]

Fake. They should have at least made it attack from head-on to match the Dutch report better. That is a very poor angle to attack a plane, and using an autocannon would not have made the airliner explode.

Besides the Ukrainian Su-27s were on Crimea and apparently at least a good part of them switched owners a while back.

Russians are making themselves look like total fools. This is from yesterday: http://www.ess.fi/uutiset/ulkomaat/2014/11/15/itar-tass-venajan-lapsiasiamies-syyttaa-suomea-ja-norjaa-terrorista and again not a single fact, just made-up claims and threats serving propaganda purposes. Not that thats any news. Their economy is the size of Italy with what, 3 or 4 times the population, and they're basically reliant on energy exports. Russia is screwed in the long term, lets just hope they wont take someone with them.


edit: and heres how its fake: https://www.bellingcat.com/news/2014/11/14/russian-state-television-shares-fake-images-of-mh17-being-attacked/

[Sergarr]

Russia is screwed in the long term

I should note that people were saying that about Russia from Middle Ages, and it still stands here.

You should probably try to explain that before making such definite statements.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Speaking about MH17

How do you think what would happen if majority of passengers were not Dutch\Malay\Australian citizens, but British\German\French\American? 

[Erkki]

Russia is screwed in the long term

I should note that people were saying that about Russia from Middle Ages, and it still stands here.

You should probably try to explain that before making such definite statements.

AFAIK there was no Russia in the middle ages. And Russia became a power in... 1800s? Whatever I say you'll probably still just repeat the Itar-Tass propaganda any way. Look at oil prices, Russia's GDP, Russia's military budget, Russia's media and the so called freedom of speech, the political hunts, Russia's foreign politics and so forth. I'm going to visit Russia(St. Petersburg) in February, you know, when I still can and before Russia visits me. You need to understand that the West, including its "Allies" such as Australia, NZ and Japan, is very worried about Russia's current direction of economic and especially political development because its good for no one. Russia cant afford it, but seems to do it any way. The rhetorics used and the propaganda warfare are resembling the 1930s too much already. And that worry has absolutely nothing to do with Russia's nationalistic mis-perception of itself as a rising power at Europe and US's cost(lol).

or alternatively, just take a look at the Russia Watch thread.

[Sergarr]

Russia is screwed in the long term

I should note that people were saying that about Russia from Middle Ages, and it still stands here.

You should probably try to explain that before making such definite statements.

AFAIK there was no Russia in the middle ages. And Russia became a power in... 1800s? Whatever I say you'll probably still just repeat the Itar-Tass propaganda any way. Look at oil prices, Russia's GDP, Russia's military budget, Russia's media and the so called freedom of speech, the political hunts, Russia's foreign politics and so forth. I'm going to visit Russia(St. Petersburg) in February, you know, when I still can and before Russia visits me. You need to understand that the West, including its "Allies" such as Australia, NZ and Japan, is very worried about Russia's current direction of economic and especially political development because its good for no one. Russia cant afford it, but seems to do it any way. The rhetorics used and the propaganda warfare are resembling the 1930s too much already. And that worry has absolutely nothing to do with Russia's nationalistic mis-perception of itself as a rising power at Europe and US's cost(lol).

or alternatively, just take a look at the Russia Watch thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Medieval_Russia

do you even wikipedia

And I'll have you know: I don't watch Russian TV, I prefer using Western media sources, I read more text in English than in Russian, hell, I even think in English!

And yet you still blame me for being Russian?

[Erkki]

So, you don't know anything about Russian mass media, do you? Actually, are you Estonian or Finnish? You seem to have that very specific variant of anti-Russian propaganda echoing in your words.

This is you some time ago. I know, Estonia, Finland and Sweden are all so anti-Russia in their media state propaganda because they want to invade Russia and take the cookies.

[Sergarr]

No, they're anti-Russia because they fear that we might invade them and steal their cookies.

Nobody in Russia is going to take the possibility of Estonia, Finland, of Sweden invading Russia seriously.

[smjjames]

Russia is screwed in the long term

I should note that people were saying that about Russia from Middle Ages, and it still stands here.

You should probably try to explain that before making such definite statements.

AFAIK there was no Russia in the middle ages. And Russia became a power in... 1800s? Whatever I say you'll probably still just repeat the Itar-Tass propaganda any way. Look at oil prices, Russia's GDP, Russia's military budget, Russia's media and the so called freedom of speech, the political hunts, Russia's foreign politics and so forth. I'm going to visit Russia(St. Petersburg) in February, you know, when I still can and before Russia visits me. You need to understand that the West, including its "Allies" such as Australia, NZ and Japan, is very worried about Russia's current direction of economic and especially political development because its good for no one. Russia cant afford it, but seems to do it any way. The rhetorics used and the propaganda warfare are resembling the 1930s too much already. And that worry has absolutely nothing to do with Russia's nationalistic mis-perception of itself as a rising power at Europe and US's cost(lol).

or alternatively, just take a look at the Russia Watch thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Medieval_Russia

do you even wikipedia

And I'll have you know: I don't watch Russian TV, I prefer using Western media sources, I read more text in English than in Russian, hell, I even think in English!

And yet you still blame me for being Russian?

The state entity calling itself Russia didn't actually exist until the 16th century.

Also, Sergarr, Erkki, calm down, this is starting to get heated.

[Erkki]

No, they're anti-Russia because they fear that we might invade them and steal their cookies.

Nobody in Russia is going to take the possibility of Estonia, Finland, of Sweden invading Russia seriously.

You said you weren't Russian?

You're most warmly welcome to the West, Andrei.

[Sergarr]

No, they're anti-Russia because they fear that we might invade them and steal their cookies.

Nobody in Russia is going to take the possibility of Estonia, Finland, of Sweden invading Russia seriously.

You said you weren't Russian?

You're most warmly welcome to the West, Andrei.

But I am Russian. It's just that I know that most Russian sources are much more biased than European ones, and the chances of having a reasonable discussion with other Russians are close to zero. I wouldn't be able to know as much about the world if I remained confined in the tethers of the Russian language. But despite that, I still consider myself Russian, because my home is Russia. It's my country, and I don't want to live in a different one. It may be not the best, but it's still my country. Even if it may consider me in the future a traitor for some stupid reason, I'll still wish to help it, because - it's my home.

[scrdest]

Even if it may consider me in the future a traitor for some stupid reason...

Don't worry, odds of you becoming a mother of a soldier are quite low.

[Helgoland]

I love my sig right now

Sergarr, it's funny - I feel the same way about Germany. Often I am downright ashamed of our politics, of my countrymen, of the whole nation - but I still belong here, there's no wriggling out of it. It took me quite some time to come to terms with that.

[Darvi]

I'm wondering how long it takes until people realise that I don't actually live on the European mainland.

[Sergarr]

I'm wondering how long it takes until people realise that I don't actually live on the European mainland.

aren't you canadian

wasn't that your big thing back in the days

[Helgoland]

I'm wondering how long it takes until people realise that I don't actually live on the European mainland.

Aren't you from Luxemburg? Or did I get something wrong there?