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[martinuzz]

So what? "You can't attack invading troops because that is an excellent casus belli" is a brilliant kind of strategy. Surrendering is easier

Sometimes I get the idea that you are a pro-Russian agent posing as a Ukrainian extremist, just to stir things up.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Do you guys really think that allowing ~300 military trucks with unidentified cargo is OK?

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Do you guys really think that allowing ~300 military trucks with unidentified cargo is OK?

Anyone who says you should be isn't right.

[smjjames]

Do you guys really think that allowing ~300 military trucks with unidentified cargo is OK?

No, I was responding to the part about potentially shooting on them because what if they actually have food and water.

Like GreatOrder said, Ukraine could simply have them searched, whether randomly or every single one.

[mainiac]

Or the Red Cross would have taken the goods and loaded them which would be the normal thing.  It's not like there is a shortage of third parties willing to resolve this issue if Russia actually wanted to work through established channels.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

As if Russia will let search them...

Even if it has no weapons: food, fuel, clothing, trucks  and so on - can and will be used by Russian soldiers that are already there. Everything should be delivered either by a legitimate government or neutral international organization like Red Cross

It is a holy right of any country to shoot at anything that crosses its border without permission.

[smjjames]

Or the Red Cross would have taken the goods and loaded them which would be the normal thing.  It's not like there is a shortage of third parties willing to resolve this issue if Russia actually wanted to work through established channels.

^THIS

Yet Russia refused to let the Red Cross handle it, which is just making people suspicious.

It is a holy right of any country to shoot at anything that crosses its border without permission.

Uhuh, by that logic, you're saying that the US should just shoot every illegal immigrant (who are crossing 'without permission') who dares to cross the border?

[Ukrainian Ranger]

If they try to enter is a war zone? Absolutely

[TD1]

I think you should amend that to "If they are actively trying to help the other side in a war zone"

[GrizzlyAdamz]

Apparently the convoy has stopped in Siberia* Central Russia since the Ukraine government isn't allowing it to cross the border. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28768746

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28773542
Suspicions and also jokes made of it.

*Whenever I hear Central Russia, I always think Siberia, not Moscow.

Well that's good- if they actually are responding to Ukrainian warnings.

Supposedly Russia's agreed to pass through a controlled border terminal & to be accompanied by RC officials. IF they do that, I'd accept the help even if it gives the Russians a PR win.
A lot of people have been without water & electricity for more than a week.


But they do need permission. If they proceed without it, this was an aggressive act from the start. I just hope Ukraine doesn't stall too long if everything checks out.
And bombing an aid convoy is the absolute worst thing for Ukraine to do, even if they try to cross the border. Try to blockade the road on-foot/with vehicles, open fire if the lead truck doesn't stop? That's as far as they could reasonably go, and even that would be pushing it.
You DON'T preemptively bomb aid caravans dude.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Try to blockade the road on-foot/with vehicles, open fire if the lead truck doesn't stop? That's as far as they could reasonably go, and even that would be pushing it.

So, any nation that disguises their military aid to third parties as RC trucks is given free reign?

[TD1]

Not free reign. They're stopped. Either they stop, in which case they'll be searched and items will get to the appropriate dispensaries, or they don't and they get shot.

That's not free at all. Being stopped is not freedom.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Try to blockade the road on-foot/with vehicles, open fire if the lead truck doesn't stop? That's as far as they could reasonably go, and even that would be pushing it.

Under what circumstances can you stop and or attack an unmarked military convoy entering your country from a hostile nation? If we condemn Ukraine for this, we condemn any nation for attempting the same. That's not how the world works. you don't get to disguise your military trucks as RC, then blame Ukraine for being very skeptical of the reasons as to why a disguised military convoy suddenly wants to enter a rebel-held area.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Try to blockade the road on-foot/with vehicles, open fire if the lead truck doesn't stop?

You see, Ukraine doesn't control a large portion of its border. Other guys are there. The only partial control we have: ground attack jets and long range artillery. Most supplies sneak through that kind of protection rather easily. But sneaking 5-10-20 vehicles daily is one thing, 300 heavy trucks in one go is completely another



I am not worried about PR victory... In case if the trucks will be thoughtfully inspected but allowed to move in... I am worried about:

a) Humanitarian aid going not to civilians but to our enemy strengthening their war effort. For example, one of major problem for them - lack of fuel. Convoy can fix it.
b) Drivers. Who are that guys? Assuming two drivers per truck - that is 600 citizens of unfriendly
c) Same colored trucks with weapons entering through not controlled portion of the border. Our pilots will not be able to see the difference
d) That is a rather long column... It can block roads needed for Ukrainian army pretty well
e) Any other plan Russia may have

That is why I accept only unloading and loading in different trucks drived by Ukrainians\neutrals.
Even here that looks like a rapist buying new clothes and pregnancy test for his victim...

Spoiler: meanwhile in Crimea (click to show/hide)

[Mictlantecuhtli]

It's not illegal to attack an unmarked RC disguised military convoy if it enters your territory without permission.

It has nothing to do with reputation. It's called sovereign rights.