I'm just going to say that "we don't have a problem with people hating brown people over here in jolly Britain, that's an American Thing" is some of the most condescending bullshit I've ever seen before, especially considering everything I've seen from the British right-wing.
MSH, I'm not saying it is nonexistent, I'm saying Europe is more complicated and that whereas American racism is based on notions of white racial supremacy and "us vs them" communal segregation Europe can trace its to historical events and cultural clashes.
You (or TheDwarfyOne, since he most likely brought it up to make a point) could take your own advice and explain why you think Australia's boat immigrant policy aren't racist. If all you want to do is scoff at me then you'd be better off just doing it loudly to your computer.
I'm pissed off because I've just had to retype everything after a browser crash just as I was about to post.
You are saying they're racist. You are making the claim. You prove it. I am too tired to do all the research again when the other person only has to say one word and pretend they don't have the burden of proof. I'll only do more research if it leads to something constructive, and finding out that Australia can't handle more immigrants isn't exactly a shocking thing to need to spend another second on.
Don't get stuck up on the semantics of my "melanin" comments, you know very well that I'm not saying it is the only basis for racism.
1. I don't know that. All my time spent in the GZ trial where big American news stations stressed how white-hispanic he was and literally doctored evidence to create a racial narrative has given me THAT impression and the further impression that it has mainstream belief - considering just HOW MUCH support they got.
2. You said nothing to dispel that impression.
For one:
My perspective is from 'Merrica, where anti-immigration is 100% focused on racism.
It's the same in Europe.
The thing is, it isn't particularly different [from the USA]. I agree that the USA has a whole bunch of racism issues that Europe doesn't (particularly with their institutionalized racism and the way they think in actual races), but the gist is the same.
I don't know about you, but where I'm from saying "the gist is the same" tends to mean "the gist is the same." American racism is divided on skin colour, they have no race other than skin colour to divide themselves on. In Europe where skin colour is just about the same, now that just isn't as true.
For seconds:
Regardless, it's all about where people come from, and about letting certain peoples in and keeping others out.
Or well, "ethnicism", since a lot of racists get all semantical about what racism is.
European racism is not about letting certain peoples in and keeping others out, it is to do with the past historical actions of powers against powers whose consequences linger to this day. Newspapers that try to appease the racist hearts of Europeans by telling them that they have no argument against EU immigration since the majority of EU immigrants are white aryan master race are completely missing the point; it is not a matter of race to begin with.
For thirds:
The more melanin you produce, the bigger chance of you being in the "Out" group, of course.
People are hated for having different cultures, and racism gets worse the browner you are. And currently, the more "Muslim" you are, of course.
Which is of course, utter sheer bollocks.
1. Racism is much less to do with the colour of your skin in Europe, Armenians and Greeks are no less white than Turks and Spaniards and yet racism persists.
2. Some racism doesn't have anything to do with immigration, like Turks and Cypriots. Some racism doesn't have anything to do with different cultures, with one culture having been entirely subsumed or having been intermixed or having played no role in it - like with the Mediterranean, the Balkans or Russia.
3. To dispel the melanin myth further, the majority of violent hate crimes that result in injury in the UK are directed against white people. The less melanin you have, the more likely you are to get wrecked for your skin.
4. The whole muslim thing is again a lot more complicated than that, and simply saying muslimness = bullseye target is a gross over simplification that glosses over many things. It forgets about intramuslim racism, such as with Britain and Pakistani/Bengali muslims or with Azerbaijan and Sunni/Shia sectarian tensions. It also implies that racism is largely only directed against muslims, which is bollocks in practically everything the Ottoman Empire once owned. It also has the happily ignores all the times when muslims are not only accepted, but catered to and celebrated, such as various mosques being built in Europe and there was a Malaysian culture festival in London just last year.
Beyond that, I'm not even sure what you're trying to say here. Racism isn't racist because immigrants are racists too?
I'm saying when you call immigrants opposing unrestricted immigration even from their own race racist, it isn't racism it's madness because they clearly aren't opposing the minimal controls because of racism.
I want to help you out here; I wasn't born into these world views, I acquired them over my time through the persuasion of evidence strung up in neat arguments. Your convictions are strong, your morals are good and all that, but you will never change anyone's mind on this if your gut reaction is to call them racist and then try arguing everything in terms of race, because I and others like me haven't come to these conclusions because of race. Let's say here - what if the conclusion I've come to is wrong, and you have a chance to correct me? What if I've seen the mathematical evidence, the graph charts, the witnesses, the personal experiences and have come to the conclusion the world is a turtle. You have a conviction otherwise, that the world is a spheroid made up of a crust over a molten iron core and all that. You are sure you can convince fools like me of the truth, and you go about explaining it using DaDa performance art. It will get you the same level of understanding and communication as you are doing now.
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Topic: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta! (Read 1778236 times)