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[Sheb]

Actually, we should move this to the Ukraine thread.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

They talk just like Russians from Russia.

Well... Even native language speakers have varying accents depending on geography
That is true for any country that is big enough.

And yep I am confused why Guardian decided to move it here

[Dutchling]

My fault. Should have posted that link in the Ukraine thread.

[Stuebi]

Yeah, you got had. Also, why the three years? Is it because you need to wait for the government to actually implement the constitutional change to be able to vote on it again?

Also, the fact is that Switzerland is more dependent on the EU than the other way around, and with the UK being restless, the last thing the EU want is letting Switzerland pick and choose its treaties. It would be a terrible precedent. Plus , Switzerland actually got a really, really nice deal right now (IIRC, the Swedish ambassador's comment during the negociation was "They raped us on the negotiating table". ) if the guillotine clause is invoked (and it'll be except if the Federal Council do something like fixing the quota for EU members at 20 millions people), you'll have to negotiate again, and you probably won't get as good a deal.

What im saying is, I dont see either side banging its drums too loudly. The usual political dick-waving sure, but im not worried about anything serious in the near future.

And about the 3 year thing, thats just a rough estimate from my side. Someone will gather enough people to put it up for vote again and then shoot it down.

[Sheb]

I wouldn't count of it. You already have suspended Erasmus and Horizon20. Not much, but worse could come when the quotas actually come into place. Switzerland ain't loved in the EU. Even if the treaty don't go away, the EU just gained a really good pressure point to use against banking secrecy for exemple.

[ChairmanPoo]

Switzerland ain't loved in the EU.

The EU ain't loved in the EU

[10ebbor10]

Switzerland ain't loved in the EU.

The EU ain't loved in the EU

Meh, that'll clear itself out once people realize that the EU is used as a boogyman by their own politicians to push through disliked reforms.

I wouldn't count of it. You already have suspended Erasmus and Horizon20. Not much, but worse could come when the quotas actually come into place. Switzerland ain't loved in the EU. Even if the treaty don't go away, the EU just gained a really good pressure point to use against banking secrecy for exemple.

The Erasmus program wasn't suspended actually. It's participation with Switzerland was cancelled. But yeah, there'll be a strong reaction from the EU on this, just to set an example for the UK, and everyone else who thinks about messing with his treaties.

That depends on if Scotland is considered a new member or a successor-state to the U.K.. I don't believe any other state has been in this situation, the Yugoslavia was not a member when it fell apart, correct?

It is still not a member; parts of it anyway. They all share successor state status, but the status of EU membership or negotiations is variable between the countries.

So far, it strongly appears that Scotland will not be granted automatic membership. I mean, Spain is probably going to protest, and the rest of Europe has significant benefit with forcing a renegotiation. After all, that'll allow them to get rid of theUK-era benefits.

Anyway, Eurozone membership for new EU countries might be required, but it's a mid to long term objective. So while you technically have to join the euro as soon as you're able, there's no real pressure. After all, one of the requirements is 2 year membership of the ERM, which is voluntary.

[XXSockXX]

-snip-

I'm not sure if the actual strategy, calling the whole thing a bluff, is that good. The reaction however is interesting, I would have thought people would be more easily scared, but it may have backfired a bit.
I'm not an economist, but the currency prospects are quite shaky. Plan B is definitely not sustainable for long (at least not for a country of that size) and is going to hurt the economy, hoping that the whole thing is just a bluff is very risky and a third possibilty, the Euro, depends on many other things that aren't clear yet.

[Sheb]

I don't know, why would B be so damaging? Sure, it sucks not to control your monetary policy, but neither do individual EU members, and unlike Zimbabwe and the dollar or all those French-speaking African country and the CFA frank, Scotland's economy is at the same level of development than the rUK's, so it shouldn't be too hard.

Also they can just have their own Scottish pound if they want to.

[notquitethere]

Thing is, either way they play it, the British pound will still be a de facto currency in Scotland: I find it difficult to believe that most high street stores will stop accepting the pound when they continue to do so a few miles south of the border.

[Sheb]

You need more than that for a "de facto currency". Scots won't be paid in £, won't pay their taxes in £, won't do their shopping in £. Some shops might keep accepting £ for the tourist market, but that's it.

[XXSockXX]

I don't know, why would B be so damaging? Sure, it sucks not to control your monetary policy, but neither do individual EU members, and unlike Zimbabwe and the dollar or all those French-speaking African country and the CFA frank, Scotland's economy is at the same level of development than the rUK's, so it shouldn't be too hard.

Also they can just have their own Scottish pound if they want to.

I'm not sure why a Scottish pound isn't discussed as an alternative, there is probably a reason for that.

Not controlling your monetary policy is bad indeed, and it's not the same thing as the Eurozone, because it would involve only the rUK and might possibly stand on weak legal ground. Generally something like that has only been pulled off by small countries as a temporary solution.

[Sheb]

Owlbread cited Ireland for a time, which is about the size of Scotland methink.

[hector13]

I don't know, why would B be so damaging? Sure, it sucks not to control your monetary policy, but neither do individual EU members, and unlike Zimbabwe and the dollar or all those French-speaking African country and the CFA frank, Scotland's economy is at the same level of development than the rUK's, so it shouldn't be too hard.

Also they can just have their own Scottish pound if they want to.

I'm not sure why a Scottish pound isn't discussed as an alternative, there is probably a reason for that.

Not controlling your monetary policy is bad indeed, and it's not the same thing as the Eurozone, because it would involve only the rUK and might possibly stand on weak legal ground. Generally something like that has only been pulled off by small countries as a temporary solution.

Scotland is a small country. "The best wee country in the world" as they say...

I think that would be the best idea though, even if the rest of the UK disagree. Keeping the pound and phasing it out while a new currency is created would probably be best for both sides.

AFAIK, and that's pretty much nil, unless the UK impose legal restrictions on Scotland using the pound, they can't really do anything to stop them using it.

[Sheb]

And? Country far smaller than that have their own currencies. I understand why the SNP push the pound as currency (it wants to change as little as possible so as not to scare anyone), if Scotland is going to have a currency union it should be the Euro. Makes more sense.