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Author Topic: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!  (Read 1750194 times)

Owlbread

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3645 on: January 27, 2014, 02:43:26 pm »

I think you ought to focus more energy on the "This is a vote to separate from the U.K. This is not a vote for the SNP to run that separated country, that comes later."

Because I'm sure you have been, but I STILL see people going "I don't want a SNP run Scotland, so I'm voting for No."

MSH has already said what I was going to say in response to this, although the SNP are more likely to fracture post independence than shift to the fringes. You have no idea how much it annoys me though when I hear folk like Robbie Coltrane saying stuff like "I want an independent Scotland, but only an independent Labour Scotland, therefore I'm voting No".

The worst is when I hear people saying "I'm voting no because I can't stand that Alex Salmond."
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 03:09:55 pm by Owlbread »
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10ebbor10

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Owlbread

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3647 on: January 29, 2014, 08:35:18 am »

Scottish-Uk currency Union would result in loss of sovereignty.

Of course it would. I don't think anyone's ever claimed otherwise. My attitude towards the currency union is that it is a temporary measure to ensure stability within Scotland during the transitional period, perhaps up to the oft-quoted year of 2020, then we can consider adopting our own currency or entering the euro depending on the climate. The SNP probably see it the same way but they don't want to rock the boat. If we start seriously talking about an independent currency as government policy then we've lifted a large, mossy stone unearthing tides of slaters.

That said there would be no "loss" of sovereignty per se, more like we wouldn't have as much sovereignty as if we had an independent currency. Right now we have no sovereignty, so the headline is somewhat misleading.

But the people saying "unless you have your own currency/central bank you aren't independent" really, really gar me greet.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2014, 08:39:26 am by Owlbread »
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LordSlowpoke

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3648 on: January 29, 2014, 08:49:37 am »

can i just mention how much i'd like to kick the uk out of the union entirely for all the skepticism they're fostering?

scotland could be readmitted if it turned out that it isn't going to be in just to make sure it never gets ahead in anything

poland would need to be smacked around a bit but not to such a point as the uk too
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Owlbread

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3649 on: January 29, 2014, 08:54:54 am »

Scotland isn't joining the EU to make sure it never gets ahead in anything. That is rather silly. We're joining for the economic benefits of free trade and freedom of movement and the subsidies for our agricultural industry. By the way sir I haven't forgotten your questions - I will inform you of Scottish immigration policies soon, I have just been very busy.
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Descan

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3650 on: January 29, 2014, 01:31:30 pm »

Scottish immigration policy: If you can pull off a kilt, then you're in.
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Owlbread

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Helgoland

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3652 on: January 29, 2014, 04:07:06 pm »

HYPOTHETICALLY:

If Doggerland were to resurface, who would be able to claim it and colonize?
Dibs.
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Owlbread

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3653 on: January 29, 2014, 04:17:44 pm »

Respected scholar and amateur astronomer Brian "Limmy" Limond gives a moving tribute to Margaret Thatcher. As we fast approach the milestone that is a year since her death perhaps we should remember her fondly in similar ways.
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Max White

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3654 on: January 29, 2014, 04:27:50 pm »

Oh poor Maggie Thatcher! I think on this grave occasion I shall have a somber drink to her memory, while surrounded by friends, with party music playing, through a freaking funnel while doing a handstand.

Owlbread

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3655 on: January 29, 2014, 05:20:41 pm »

She's an interesting character. She represents the British standard of Libertarianism in a lot of ways; it's basically that whole "stand on your own two feet" approach to Welfare Libertarians often have in the USA, but with far less of the civil liberties people often talk of. The British, Thatcherite brand of "Libertarianism" is much more authoritarian. Though I disagree with his political views Alex Massie is one British Libertarian academic who had some interesting things to say about Mrs. Thatcher's legacy and how she would have viewed the Britain she created.

I understand Nigel Farage has been doing some things to change the stuffier, more recognisably right-wing attitudes of Libertarianism here, such as in his more open minded approach to drug legalisation (he ascribes to the "drugs are bad" camp but he believes the current approach doesn't work) but he's still infected with the old virus. He still talks about how Britain is a Christian country and so on, let's not even go there about the imbeciles and eccentrics that make up the party membership. But still, it's interesting to compare the Libertarian schools of thought in the UK with those in the USA.

I often wonder if certain camps of American Libertarians are closer to Thatcher's ideology than I think. They'd probably take truck with her anti gun stance and preference for surveillance, though. When British Conservatives talk about the "nanny state" it usually has less to do with lack of privacy/liberty and more to do with us supporting benefits "scroungers".
« Last Edit: January 29, 2014, 05:25:21 pm by Owlbread »
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Dutchling

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3656 on: January 29, 2014, 05:50:03 pm »

Ah, so she's of the "punishing poor people for being poor will stop poverty"-brand?
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kaijyuu

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3657 on: January 29, 2014, 06:14:46 pm »

[redacted]
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Quote from: Chesterton
For, in order that men should resist injustice, something more is necessary than that they should think injustice unpleasant. They must think injustice absurd; above all, they must think it startling. They must retain the violence of a virgin astonishment. When the pessimist looks at any infamy, it is to him, after all, only a repetition of the infamy of existence. But the optimist sees injustice as something discordant and unexpected, and it stings him into action.

Dutchling

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3658 on: January 29, 2014, 06:18:44 pm »

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kaijyuu

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #3659 on: January 29, 2014, 06:19:26 pm »

It was a useless and possibly confusing quip so I edited it out :P
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Quote from: Chesterton
For, in order that men should resist injustice, something more is necessary than that they should think injustice unpleasant. They must think injustice absurd; above all, they must think it startling. They must retain the violence of a virgin astonishment. When the pessimist looks at any infamy, it is to him, after all, only a repetition of the infamy of existence. But the optimist sees injustice as something discordant and unexpected, and it stings him into action.
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