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[misko27]

Then do it American-style: Not compulsory voting, but incentive voting. Don't punish someone for NOT voting, reward them FOR voting. A small monetary gift, a tax break, etc.

Saw wha? I'm not familiar.

The trouble is though that the people who make all of our decisions, take us to war, choose our welfare system and so on are elected on that basis where tiny margins are all that matters.

But those are true majorities, representing a divided electorate. If 40% vote on something, a 51-49 means 20.4% of the whole, a still respectable amount given most don't care. If 1% vote, 51-49 mean 0.51%, which is little more then a rounding error. It's one thing if 25% of the whole population votes for something: it's still, to some extent, a mandate of the politics following class; it's quite another if 5% do. Frankly I would be highly suspect of anyone trying to get independence anywhere with a measly claim to a mandate like that, and it would be easy to deny independence to them.

[XXSockXX]

What do you mean about "blind enthusiasm"?

Well, I think the EU as it is now is the project of an elite that strongly believes in it and wants to realize a political union without bothering to convince the actual population.  For example while there are clear advantages to a borderless Europe, there are also some bad consequences, but if you talk about them you're called a right-wing populist and told that no, there really are no downsides.
Then most southern European states want a fiscal union, because they're in debt. I think it's too soon for that, so I would like to see some more scepticism there.
Then there are the non-sensical small things, stupid regulations and such. I think the EU needs a major democracy overhaul ASAP and should stop messing with my light bulbs or the measurements of fruit and stuff like that.
I also think the EU is expanding too fast for it's own good. If you take it down a notch with the speed and consolidate first you might get better results in the long run.

Also generally I think now too much depends on what France and Germany negotiate between each other, so a stronger country like the UK could make for a bit of a better balance.

[Descan]

I didn't mean the Americans actually do it that way. Was a joke. But still, incentives!

[Little]

Up in Canada, we have a third-party group called Elections Canada that handles the vote, they don't answer to anyone but the public. Corruption would be minimized.

Ahahahaha, Pierre Poutine would like a word with you. Fuck Stephen Harper, the election rigging prick.

[Max White]

The only way you are going to have everybody agree that the process is 100% fair is to issue every voter with a knife, put them all in a big stadium and tell them to go for it. Anything else and there will always be somebody left alive to complain... Then again complaining is kind of the point of a democracy.

[Sheb]

Well, I think the EU as it is now is the project of an elite that strongly believes in it and wants to realize a political union without bothering to convince the actual population.  For example while there are clear advantages to a borderless Europe, there are also some bad consequences, but if you talk about them you're called a right-wing populist and told that no, there really are no downsides.
Then most southern European states want a fiscal union, because they're in debt. I think it's too soon for that, so I would like to see some more scepticism there.
Then there are the non-sensical small things, stupid regulations and such. I think the EU needs a major democracy overhaul ASAP and should stop messing with my light bulbs or the measurements of fruit and stuff like that.
I also think the EU is expanding too fast for it's own good. If you take it down a notch with the speed and consolidate first you might get better results in the long run.

Also generally I think now too much depends on what France and Germany negotiate between each other, so a stronger country like the UK could make for a bit of a better balance.

I'm going to disagree with you one one point, it's that the EU is not so much the project of the people up in Brussels as a scapegoat used by the governments. Right now, nothing get done without the Council (the organs made up of the relevant ministers). What happen is that this Council decide of stuffs in Brussels then each minister come back home and blame "Brussels" for what they just decided. Europe is largely a scapegoat for national governments.

Now we do need more democracy in there I'd agree with this. (Anyone remember the Irish referendum? Can you imagine Putin for example saying "I didn't like this result, you'll have to vote again."? But this is not what the UK wants. The UK has been pushing for less integration and see a democratic Europe a dangerously legitimate.

As far as the fiscal union goes, it's going to be negotiated inside the Eurozone anyway, so the UK will have no influence on that.

The expansion to Eastern Europe was, as far as I'm concerned, a complete success. Just compare the post-soviets countries that made it into the EU with those that didn't.

Finally, the UK has also been a major stumbling block as far as financial regulations are concerned. I'd be glad to see them out just for that.

[10ebbor10]

Significant concessions were made after the first agreement was rejected, you know...

[Sheb]

Are you speaking about the French and Dutch rejection of the treaty? Because then you might have a point, although I don't think the changes were that significant. But there was no change in the Lisbon treaty between the first and second Irish votes.

Edit: I apologize, reading further, while their was no change in the Lisbon treaty, they was an agreement to add some change into the Croatian Accession Treaty and keep 1 commissioner by country. I'm still highly dubious of voting the stuff again.

[10ebbor10]

The Irish one had concessions as well, and it was almost a year after the fact. Combine that with the fact that none of both things had a significant turn-out, or a significant margin. Really, they should implement mandatory voting for stuff like this.

[scriver]

I really hope you're going to win, if only because change is fun. Plus I'm not a big fan of the UK's influence in the EU, so anything that weaken them is good.

I find this absolutely hilarious coming from a Frenchman.

[10ebbor10]

...

[MetalSlimeHunt]

* MetalSlimeHunt takes cover.

[Sheb]

*Aim the Wafflecannon at scriver*

Ready for some hot creamy goodness manneken?

[Helgoland]

Quick scriver, come to exile in Germany! We shall protect you with a strong economy and letting others do the military dirtywork!

[Max White]

Honestly the only reason I found out most of these countries actually exist is from reading Scandinavia and the World... Who even knew that there was a place called Moldova?

Spoiler: Ah Belgium (click to show/hide)