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[Loud Whispers]

Canada is the traditional neutral/international observer of Ukrainian elections in the post-soviet era.  They act as the trusted neutral party in all the other constitutional crisis.  The result of Canada's observations of what the "referendum" in Eastern Ukraine is to call for sanctions on Russia.

Just get New Zealand to do it, they will send sheep and sheep are neutral as neutral gets.

[mainiac]

Canada is soooo neutral, given their completely and undoubtedly un-oppressive friendly neighbors have a very specific point of view.

Yes your country, which invades it's neighbors, is totally not influencing their politics.  But my country which is coming up on the 200th anniversary of our border with Canada being peaceful is clearly intimidating them.  Do you just have no conception of the fact that there are places in the world that dont suck as much as Russia?

Russians basically know that they are being trolls on the international stage so they attack the concept of judgement because they know that any neutral observer will tell them they suck.  If you have no good argument, nothing is left but attacking all the judges.

[Guardian G.I.]

Canada is soooo neutral, given their completely and undoubtedly un-oppressive friendly neighbors have a very specific point of view.

Yes your country, which invades it's neighbors, is totally not influencing their politics.  But my country which hasn't fought it's neighbors in almost 200 years is clearly making them shake in their booties.

Congrats, you make Sarah Palin look like an insightful observer of geopolitics in comparison.  That is no mean feat.

How can an American ally be a neutral supervisor in a political crisis between the United States and Russia?

[Comrade P.]

Canada is soooo neutral, given their completely and undoubtedly un-oppressive friendly neighbors have a very specific point of view.

Yes your country, which invades it's neighbors, is totally not influencing their politics.  But my country which is coming up on the 200th anniversary of our border with Canada being peaceful is clearly intimidating them.  Do you just have no conception of the fact that there are places in the world that dont suck as much as Russia?

Russians basically know that they are being trolls on the international stage so they attack the concept of judgement because they know that any neutral observer will tell them they suck.  If you have no good argument, nothing is left but attacking all the judges.

1. There are countries that suck more than Russia. See Africa. So, we could kinda cope with our problems someday.
2. America is undoubtedly right and knows better what is happening on another continent than the bordering states do and therefore has more rights to influence their politics, right?
3. If we'd invade, we won't be talking, because nukes from you to us and from us to you.

[scrdest]

Canada is soooo neutral, given their completely and undoubtedly un-oppressive friendly neighbors have a very specific point of view.

Yes your country, which invades it's neighbors, is totally not influencing their politics.  But my country which is coming up on the 200th anniversary of our border with Canada being peaceful is clearly intimidating them.  Do you just have no conception of the fact that there are places in the world that dont suck as much as Russia?

Russians basically know that they are being trolls on the international stage so they attack the concept of judgement because they know that any neutral observer will tell them they suck.  If you have no good argument, nothing is left but attacking all the judges.

1. There are countries that suck more than Russia. See Africa.
2. America is undoubtedly right and knows better what is happening on another continent than the bordering states do and therefore has more rights to influence their politics, right?
3. If we'd invade, we won't be talking, because nukes from you to us and from us to you.

Actually, regarding point 2, quite possibly. Local people might hold a TON of different biases for historical, political, religious or what-have-you reasons.

[Comrade P.]

No doubt. But isn't it what it is all about? I mean, people arguing on historical peregrinations and stuff. Of course they have bias. Everyone has bias. Leave us to our own bias, or leave just European bias, I don't think we need another one going from over the ocean.

[Owlbread]

Russia and the USA know just as well as each-other what is going in on Ukraine (along with the EU they've orchestrated this entire crisis, dating right the way back to the early '90s) but neither should have any rights to "influence their politics", especially given that both countries have Imperialist agendas that they are wanting to act out with Ukraine being caught in the crossfire like Cold-War era Germany.

Just because the country is on Russia's doorstep does not give them any right to own them, as hard as that is for some people to believe. The only people that should have the right of "influencing the politics of Ukraine" are the Ukrainian people.

When observers are required, it is hard to find a truly neutral country that isn't a corrupt hellhole or totalitarian dictatorship (furthermore being on the Russian side does not count as neutral) and, despite being an American ally, the Canadians refused to intervene in Iraq. They may be close allies but they're not quite American pawns. 

[Comrade P.]

Fair enough, Owlbread. I'd like to flee from that discussion again on this point.

[mainiac]

How can an American ally be a neutral supervisor in a political crisis between the United States and Russia?

That would be a good question if this was a crisis between the US and Russia.  This isn't about the US and never was except for in the increasingly delusional minds of the Russians.  Not even the far right fringe of the US thinks this is about the US.  This is about Russia being a dick and the rest of the world just half-heartedly telling you guys to stop.

[Loud Whispers]

This isn't about the US

When has this ever been true?

[Owlbread]

That would be a good question if this was a crisis between the US and Russia.  This isn't about the US and never was except for in the increasingly delusional minds of the Russians.  Not even the far right fringe of the US thinks this is about the US.  This is about Russia being a dick and the rest of the world just half-heartedly telling you guys to stop.

My understanding was that the USA was very supportive of the revolution; that support actually involved sending funds to the more moderate revolutionary groups that would work in line with US interests in the region, like Tymoshenko and her allies in the Fatherland Front. The USA has had its fingers in this pie for a long time just like Russia, interfering since the beginning. Ukraine is caught in the crossfire, as always.

[GreatJustice]

That would be a good question if this was a crisis between the US and Russia.  This isn't about the US and never was except for in the increasingly delusional minds of the Russians.  Not even the far right fringe of the US thinks this is about the US.  This is about Russia being a dick and the rest of the world just half-heartedly telling you guys to stop.

My understanding was that the USA was very supportive of the revolution; that support actually involved sending funds to the more moderate revolutionary groups that would work in line with US interests in the region, like Tymoshenko and her allies in the Fatherland Front. The USA has had its fingers in this pie for a long time just like Russia, interfering since the beginning. Ukraine is caught in the crossfire, as always.

America is an infallible defender of freedom and democracy and Russia is a comic book supervillain bent on world domination and how dare you suggest otherwise

[Helgoland]

Am I the only one here who dislikes his own country?

[Owlbread]

Am I the only one here who dislikes his own country?

No, I hate Scotland more than any other country.

[GrizzlyAdamz]

Convenient to reframe this as America v Russia, init?
Not Ukraine, (or its oligarchs), wanting to join the EU, not yanukovitch fucking himself over, it's America showering the protesters with money,  for the ultimate goal of...what?
Meanwhile we've got treaty-violating economic bullying, military threats & a pseudo-invasion.
Damn those Americans and their pie-fingers, damn them!