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[smjjames]

Apparently a gas pipeline (a parallel one, not the main line) exploded in Ukraine and the Ukraine officials seem to be jumping to the conclusion that it was sabotage.

IMO it is more likely to have been either poor maintenance or someone trying to tap into it illegaly. Plus two loud booms and a loss of pressure could mean any number of things. (I'm not on Russias side, just the don't-jump-to-conclusions side)

http://online.wsj.com/articles/explosion-rips-through-gas-pipeline-in-central-ukraine-1403013593

http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/209765.html

http://rt.com/news/166532-gas-pipeline-blast-ukraine/

[TD1]

I'm not an Irishman either, and I can comment on it.

And Irish Republicans most definitely are concerned with "the two political forces that govern" Ireland. You know, given they want to abolish one?

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Apparently a gas pipeline (a parallel one, not the main line) exploded in Ukraine and the Ukraine officials seem to be jumping to the conclusion that it was sabotage.

IMO it is more likely to have been either poor maintenance or someone trying to tap into it illegaly. Plus two loud booms and a loss of pressure could mean any number of things. (I'm not on Russias side, just the don't-jump-to-conclusions side)

http://online.wsj.com/articles/explosion-rips-through-gas-pipeline-in-central-ukraine-1403013593

http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/209765.html

http://rt.com/news/166532-gas-pipeline-blast-ukraine/

I don't believe that such coincidence can happen. Ukraine decided to get gas through Slovakia and the next day an  "accident" happened on a gas-pipe leading to Slovakia

Besides Russia Today arrived ten minutes after the explosion. Explosion that happened in the middle of nowhere. Possible only if they knew beforehand.

And such methods aren't new for Russia - http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/23/international/europe/23georgia.html?_r=0

[smjjames]

Apparently a gas pipeline (a parallel one, not the main line) exploded in Ukraine and the Ukraine officials seem to be jumping to the conclusion that it was sabotage.

IMO it is more likely to have been either poor maintenance or someone trying to tap into it illegaly. Plus two loud booms and a loss of pressure could mean any number of things. (I'm not on Russias side, just the don't-jump-to-conclusions side)

http://online.wsj.com/articles/explosion-rips-through-gas-pipeline-in-central-ukraine-1403013593

http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/209765.html

http://rt.com/news/166532-gas-pipeline-blast-ukraine/

I don't believe that such coincidence can happen. Ukraine decided to get gas through Slovakia and the next day an  "accident" happened on a gas-pipe leading to Slovakia

Besides Russia Today arrived ten minutes after the explosion. Explosion that happened in the middle of nowhere. Possible only if they knew beforehand.

And such methods aren't new for Russia - http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/23/international/europe/23georgia.html?_r=0

You're jumping to conclusions. Also, it wasn't exactly 'in the middle of nowhere', the nearest settlement is about a kilometer away and explosions like that can be heard for miles around.

Yes I mixed imperial and metric measures into the same sentence. Point is that you're jumping to conclusions. Decaying pipelines rupturing or due to human stupidity happen here in the US, so it could very well be that. Sabotage hasn't been ruled in, nor has it been ruled out.

[Owlbread]

I'm not an Irishman either, and I can comment on it.

And Irish Republicans most definitely are concerned with "the two political forces that govern" Ireland. You know, given they want to abolish one?

You are an Irishman in that you come from the island of Ireland, just as I am a British person in that I come from the island of Great Britain. In contrast I have only been to a few places in the South of Ireland on about 5 occasions at the very most. You have greater experience of Ireland than me in that sense, given that you are from Ireland.

But when Irish Republicans speak of "Ireland", that "Ireland" is an entity that is rather different to the two political forces that govern the island.

[Dutchling]

Did you just call someone from Ireland a Irishman?

That doesn't sound like something he's going to appreciate

[TD1]

"I don't, I always think of the island. "Ireland" as an entity is greater than the two political forces that govern it"

Yes, they think of Ireland as an entity controlled by one political force rather than the other. Hmm.

And Dutchling, I'm not an Irishman in that I have no cultural connection to Ireland. No religious connection. No blood connection (Only a slightly bigger chance than the rest of the U.K. for having Irish blood, given my mother is of Scottish descent and my father born in England) no political connection in that I live in Northern Ireland and hold a British rather than Irish passport. An Irishman is one who has "Irish" on his birth certificate. I do not.

[Owlbread]

Yes, they think of Ireland as an entity controlled by one political force rather than the other. Hmm.

Actually most of them want to destroy the Republic and form a new one. Sinn Fein and the rest of them all support the creation of a completely new state. The most hardline Republicans refuse to recognise the existence of the Republic.

Spoiler: Irish-related grilling of The Dwarfy One (click to show/hide)

And Dutchling, I'm not an Irishman in that I have no cultural connection to Ireland.

How do you define "cultural connection"?

No religious connection.

This may sound shocking to you but you don't actually have to be Catholic to be Irish. I know, I know, it sounds crazy but it's true.

No blood connection (Only a slightly bigger chance than the rest of the U.K. for having Irish blood, given my mother is of Scottish descent and my father born in England)

Most people in the British Isles have had ancestors that lived for hundreds of years in Ireland at the time of the ice age. Ireland was one of the entry points to these isles for Neolithic people. That said, blood connection does not matter.

no political connection in that I live in Northern Ireland and hold a British rather than Irish passport.

You don't have to hold an Irish passport to be an Irishman. You do live in Northern Ireland though, which is a part of Ireland under British sovereignty. The name is pretty self explanatory - the name of your province is not "Britain" or "Little Britain" or "Britain Minor", it is "Northern Ireland". It is also a province in which Irish has official status.

An Irishman is one who has "Irish" on his birth certificate. I do not.

It's funny how hard it is for you to accept your Irishness when I, as a Scottish nationalist, accept fully that I am a British person because I come from the island of Great Britain.

[Dutchling]

And Dutchling, I'm not an Irishman in that I have no cultural connection to Ireland. No religious connection. No blood connection (Only a slightly bigger chance than the rest of the U.K. for having Irish blood, given my mother is of Scottish descent and my father born in England) no political connection in that I live in Northern Ireland and hold a British rather than Irish passport. An Irishman is one who has "Irish" on his birth certificate. I do not.

That's why I said it, I wasn't being sarcastic or anything

edit: removed smiley for clarity

[TD1]

...Listen, if I say I'm not an Irishman, the least you can do is respect that. Repeatedly calling me something I specifically say I'm not is more than a tad annoying.

No you don't have to be Irish to be catholic, you're quite right. However...it does happen to be the dominant religion in the Republic. So.....yeah.

Blood matters more or less depending on the person. I have about as much ancestral connection to Ireland as you do. Whether that adds anything to my argument is purely up to you.

Yes, quite right again. I do live in Northern Ireland. Hence, if you wish, you can also call me Northern Irish as well as British. Much like I may call you Scottish as well as British.

You to accept your Irishness

Your presumption being I am deluded? Do tell me how your views are instantly superior.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

No you don't have to be Irish to be catholic, you're quite right. However...it does happen to be the dominant religion in the Republic. So.....yeah.

I don't see how that means anything.

[TD1]

I was just stating a difference. Much as I did when I referenced ancestry.

[palsch]

The only Irish test that matters;

Do you have an Irish accent?

If not, can you fake convincingly?

[TD1]

No, and no.

[palsch]

Then not Irish. Case closed.

*And that's the closest I'll come to discussing Irish politics as an Englishman...*