Ok, just one question. Do you think the US, Ireland, Belgium, all the South American countries, most African ones, etc etc had no right to self-determination?
Those that have been a conquered Kingdom could claim for independence, of course. And also those that are oppresed colonies. That is what the international law says.
Catalonia has never been independent or a kingdom, and so has no right of self-determination.
Oh... I have heard this so maaaaany times. Only Catalonia replaced by Ukraine
Good for you. The kingdom of Catalonia never existed. Before being a region of Spain, Catalonia was only a bunch of Counties without political unity.
It... doesn't work that way. There's no causal connection between those two statements. Self-determination starts somewhere, after all... prior independence or existence as a separate state is not a prerequisite to self-determination. 'Bout the only necessary condition I can think of for that is the ability to work in concert with the group seeking it. You've got the right to self-determination when you can, well, self-determine. Mostly.
I mean, I know the chances of that getting through to you are nil, but someone should probably say it just so people don't think that's actually a rational statement.
Only if you are an oppressed region or you are a conquered territory you have the right of self-determination according to international laws. In this case Catalonia is part of Spain as any other region, and is one of the richest. And it has never been a conquered kingdom. If you are part of an state which sovereighnity is of all of the people that live in that country, then you have no right to divide that country without the consent of the rest of the people that live in that country.
It's sorta dumb to associate common culture with political independence.
Exactly. Every town or city of every region of every country has its own small differences from the rest.
The fact that they haven't been a political entity in the past doesn't mean that they can't start being a political entity now. After all, there's always the first time for anything.
Yes it does. The right of self-determination is part of international law and Catalonia does not meet its requirements.
And you can't just take away the "right of self-determination" from those people, unless you're willing to put them all into chains and deprive them of their freedom.
The sovereignity of Spain is of all the Spaniards. They are the only ones that can divide Spain, not you, not me, not only the Spaniards from Catalonia and not only the Spaniards from Madrid.
Now, I am not going to lose anymore time discussing history-fiction. I have a life.
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