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Bay12 Presidential Focus Polling 2016

Ted Cruz
- 7 (6.5%)
Rick Santorum
- 16 (14.8%)
Michelle Bachmann
- 13 (12%)
Chris Christie
- 23 (21.3%)
Rand Paul
- 49 (45.4%)

Total Members Voted: 107


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Author Topic: Bay12 Election Night Watch Party  (Read 832644 times)

MaximumZero

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4905 on: December 14, 2013, 04:36:09 am »

New debate topic: now that we're in the information age, do we need states anymore? Is the cultural diversity so great that we need mini-countries, or is it just another layer of pointless bureaucracy?
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Frumple

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4906 on: December 14, 2013, 07:59:29 am »

I'd honestly say it's less a matter of cultural diversity and more a matter of administrative ineptitude, MZ. Fact of the matter is that while we, conceptually, have the software (or means to create it, anyway) and methodology that would be needed to keep things running without sectioning the country into subregions, much of our governmental systems are still partially or fully analog, and much of our administrative body is either uncomfortable with, incapable, or unwilling to get(/getting) up and do(ing) a proper digitalization of, well, everything. Basically, while we are in the information age, much of our logistics and governmental/administrative systems are still lagging a generation or two behind*. I'd wager it's going to take at least one more guard change (older, entrenched generation dying/retiring off) before we'll have an administrative body that would actually be capable of setting up and operating within something like what you're proposing, and even then it will probably be another generation or two before stuff really starts getting closer to it.

Beyond that, from a logistics angle it's usually a really good idea to break a large area into smaller ones, especially when a physical presence is necessarily involved (information is near instant, eyes on ground can take much longer, etc., so forth, so on.). States as-is aren't exactly an ideal sectioning, but they work well enough, and given that existent systems are already set up to work with them rearranging things is likely going to be more trouble than it's worth for quite a long time past the point we're capable of better optimizing things.

tl;dr version: Old people are old, and beyond that states are actually a layer of useful bureaucracy, at the moment.

*You see this what seems like almost every damn time something major happens. Game releases (Server going down under strain, despite the people behind the curtain in a position that they should seriously be expecting the level of strain involved), major new digital integration (The varying snafus the ACA's electronic rollout has been accompanied by is a grade A example), etc., so forth, so on.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2013, 08:01:31 am by Frumple »
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GlyphGryph

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4907 on: December 14, 2013, 09:14:19 am »

New debate topic: now that we're in the information age, do we need states anymore? Is the cultural diversity so great that we need mini-countries, or is it just another layer of pointless bureaucracy?

The states serve as a tool of progress - without them, we wouldn't have gay marriage, we wouldn't have legalized recreational pot, etc. and so on. The intent of the states has been, in large part, to serve as "laboratories of democracy" - intentionally allowing for different policies to be implemented in different parts of the country so that the one that works best will then be duplicated in other states as people realize "maybe it's not so bad after all!".

And we WOULD need an additional layer of beuracracy anyway - what country manages without them? Canada, Australia, Russia - every country of significant size has regional governments because it makes things simpler and easier to implement to have locals manage things.

So here's the question: Do you think it's a good thing that recreational pot or gay marriage is legal in any place in the US at all? Do you think the ACA is better than the alternative? If so, you should support the idea of the state system, because without it we would be much, much worse off as we wouldn't have any of those things.
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Darvi

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4908 on: December 14, 2013, 09:17:43 am »

And we WOULD need an additional layer of beuracracy anyway - what country manages without them?
The clever ones?
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Bauglir

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4909 on: December 14, 2013, 11:59:05 am »

Having the states as administrative subdomains is generally useful even from this point of view. It helps break down problems into smaller subproblems, which as any student of algorithms will tell you, does wonders for running time. >_____________>
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In the days when Sussman was a novice, Minsky once came to him as he sat hacking at the PDP-6.
“What are you doing?”, asked Minsky. “I am training a randomly wired neural net to play Tic-Tac-Toe” Sussman replied. “Why is the net wired randomly?”, asked Minsky. “I do not want it to have any preconceptions of how to play”, Sussman said.
Minsky then shut his eyes. “Why do you close your eyes?”, Sussman asked his teacher.
“So that the room will be empty.”
At that moment, Sussman was enlightened.

Helgoland

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4910 on: December 15, 2013, 09:19:27 am »

You tellin' me you don't use MonkeySort?
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PTTG??

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4911 on: December 15, 2013, 02:21:39 pm »

1. Mandatory voting.
2. Preferential voting.
3. Nation wide senate.
4. Superman for president.

Anything else on the Christmas list?

Superman can't be President regardless of his current status, he isn't a naturally-born citizen.
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misko27

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4912 on: December 15, 2013, 02:31:13 pm »

1. Mandatory voting.
2. Preferential voting.
3. Nation wide senate.
4. Superman for president.

Anything else on the Christmas list?

Superman can't be President regardless of his current status, he isn't a naturally-born citizen.
I already sai- never mind.
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Helgoland

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4913 on: December 15, 2013, 02:33:46 pm »

1. Mandatory voting.
2. Preferential voting.
3. Nation wide senate.
4. Superman for president.

Anything else on the Christmas list?

Superman can't be President regardless of his current status, he isn't a naturally-born citizen.
We could invade Krypton, claiming it was US-American all along.
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The Bay12 postcard club
Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

misko27

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4914 on: December 15, 2013, 02:42:01 pm »

1. Mandatory voting.
2. Preferential voting.
3. Nation wide senate.
4. Superman for president.

Anything else on the Christmas list?

Superman can't be President regardless of his current status, he isn't a naturally-born citizen.
We could invade Krypton, claiming it was US-American all along.
The retcon wouldn't change the fact that he wasn't recognized as being an American citizen at the time of his birth.

Plus he renounced his American citizenship to avoid accusations of being influenced by American Interests.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2013, 04:44:11 pm by misko27 »
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mainiac

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4915 on: December 15, 2013, 03:25:45 pm »

In the superman verse, the supreme court ruled that Superman was born in Kansas because he was in an artificial womb back on Krypton and on the way to earth.
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4916 on: December 15, 2013, 03:30:59 pm »

Alternatively, if you accept the "Earth is Past Krypton" idea, then Superman is a natural-born citizen, just temporally displaced.

Anyway, lacking any other news, I've got an article on atheist politicians in the US. The numbers are interesting, and it's officially harder to be elected as an atheist than if you're gay. Also, the number of people willing to vote for a gay president now are almost the same as the number of people who were willing to vote for a Catholic president when JFK was elected.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
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FearfulJesuit

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@Footjob, you can microwave most grains I've tried pretty easily through the microwave, even if they aren't packaged for it.

Owlbread

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4918 on: December 17, 2013, 02:09:44 am »

God I want to find that in my stocking. It's just fantastic.
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Zangi

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Re: Le Megathread de FJ du Politique Améri-Canadiain Deux: Éh?
« Reply #4919 on: December 18, 2013, 09:43:16 am »

And we WOULD need an additional layer of beuracracy anyway - what country manages without them?
The clever ones?
The Vatican City Must be pretty durned clever then.  With a population of 800 in 1 Square KM.
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