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Ted Cruz

7 (6.5%)

Rick Santorum

16 (14.8%)

Michelle Bachmann

13 (12%)

Chris Christie

23 (21.3%)

Rand Paul

49 (45.4%)

Total Members Voted: 107

[Baffler]

I never said that. The norm here is .22LR or .30-06 bolt/lever action rifles, or 20 or 12 gauge shotguns. Just like everywhere else, I assume. Some people use "military style" rifles like the civilian AR-15 too, but the above are far more common and almost nobody only owns such a thing.

"If you need to reload while hunting then you're not a hunter" are words a very wise very good shot of a ranger told me. Only applicable to non-bolts, of course. Unless you reload more than twice. I don't like to fire my bolt actions anymore, they're too pretty.

Heh, a few guys I know have got around that little rule by using a banana clip. It looks absolutely ridiculous 9 times out of 10, but I won't deny it's convenient on a range.

[RedKing]

Wrap up what your point is supposed to be besides exactly what we're saying, which is more regulation is needed

That's 0% my point, and in fact nobody has even mentioned regulation in the entire discussion so far that I can see...  ??

The overall point is simply that introducing children to even high powered weapons MIGHT be perfectly logical for certain reasons and circumstances, and that the only necessarily obvious fault here in this situation is people going about doing things like morons. Whether by choosing the wrong weapons very specifically and/or the wrong range.  But firing even something with too much recoil like a shotgun, at a responsible range taking measures to stop it from flying out of grip, even for a 9 year old, there are potential arguments for.

This is why we're never get to get serious about firearms in this country. Because there is ALWAYS an excuse.
"Oh, they just did it wrong."
"Oh, that gun was stolen."
"Oh, if only the other people had been armed."
"Oh, this was a determined madman, and you couldn't have stopped him anyways."
"Oh, this was just an isolated tragedy."

Never an inkling of a hint of an admission that maybe, JUST MAYBE, we have a societal problem with gun fetishism and availability. Admitting you have a problem is the first step, and there's a vocal minority for whom there is NEVER a problem.

[Darvi]

"I don't have a gun addiction! I can quit anytime! You're not my mother SO LEAVE ME ALONE!"

[RedKing]

Just found this a little further down their FB page:

This is your lucky day!!! Philip shooting the one and only .50 cal Barrett Sniper Rifle!!!! You can skip the hardcore military training and come shoot the Barrett at Bullets & Burgers!!! No need for gun skills here...just fire at will and have a Blast!!!!

So, yeah. Can we please skip the notion that these guys in any way, shape or form deserved to be in business? I really hope the NRA decides to go to bat for these morons in a knee-jerk reaction, and undercuts their credibility with anyone who still has a half a brain (and hasn't had the other half blown out by a nine-year-old with an Uzi). These guys are the new poster children for America's gun problem (i.e. gun fetishism + lack of responsible training/regulation oversight).

[Sergarr]

.50 cal as civilian weapon?

seems legit

[nenjin]

You're really going to sit on hard evidence for this one? Really? Let's try the name of the establishment.

It doesn't really matter all that much. If not this instance, one can still easily imagine going out to do this sort of thing as a learning experience, not for "fun."

But yes, the name is a clue, not a guarantee. For instance, in my local area, there is only ONE single gun range within about a 2 hour drive of my apartment, I believe. If your choice is bullets and burgers versus driving hours and hours further, even a serious family not in it for fun at all might very well go there.

Now, if there's a place right across the street called "Jim's serious and responsible gun training range" or something, then alright then.

So it's a matter of availability? That's your litmus test?

[smjjames]

Just found this a little further down their FB page:

This is your lucky day!!! Philip shooting the one and only .50 cal Barrett Sniper Rifle!!!! You can skip the hardcore military training and come shoot the Barrett at Bullets & Burgers!!! No need for gun skills here...just fire at will and have a Blast!!!!

So, yeah. Can we please skip the notion that these guys in any way, shape or form deserved to be in business? I really hope the NRA decides to go to bat for these morons in a knee-jerk reaction, and undercuts their credibility with anyone who still has a half a brain (and hasn't had the other half blown out by a nine-year-old with an Uzi). These guys are the new poster children for America's gun problem (i.e. gun fetishism + lack of responsible training/regulation oversight).

Sounds a LITTLE bit like something right out of a post apocalypse mad max world with no regulations.

There are people (and a few politicians) who do admit and agree that the guns are a problem, but either nothing ends up getting done or what is done isn't meaningful in any way.

[Frumple]

.50 cal as civilian weapon?

seems legit

*shrugs* If you can afford to buy one, and take care of all the associated paperwork, most places in the states are okay with civvie ownership of... well, most weapons. Including 50 cal. The hella' prices involved dissuades most folks from actually going through with such, though.

[Sergarr]

So Arizona IS the Da Ork Boyz land.

[Lord Shonus]

It's important to note that, despite being located just over the border into Arizona, the establishment in question is very much a Vegas attraction (it's located on the main artery into Vegas from the Southwest states), part of the same thrill-seeking, hedonistic tourist extravaganza that also supports people being able to pay to go up and dogfight in reconditioned propeller fighters, ride in (or drive) racecars hurtling along at 200+ miles an hour, and a large number of other adrenaline-junkie pursuits that carry a significant degree of risk. It has as much resemblance to ordinary American gun culture as horseshit does to peanut butter. (By comparison, most gun rental places in the Midwest (generally also gun shop, the main purpose of the rental is to help you find one that's comfortable for you to handle) don't allow adults to handle their larger weapons such as Desert Eagles or other large Magnum pistols for safety reasons.)

[RedKing]

It's important to note that, despite being located just over the border into Arizona, the establishment in question is very much a Vegas attraction (it's located on the main artery into Vegas from the Southwest states), part of the same thrill-seeking, hedonistic tourist extravaganza that also supports people being able to pay to go up and dogfight in reconditioned propeller fighters, ride in (or drive) racecars hurtling along at 200+ miles an hour, and a large number of other adrenaline-junkie pursuits that carry a significant degree of risk. It has as much resemblance to ordinary American gun culture as horseshit does to peanut butter. (By comparison, most gun rental places in the Midwest (generally also gun shop, the main purpose of the rental is to help you find one that's comfortable for you to handle) don't allow adults to handle their larger weapons such as Desert Eagles or other large Magnum pistols for safety reasons.)

TL;DR

"Oh, it's Vegas."

Another excuse.

[Bauglir]

It's important to note that, despite being located just over the border into Arizona, the establishment in question is very much a Vegas attraction (it's located on the main artery into Vegas from the Southwest states), part of the same thrill-seeking, hedonistic tourist extravaganza that also supports people being able to pay to go up and dogfight in reconditioned propeller fighters, ride in (or drive) racecars hurtling along at 200+ miles an hour, and a large number of other adrenaline-junkie pursuits that carry a significant degree of risk. It has as much resemblance to ordinary American gun culture as horseshit does to peanut butter. (By comparison, most gun rental places in the Midwest (generally also gun shop, the main purpose of the rental is to help you find one that's comfortable for you to handle) don't allow adults to handle their larger weapons such as Desert Eagles or other large Magnum pistols for safety reasons.)

I'm glad to hear the gun community will agree that this is exactly the sort of shit that makes them look bad, and that they will support changes to Federal law to outlaw that kind of reckless business behavior.

EDIT: And can I say that it's exceedingly weird to finally have an incident where the politics of gun control isn't an abhorrent attempt to grab attention from a terrible event that's only tangentially related?

[Sergarr]

tl'dr America isn't bad in general, but it's decentralized structure tend to result in extreme shit happening in various regions.

Like Ferguson and Arizona.

[Lord Shonus]

Very little (if any) legislative change is needed. Like all fully-automatic weapons, Uzi's are already illegal under Federal law (barring an extremely small number of pre-1983 examples) without special (and extremely expensive) permit, and reckless endangerment is already a serious crime. All that really needs to be done is to revoke the establishment's full-auto permit  (not certain if the law allows confiscation of the weapons under permit, as bill of attainder would apply unless special provision was made in the permit law), but it would absolutely prohibit them from allowing any non-permit holder to fire them, and arrest the management staff for reckless endangerment homicide.

[Frumple]

... I wonder if the NRA realizes they could win some hella' brownie points if they immediately and visibly threw their weight behind that course of events...