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[Neonivek]

We are talking about creatures who "regenerate" 10ebbor10... as in creatures who do in fact regrow their nervous system.

[10ebbor10]

We are talking about creatures who "regenerate" 10ebbor10... as in creatures who do in fact regrow their nervous system.

Point is, nervous tissue never ever heals. Not even in creatures that have a high regeneration stat.

Some species don't have nervous systems though, so it could work for them. (Or by magic, I suppose)

[Neonivek]

No creatures regenerate right now except during transformations.

In the future there will be regeneration

[10ebbor10]

No creatures regenerate right now except during transformations.

In the future there will be regeneration

Maybe yes, or maybe not. However, any such regeneration will need to be magical. (Biological regeneration is a thing, but that just tends to regrow arms rather than go look for the old ones). (Speaking of which, why would you need the old part, (which pretty much is only a lump of death cells by that point, rather than just growing an entirely new appendage))

However, it's highly unlikely that these'll ever be the case for dwarves, so in that way, the original post stil fails to make sense.

((OH, and just a note, regeneration is often used as the name for currently implemented creatures that can heal rapidly, hence the confusion. It was quite hard to find out that you were talking about a completely hypothetical yet to be implemented secondary feature))

[Neonivek]

Currently regeneration is a planned feature but one that hasn't been implimented yet. It isn't a guess or what if.

Also yeah it won't likely ever be available for dwarves.

But still it doesn't hurt to consider regenerating civs considering it.

[10ebbor10]

Just as a note, the only reference to regeneration I could find in any of the devgoals (old, powergoals, new devblog) refers to the regeneration of wilderness populations. (Ak, the fact that a population can grow and restabilize itself, nothing to do with wounds).

But still, it makes little sense for a being to have to reattach their severed limbs for them to grow back, rather than growing new ones. Energy cost is roughly the same, as the reuseability of a hunk of dead meat is limited, and the latter is much more versatile than the earlier.

It makes more sense for magical regeneration of nonliving creatures (BC, for example), but these are already rather powerfull, so giving them the ability of surviving anything but a direct decapicitation might not be a very nice idea.

[Di]

You do realize that some cells live for quite a while so that people get their (or someone's else) organs put back into them, do you?
Also, if you bring a bodypart to hospital in right condition, you can get your finger or hand sewn back to you.

Finally, you do realize applying scientific fact such as zero nerve healing to a creature that can hypothetically regrow said nerves from zero isn't quite appropriate?

[Ωmega]

people seem to be comparing how dwarve's bodies heal themselves to humans e.g humans cant regenerate nerves so reattaching limbs is useless. what if dwarves DO have the ability to regenerate differently than humans? they already have ultra livers why not nerves?

[10ebbor10]

people seem to be comparing how dwarve's bodies heal themselves to humans e.g humans cant regenerate nerves so reattaching limbs is useless. what if dwarves DO have the ability to regenerate differently than humans? they already have ultra livers why not nerves?

I was basing myself on the raws, which clearly state that dwarven(or actually, most creatures) nerves do not posses the ability to heal.

You do realize that some cells live for quite a while so that people get their (or someone's else) organs put back into them, do you?
Also, if you bring a bodypart to hospital in right condition, you can get your finger or hand sewn back to you.

Finally, you do realize applying scientific fact such as zero nerve healing to a creature that can hypothetically regrow said nerves from zero isn't quite appropriate?

Quite a while is quite an overstatement. Organ transfers rely on immediate freezing in order to preserve cell death. Finger reattachment on the other hand relies on the fact that your finger nerves ain't all that usefull, and hence that they aren't really needed. You can perfectly work with one numb finger. A hand is more problematic, and it really depends on how long the thing has been left out. A thing the time window is a few hours at best. Even then, full recovery often takes multiple years, or doesn't happen.

Also, another note, the only reliable option in the DF timeframe for sealing major arteries is to burn them shut. I highly doubt dwarven healthcare can reconstruct all the nerves and blood vessels.

As for the latter, the confusion stems from the fact that I thought Neonivek was talked about already implemented regeneration (basically very fast healing) vs a supposedly upcoming feature of which I haven't managed to find any trace. Besides, regrowing nerves from zero is easier than having them grow into an reconnect a seperated limb. Blood poisoning is a thing you know.

[GreatWyrmGold]

people seem to be comparing how dwarve's bodies heal themselves to humans e.g humans cant regenerate nerves so reattaching limbs is useless. what if dwarves DO have the ability to regenerate differently than humans? they already have ultra livers why not nerves?

Because that doesn't make any sense?
Dwarven livers (which are big, not "ultra") let them consume copious amounts of alcohol. There's no similar precedent for "ultrahealing."

And ebbor, I really think you should stop worrying about how a creature with such fast healing would react. Even if you don't assume that magic would take care of the issues, any creature which can regrow or reattach a limb has a sufficient healing factor to deal with pretty much any ailment short of death.

[Deepblade]

I had heard from a nurse that nerves actually do regrow, they're just stupid in that when trying to regrow they don't try to reclaim the nerve endings from the reattached appendage. They simply start growing out from the closest point and make a new network. The process is so woefully slow that by the time it gets anywhere useful (say from your shoulder to your elbow) that the limb is useless from lack of use.

At least, that's what I was told

[Neonivek]

No you are right Deepblade. The myth that brain tissue and nerve tissue never heals has long since been debunked.

It is just rather slow.

Though this has created the scenario where things the brain heals from all the time (brain bruising for example... ignoring haematoma which isn't in the game) never heals.

[SanDiego]

We are talking about creatures who "regenerate" 10ebbor10... as in creatures who do in fact regrow their nervous system.

Point is, nervous tissue never ever heals. Not even in creatures that have a high regeneration stat.

Some species don't have nervous systems though, so it could work for them. (Or by magic, I suppose)

The nervous tissue DOES heal. And peripherial nerves even regenerate (though it needs precise surgical reconstruction). Any regeneration within central nervous system (brain+spinal cord) is abortive and results in glial scar.

On the topic of reattaching limbs - it's true, that today surgeons in replantation centers (there should be one per 5 million citizens) can reattach fingers and even limbs - it just needs to be done quickly and requires modern equipment, including surgical microscope.

[10ebbor10]

We are talking about creatures who "regenerate" 10ebbor10... as in creatures who do in fact regrow their nervous system.

Point is, nervous tissue never ever heals. Not even in creatures that have a high regeneration stat.

Some species don't have nervous systems though, so it could work for them. (Or by magic, I suppose)

The nervous tissue DOES heal. And peripherial nerves even regenerate (though it needs precise surgical reconstruction). Any regeneration within central nervous system (brain+spinal cord) is abortive and results in glial scar.

On the topic of reattaching limbs - it's true, that today surgeons in replantation centers (there should be one per 5 million citizens) can reattach fingers and even limbs - it just needs to be done quickly and requires modern equipment, including surgical microscope.

Not in game, and certainly not fast enough for simply reattaching limbs to work (perfectly). Besides, it's more of a case for the nerve regrowing rather than the cutoff part healing.

Anyway, the point is that with dwarf fortress technology, reattaching limbs is almost , but not quite, impossible. There's a ver large chance of infection, so reattaching fingers has a very good chance of costing you your hand or even your arm.

[GreatWyrmGold]

I'd just like to point out that saying that nerves can regrow is something like saying you can swim to Africa--technically true, but not practically so.

While limb atrophy and nerves slowly regrowing to fill out the network sounds neat, I don't think more than one or two dwarves, period, would be likely to benefit from it.