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Author Topic: You are a new God OOC thread.  (Read 109889 times)

GreatWyrmGold

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #420 on: January 23, 2013, 07:08:16 pm »

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So? Showing outsiders that even peasants get magical powers would show how kind, loving, and powerful we are.
We simply can't afford to give everyone boons. Nice if we could, but we can't.
Good thing we're only giving them to half a dozen, then.

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But Mr. Ranger, this IS a game! And all games have to have stupidly simple mechanics for XP!
All games may not, but it's still doesn't make sense if having more people sharing the same task, thus decreasing the amount of work for each of them, would get the same amount of xp from it as if they were alone.
Why not? They get a chance to excersize their powers, share their findings, and the experience is gained by five people.

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More relevantly: Laskus's awesome was in part due to the boon Maher gave him.
We still don't know that Maher gave him a boon.
Could have sworn we did...

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And helping agriculture isn't helpful...?
It is only minorly helpful, when we could do something more helpful with the mana. If we had a sort of cash crop, then it would be more helpful, because we could buy more things with it.
Mana's worthless if we don't use it. Besides, if we spread the magic around, we get more people interested and therefore interested in converting, meaning that we get a long-term mana gain. It's an investment.

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1. Assumptions. Besides, at some point we're going to be expanding faster than our bloodmelons can grow...
2. The people that will hopefully be flocking to us, or who we build homes for to evangelize?
3. Opinion. Either way doesn't change the general facts.
4. Fair point.
5. Heh heh. Here I thought it was required for life...
6. ...By getting boons and the skills they learn by using them, which can't be learned any other way?
1. Not random assumptions. We have enough food now, or else we would have someone saying "we don't have enough food!" The bloodmelons also do not grow many seeds, so it's reasonable that they haven't maxed their growth yet. We may have enough food later, or we may not, depending on the relative growth rates, but there's no point in addressing that unless we know it needs to be addressed.
2. We can put Eldrick on that, and as for evangelism, there are probably better ways to do that than littering other gods' towns with giant mushrooms.
3. Not an opinion. Fact: We do not know how effective evangelism with that boon is. Assumption: It is better to know something works before doing it en masse.
6. The children (mage children), not the people with the boon. And you can't teach if you have no skill in it, what would you teach then?
1. Your assumption was that they were spreading fast. That's a stupid assumption. For all we know, we could be harvesting them at an unsustainable rate and just haven't noticed...
2. The mushroom-raisers aren't the Evangelizers. Also, Eldrick's one guy, meaning that he can only do about one thing at a time.
3. Fact: Evangelism is not worthless. Fact: Evangelism now means we increase our mana income sooner. Opinion: We should see how effective it is before "bothering."
5. Dropped. Food is always needed. It's inelastic. Between historical precedent and Malthus's theories, there's probably some starving people.
6. Indeed. How can they teach if they never learn? If they get boons, they can learn. If they don't, they can't.

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Then what was that lightning jumps? 99% that it's a boon. 1% is that it's a permanent modification (that's even costlier then boons)
I assumed it was a part of his original creation, like the fact that new Laksus can regenerate. It doesn't say either way, so the point is moot.
Lightning jumps seem more like a Maher-boon than an ability vampires would get.

Nope, That's diversity for the sake of diversity. I want to improve our economy with concentrated plant booning, And I don't wanna to repeat all my reasons

If you want combat fire mages add them in addition to that planters not instead, and I'll support adding as many apprentices for Azula as you want...

And I am especially against giving chaos boons to anyone untested. Even Alchemist was like 70%good\30%bad  decision for me
+1

Nope, That's diversity for the sake of diversity. I want to improve our economy with concentrated plant booning, And I don't wanna to repeat all my reasons
If you want combat fire mages add them in addition to that planters not instead, and I'll support adding as many apprentices for Azula as you want...
And I am especially against giving chaos boons to anyone untested. Even Alchemist was like 70%good\30%bad  decision for me
Having only life would be like only using rock in Rock, Paper, Scissors.
No, it's like playing a cleric instead of a fighter. They're both useful, but neither is inherently superior and neither is involved in an arbitrary R/P/S arrangement. Especially since we're not involved in a Farm-Off.

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We could get rid of the chaos boon in favor of another life boon, since they are more helpful right now. However, we should still keep the fire boons. I'd just like to caution against having too many of the same. It could be our undoing.
Seeing as plants are pretty versatile with the right creations, it's not as bad as it sounds.

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Speaking of which, we should check up on the alchemist, see how he's doing.
Well, duh.

Nope, That's diversity for the sake of diversity. I want to improve our economy with concentrated plant booning, And I don't wanna to repeat all my reasons
If you want combat fire mages add them in addition to that planters not instead, and I'll support adding as many apprentices for Azula as you want...
And I am especially against giving chaos boons to anyone untested. Even Alchemist was like 70%good\30%bad  decision for me
Azula is about our least untested person.
Azula has a pretty simple ability; it's known that she can throw fireballs and -blasts.
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Remuthra

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #421 on: January 23, 2013, 07:28:18 pm »

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Good thing we're only giving them to half a dozen, then.
Agreed.

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Why not? They get a chance to excersize their powers, share their findings, and the experience is gained by five people.
They'd each be doing less work, and thus have less chance to exercise their powers. Also, because it would be unbalanced if having 2 booners grow a mushroom each give less xp than 2 booners growing a single mushroom twice as big.

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Mana's worthless if we don't use it. Besides, if we spread the magic around, we get more people interested and therefore interested in converting, meaning that we get a long-term mana gain. It's an investment.
We don't even know if we will get any extra followers whatsoever, and also, saved mana is not worthless, it has the exact same value as before. If you don't spend your money, it's still money.

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1. Your assumption was that they were spreading fast. That's a stupid assumption. For all we know, we could be harvesting them at an unsustainable rate and just haven't noticed...
2. The mushroom-raisers aren't the Evangelizers. Also, Eldrick's one guy, meaning that he can only do about one thing at a time.
3. Fact: Evangelism is not worthless. Fact: Evangelism now means we increase our mana income sooner. Opinion: We should see how effective it is before "bothering."
5. Dropped. Food is always needed. It's inelastic. Between historical precedent and Malthus's theories, there's probably some starving people.
6. Indeed. How can they teach if they never learn? If they get boons, they can learn. If they don't, they can't.

1. I never said anything about them spreading fast, and if we were being unsustainable, we would have run out of bloodmelons, because we only made a few to begin with, and only now increased the need substantially.
2. You just said they were. Also, Eldrick is serving fine right now, we could use 1 or 2 more life booners for skill, but we have enough for our needs now.
3. Those aren't facts. How do you know it's not worthless? And should we not confirm that our evangelism works before investing into it?
5. Forgot about that. Supply and demand. Food is a neccessity, but people everywhere grow it everywhere, so it's not nearly as valuable as many other things. There's probably some starving people, but that's probably more because they can't buy the food, not because the food is overly expensive, and so there isn't much to undercut.

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Lightning jumps seem more like a Maher-boon than an ability vampires would get.
It seems like a representation of Maher's power, similarly to how a vine whip isn't something a metal golem would have, but it was included to represent our power in the creation. Perfectly natural creation ability.

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No, it's like playing a cleric instead of a fighter. They're both useful, but neither is inherently superior and neither is involved in an arbitrary R/P/S arrangement. Especially since we're not involved in a Farm-Off.
It's more versatility as opposed to more focus on one aspect. But since we aren't involved in a farm-off, versatility is more useful.

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Azula has a pretty simple ability; it's known that she can throw fireballs and -blasts.
She's our most experienced boon user in general, she has had the most power for the longest time. Therefore, she would have the most general boon experience.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 07:31:40 pm by Remuthra »
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kytuzian

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #422 on: January 23, 2013, 07:41:11 pm »

Having only life would be like only using rock in Rock, Paper, Scissors.
No, it's like playing a cleric instead of a fighter. They're both useful, but neither is inherently superior and neither is involved in an arbitrary R/P/S arrangement.

But its not. Its also like having a wizard with only fire spells. Carrying only a bow. Or something similarly single-minded. And while neither is superior, there are situations. Since we're already doing this thing, its almost always better to be a cleric than a rogue when fighting undead. But if you find yourself needed to disable a trap, you're better off with a rogue. You're suggesting to use the same approach for every situation, such as just running through the trap and healing yourself, when there could be other more efficient methods.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 07:44:30 pm by kytuzian »
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gman8181

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #423 on: January 23, 2013, 07:44:56 pm »

Hey can we ask the goddess we just met if there are any ways she knows of for us to get more natural mages?  Maybe any places we could recruit them.
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Remuthra

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #424 on: January 23, 2013, 07:45:53 pm »

Hey can we ask the goddess we just met if there are any ways she knows of for us to get more natural mages?  Maybe any places we could recruit them.
+1

GreatWyrmGold

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #425 on: January 23, 2013, 08:02:06 pm »

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Why not? They get a chance to excersize their powers, share their findings, and the experience is gained by five people.
They'd each be doing less work, and thus have less chance to exercise their powers. Also, because it would be unbalanced if having 2 booners grow a mushroom each give less xp than 2 booners growing a single mushroom twice as big.
You haven't addressed my points...and you're assuming that XP is a major game element.

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Mana's worthless if we don't use it. Besides, if we spread the magic around, we get more people interested and therefore interested in converting, meaning that we get a long-term mana gain. It's an investment.
We don't even know if we will get any extra followers whatsoever, and also, saved mana is not worthless, it has the exact same value as before. If you don't spend your money, it's still money.
1. Oh, sure, evangelism may be assumed to be worthless.
2. If you don't spend money, what good is it?

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1. Your assumption was that they were spreading fast. That's a stupid assumption. For all we know, we could be harvesting them at an unsustainable rate and just haven't noticed...
2. The mushroom-raisers aren't the Evangelizers. Also, Eldrick's one guy, meaning that he can only do about one thing at a time.
3. Fact: Evangelism is not worthless. Fact: Evangelism now means we increase our mana income sooner. Opinion: We should see how effective it is before "bothering."
5. Dropped. Food is always needed. It's inelastic. Between historical precedent and Malthus's theories, there's probably some starving people.
6. Indeed. How can they teach if they never learn? If they get boons, they can learn. If they don't, they can't.
1. I never said anything about them spreading fast, and if we were being unsustainable, we would have run out of bloodmelons, because we only made a few to begin with, and only now increased the need substantially.
Well, you actually did. Also, since we, quote, "just increased the need substantially," it is quite possible that our consumption rates outstrip the regrowth rates.

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2. You just said they were. Also, Eldrick is serving fine right now, we could use 1 or 2 more life booners for skill, but we have enough for our needs now.
You misunderstood what I said, and we "don't need" Life Booners because we're not using them. A surplus of food always helps, to say nothing of what happens when we make new plants...

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3. Those aren't facts. How do you know it's not worthless?
Au contrare. There's real-world evidence on the first, putting aside how unlikely it is that Corruptor would have let us send some people off on an unexpectedly Wild Goose type of chase. As for the second, that's mathematics.

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And should we not confirm that our evangelism works before investing into it?
Oh, sure. Let's ignore common sense and assume evangelism does nothing. [/sarcasm]

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5. Forgot about that. Supply and demand. Food is a neccessity, but people everywhere grow it everywhere, so it's not nearly as valuable as many other things. There's probably some starving people, but that's probably more because they can't buy the food, not because the food is overly expensive, and so there isn't much to undercut.
If we grow food hundreds or thousands of times as fast...that removes pretty much the only cost. With a few Life Booners focused on growing meatmelons* and wheat, we can sell food to other villagers for just about as little as we like and still turn a profit. Capitalism, ho!
*Which could sell for more. Meat is considered a luxury food in real-world medieval times, so a substitute would be roughly analogous to imitation lobster or something, which sells for more (pound-for-pound) than bread.

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Lightning jumps seem more like a Maher-boon than an ability vampires would get.
It seems like a representation of Maher's power, similarly to how a vine whip isn't something a metal golem would have, but it was included to represent our power in the creation. Perfectly natural creation ability.
What makes you think Maher made vampires?

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No, it's like playing a cleric instead of a fighter. They're both useful, but neither is inherently superior and neither is involved in an arbitrary R/P/S arrangement. Especially since we're not involved in a Farm-Off.
It's more versatility as opposed to more focus on one aspect. But since we aren't involved in a farm-off, versatility is more useful.
Life boons are a lot more versatile than fire boons. Look at Eldrick; he's done everything from making bushes spring up in combat to making mushrooms into buildings with that little power of his. Fire? It burns. That's about it.

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Azula has a pretty simple ability; it's known that she can throw fireballs and -blasts.
She's our most experienced boon user in general, she has had the most power for the longest time. Therefore, she would have the most general boon experience.
...How is that relevant to saying she's the "least tested"?
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kytuzian

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #426 on: January 23, 2013, 08:18:39 pm »

Azula is about our least untested person.

Least untested. Not least tested.

GreatWyrmGold

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #427 on: January 23, 2013, 08:21:49 pm »

Azula is about our least untested person.
Least untested. Not least tested.
Oh. Stupid un...
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Rolepgeek

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #428 on: January 23, 2013, 08:41:30 pm »

So, I spend the last 45 minutes making a nice, long, good post about some creature ideas and my thoughts. I try to post it. It gets a 504 time out. I hit back button, which usually lets me go back with all my words still there. And it's gone. So...fuck. Basically, make creatures that can do Life boon stuff. Our previous magical creatures don't cost any upkeep to do their magical stuff, why would these ones? And they can reproduce, which is better. I basically suggested changing a sap to do that. Also, making scouts, Phoenixes, huge transports, heavy artillery, turret like plants, and ambush units. But whatever.
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GreatWyrmGold

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #429 on: January 23, 2013, 08:44:18 pm »

So, I spend the last 45 minutes making a nice, long, good post about some creature ideas and my thoughts. I try to post it. It gets a 504 time out. I hit back button, which usually lets me go back with all my words still there. And it's gone. So...fuck. Basically, make creatures that can do Life boon stuff. Our previous magical creatures don't cost any upkeep to do their magical stuff, why would these ones? And they can reproduce, which is better. I basically suggested changing a sap to do that. Also, making scouts, Phoenixes, huge transports, heavy artillery, turret like plants, and ambush units. But whatever.
I dunno; it sounds efficient, but also kinda cheap...
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Remuthra

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #430 on: January 23, 2013, 08:53:58 pm »

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You haven't addressed my points...and you're assuming that XP is a major game element.
Xp is a major game element, it gives +1 to that magic. And I did address your points.

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1. Oh, sure, evangelism may be assumed to be worthless.
2. If you don't spend money, what good is it?
1. The civilians may have not been compelled by the evangelism. For all we know, they may have assumed we were evil, although it's not likely. We just don't know yet, and so you cannot say that evangelism is worthwhile.
2. If we don't spend mana, we can send it later. Wouldn't it be nice to have more than 0 mana in a battle for once?

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Well, you actually did. Also, since we, quote, "just increased the need substantially," it is quite possible that our consumption rates outstrip the regrowth rates.
Never said anything like that. If I did, show me. And if indeed we are now consuming faster than it is being replenished, we are still getting more bushes since we are not eating the seeds, so that won't be a problem for long.

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Au contrare. There's real-world evidence on the first, putting aside how unlikely it is that Corruptor would have let us send some people off on an unexpectedly Wild Goose type of chase. As for the second, that's mathematics.
1. real world evidence has nothing to do with this since it is fictional. 2. We just don't know. If it is effective, it could be not worthwhile. Attracting 1 person is not much for our work.

[quoteYou misunderstood what I said, and we "don't need" Life Booners because we're not using them. A surplus of food always helps, to say nothing of what happens when we make new plants...][/quote]
If we don't need Life Booners, we shouldn't make them. And a surplus of food does not always help. If you have more food then you can use, then that money for the surplus could have been spent on things that are immediately useful, like expanding the afterlife. And when we make more plants to make Life Booners more useful, we can make more life booners. Also,
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2. The people that will hopefully be flocking to us, or who we build homes for to evangelize?
is where you said it.

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If we grow food hundreds or thousands of times as fast...that removes pretty much the only cost. With a few Life Booners focused on growing meatmelons* and wheat, we can sell food to other villagers for just about as little as we like and still turn a profit. Capitalism, ho!
*Which could sell for more. Meat is considered a luxury food in real-world medieval times, so a substitute would be roughly analogous to imitation lobster or something, which sells for more (pound-for-pound) than bread.
We do not know how much these will sell for.  And growing things with magic to sell for silver is converting mana into silver. We have better ways of doing that, so we don't need to be using less efficient methods.

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Oh, sure. Let's ignore common sense and assume evangelism does nothing. [/sarcasm]
We just don't know. I refer you to my above response. Stop assuming completely unproven things and just wait a day or two, so we can guage if it is a good enough use of mana and manpower. And common sense is nothing more than guesswork.

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What makes you think Maher made vampires?
For one, he's a death god. For another, vampires aren't living, and therefore have no soul, so they could not have been a preexisting race. Third, how would such a race come to be otherwise?

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Life boons are a lot more versatile than fire boons. Look at Eldrick; he's done everything from making bushes spring up in combat to making mushrooms into buildings with that little power of his. Fire? It burns. That's about it.
Let's represent this one mathematically. Yes, L > F. However, L+F> L, because we know fire is useful in some things.

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...How is that relevant to saying she's the "least tested"?
I said she's the most tested, not the least, and thus is most likely to be able to control a chaos boon.

Rolepgeek

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #431 on: January 23, 2013, 08:57:34 pm »

When did anyone say that being alive was a requirement for having a soul? Our followers in the afterlife are dead. They have souls.
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gman8181

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #432 on: January 23, 2013, 09:05:56 pm »

When did anyone say that being alive was a requirement for having a soul? Our followers in the afterlife are dead. They have souls.

Yep, besides when we fought Laskus and killed him as a vampire, we got his soul.  That wouldn't have been possible if some undead didn't have souls and neither would our golem.
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #433 on: January 23, 2013, 09:11:28 pm »

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For another, vampires aren't living, and therefore have no soul, so they could not have been a preexisting race.
Strange assumption...
And in many, many setting vampires aren't former dead but a race and perfectly alive

And how I missed that?
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Xp is a major game element, it gives +1 to that magic. And I did address your points.
Lol. Again. If game system have leveling  up system it doesn't mean it have XP. Most game systems I play have leveling but no XP.  And there are many ways to give XP, not only that D&D style you assume - task give X XP, if several people have done it jointly divide it on their number
« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 09:18:58 pm by Ukrainian Ranger »
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Remuthra

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Re: You are a new God OOC thread.
« Reply #434 on: January 23, 2013, 09:49:00 pm »

When did anyone say that being alive was a requirement for having a soul? Our followers in the afterlife are dead. They have souls.
They don't have souls, they are souls. Their dead bodies have no souls.
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