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[gman8181]

If we place a soul from our afterlife into a plant person and that plant reproduces, will it's offspring have souls?

[Origami_Psycho]

If we place a soul from our afterlife into a plant person and that plant reproduces, will it's offspring have souls?

Mayhap we need to ask that.

[GreatWyrmGold]

"I'm afraid the Empire of Tranquility will cream us if we don't."
"It would improve my worshiper's lives."

These Two sound like valid reasons to me, but the full threat of the Empire hasn't been reveiled to us yet. we have heared about it, but we haven't witnessed or experienced it. when that happens perhaps our responses can become more extreme.

1. It's not extreme to voluntarily alter the offspring of a few women.
2. A handful of Justicars nearly defeated our best warriors. Those Justicars were sent to retrieve a few fugitives. Their total forces (admittedly not all Justicars, but still) number in the millions. Oh, and they're done with the last of the old chaos gods, so we and Krait are probably next.
We have about 50 people, plus a few swarms of firejackets, a hundred Stems and change, some Saps, some miscellaneous powerful beasts, and a few allies who aren't much more powerful than us.

if it would improve the worshipers lives, it really depends on the kinds of modifications, if the followers would like to be changed then thats doable. would they be viewed as freaks by the rest of the world?

Or would they be seen as blessed?

Quote from: Talvara on Today at 08:49:00 pm
    but it all sounds pretty evil to me.

Why?

This is about borrowing a womb for your experiments, or experimenting on a child in the first place.

If the woman is aware of the issues and consents, I fail to see why it's Evil.
If it's nonconsensual...yeah, problem.

I even suggested extending our worshipers' lives and making them unnaturally healthy.  Sounds like a fair trade to me.
As far as Donut's reasoning;  In my mind he wants to improve the lives of his followers and protect them as much as possible and would see altering them to do so as just a natural means to an end.  He wouldn't see it as evil because change and evolution are just an aspect of normal life and he is a god of life and chaos so speeding that along is just in his nature and not really any different from making people into golems, werewolves or snakepeople like our allied chaos god has.  He wouldn't necessarily want to do it against their will though because even though he feels it's the right thing to do, he doesn't want to push his views on others unless absolutely necessary.
But seriously as many other people have pointed out, a lot of gods have modified followers.

what if we rolled a one? would that possibility be acceptable to us? I personally don't think so.

Given the low probability of such horrible failure, the high rewards of success (and the ego Donut's chaotic personality meshes with his other successes with Life to form) probably make it reasonable to him. And us.

another thing, changing your followers to your whims (not saying that you're suggesting that) implies that you'd view them as your playthings.

"To your whims"? Oh, sorry to dare want them to live longer and healthier.

Grumamajaskdfalgh created the Orcs, if that idiot can so can we

Who said that?

Maher did.
EDIT: Is it odd that I imagine Maher being Irish?
EDIT 2: GM also said that it is possible to make your own full fledged race.

can you get me a link for edit 2?
the 'race gods' might be special and primordial.

Well, we made Saps, didn't we? It shouldn't be too hard (in principle) to turn humans into soulled Buds, or to give souls in the Afterlife to Stems (making Soul Stems), or something.

Sentience, free will, a soul

Correct on all counts, except that Free Will affects worship proportionally. Little bit of Free Will = 1/4 Mana from that soul. No Free Will of course means zero mana.

And before someone asks, it's not possible to go over 100% Free Will 

Here you go

alright, thanks. I think our interpretations differ. From this (I went back and looked if there was more context) I don't really read that its possible for us to make a full fledged race.
if anything its a maybe.
I really can't imagine us being able to create a soul though. but to be fair I don't recall it being said that we couldn't create a soul either.

I'd imagine that, while it's not easy, it's possible. Races exist; surely they came from somewhere?

[Origami_Psycho]

Also, we've got Chaos on our side to make it even more... fun.

[Talvara]

... We're just trying to get them to breed faster, grow up faster and live longer.  Compare that to the other gods and we're a pretty nice guy.

we can probably do these things without messing with their very being, either through an aura, or a blessing, or something along those lines.

and except for the growing up faster. they seem pretty okay to me.
my aversion to growing up faster. is that because it implies altering children you can't get true consent.

while you may want the genetic modifications to be rather benign, others might want to go for chaotic warbeasts. and to be honest thats what I was picturing.

If we place a soul from our afterlife into a plant person and that plant reproduces, will it's offspring have souls?

interesting question. Doing experiments on the nature of these things makes me somewhat uncomfortable. Perhaps trying to unlock the mysteries of the soul is somehow heretical to me. (note, I am an atheist, and don't believe in the existence of souls IRL)

(ps, Im off to bed.

[Origami_Psycho]

... We're just trying to get them to breed faster, grow up faster and live longer.  Compare that to the other gods and we're a pretty nice guy.

we can probably do these things without messing with their very being, either through an aura, or a blessing, or something along those lines.

and except for the growing up faster. they seem pretty okay to me.
my aversion to growing up faster. is that because it implies altering children you can't get true consent.

while you may want the genetic modifications to be rather benign, others might want to go for chaotic warbeasts. and to be honest thats what I was picturing.

If we place a soul from our afterlife into a plant person and that plant reproduces, will it's offspring have souls?

interesting question. Doing experiments on the nature of these things makes me somewhat uncomfortable. Perhaps trying to unlock the mysteries of the soul is somehow heretical to me. (note, I am an atheist, and don't believe in the existence of souls IRL)

(ps, Im off to bed.

My my my, aren't you just the perfect little roleplayer.

[GreatWyrmGold]

... We're just trying to get them to breed faster, grow up faster and live longer.  Compare that to the other gods and we're a pretty nice guy.

we can probably do these things without messing with their very being, either through an aura, or a blessing, or something along those lines.

Those are more expensive and less permanent.

and except for the growing up faster. they seem pretty okay to me.
my aversion to growing up faster. is that because it implies altering children you can't get true consent.

Okay then.

while you may want the genetic modifications to be rather benign, others might want to go for chaotic warbeasts. and to be honest thats what I was picturing.

Then okay the ones you're okay with and not the ones you're not.

If we place a soul from our afterlife into a plant person and that plant reproduces, will it's offspring have souls?

interesting question. Doing experiments on the nature of these things makes me somewhat uncomfortable. Perhaps trying to unlock the mysteries of the soul is somehow heretical to me. (note, I am an atheist, and don't believe in the existence of souls IRL)

I'm also an agnostic who doesn't believe in souls. I don't see anything wrong with trying to understand something so important in the game world, though.
G'night.

[gman8181]

So just clarifying but are most of us in agreement about either the plant man experiment or modifying some human volunteers?

Assuming the answer is yes, would someone like to post said suggestion(s) in the main thread for everyone who agrees to (+1)

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Maher did.

Maher never said that Grumugga created orcs. He said that she is a goddess worshiped by all orckind.

here are his words:

Maher chuckled. "You don't seem to understand," he replied. "Grumugga is not a Goddess of Orcs. She is the Goddess of Orcs. All of Orckind worships her, and across this entire world their total population is in the millions."

[Origami_Psycho]

Maher did.

Maher never said that Grumugga created orcs. He said that she is a goddess worshiped by all orckind.

here are his words:

Maher chuckled. "You don't seem to understand," he replied. "Grumugga is not a Goddess of Orcs. She is the Goddess of Orcs. All of Orckind worships her, and across this entire world their total population is in the millions."

Well then, I misunderstood.  But then I must wonder why a) both her and the orcs are so alike in personality, and b) How the hell she managed to be the sole/chief goddess of all Orckind
EDIT: I took the 'She is the goddess of Orcs' bit to mean that she was their progenitor, as opposed to one who had climbed to the top though other means.

[GreatWyrmGold]

Maher did.

Maher never said that Grumugga created orcs. He said that she is a goddess worshiped by all orckind.

here are his words:

Maher chuckled. "You don't seem to understand," he replied. "Grumugga is not a Goddess of Orcs. She is the Goddess of Orcs. All of Orckind worships her, and across this entire world their total population is in the millions."

Well then, I misunderstood.  But then I must wonder why a) both her and the orcs are so alike in personality, and b) How the hell she managed to be the sole/chief goddess of all Orckind
EDIT: I took the 'She is the goddess of Orcs' bit to mean that she was their progenitor, as opposed to one who had climbed to the top though other means.

A: Stupidity and the right culture don't leave a lot of room for change...not that we've investigated orkish society much.
B: She killed the other gods of orcs?

[Ukrainian Ranger]

I like how you people try to break the game. Do you hope that GM will not counter any overpowered idea?

After some rereading of the first pages I am sure that it's veeery hard to create a worshiper (Yep I tried to propose that with firejackets, my mistake)

When we turned Tiberius into a golem we lost one worshiper and mana income. So creation with human soul, doesn't give any mana if it's not a human

Mutating humans may lead to the same result...
And I dislike what can happen with bad rolls

A: Stupidity and the right culture don't leave a lot of room for change...not that we've investigated orkish society much.
B: She killed the other gods of orcs?

C - some orcs worship more than one god
D - There are orcs that don't worship her, but they are a small minority

[GreatWyrmGold]

All in favour of trying to make our stems a full blow race, say aye.

Nay.
Make a Stem-like race which is a full race but is visually distinct from our Stems. That way, not only can our villagers tell them apart, other gods won't think we're invading if some emmigrate.

Also anyone in favor of genetically modifying our human followers to breed faster, grow into adulthood faster but also live an overall longer life?

Okay, while we're at it, let's just make them learn faster as well.

Aye if we use volunteers.

+1; Let's just do one or the other.  Both seems redundant to me, although to be honest I'm not sure which I'd prefer which is sort of the problem.  Would sentient plant followers make humans obsolete?

No, they wouldn't. Sentient plants aren't human, by any stretch. We'd have to see the final product to be sure, of course...

I like how you people try to break the game. Do you hope that GM will not counter any overpowered idea?

What makes these overpowered? Races have been made and/or modified, the same can happen again. Stems have been made to reproduce fast before, we can do it again.

After some rereading of the first pages I am sure that it's veeery hard to create a worshiper (Yep I tried to propose that with firejackets, my mistake)
When we turned Tiberius into a golem we lost one worshiper and mana income. So creation with human soul, doesn't give any mana if it's not a human
Mutating humans may lead to the same result...
And I dislike what can happen with bad rolls

Hm...we really need to do our research.

A: Stupidity and the right culture don't leave a lot of room for change...not that we've investigated orkish society much.
B: She killed the other gods of orcs?

C - some orcs worship more than one god
D - There are orcs that don't worship her, but they are a small minority

C,D: Implied to be false by Maher, what with the "The". Of course, how would he know?

[Origami_Psycho]

He would know because he's rather powerful, been around a lot longer than us, and seems to have had these a constant quarrel going with her for quite sometime.  But then again, I bet so has every other god.

[GreatWyrmGold]

He would know because he's rather powerful, been around a lot longer than us, and seems to have had these a constant quarrel going with her for quite sometime.  But then again, I bet so has every other god.

Still...by his own admission, there's millions of orcs.