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[Robosaur]

I want to make my dwarves wear caesium armor and wield caesium swords and run to the lake to fight crocodiles

(or, more effectively, equip my marksdwarves with caesium bolts and shoot at invaders with them)

[GreatWyrmGold]

How do you get alkali metals?

[Robosaur]

Carefully. Likely with some sort of dwarven magic.

[zombie urist]

Mod it in.

[Carp McDwarfEater]

Aren't alkali metLs all explosive upon contact with water..? Yup, now I wish that I could drop sodium boulders into my drowning chamber full of goblins.

[GoombaGeek]

How do you get alkali metals?

Electrolysis of molten salts, typically with a halogen. Upon electrolysis the halogen is released at one electrode (usually chlorine, in which case it just dissipates) and the alkali builds up at the other. Sodium and potassium were also used to purify aluminium from aluminium oxide, but this method was very costly so aluminium's value wouldn't have to be changed from what it is now.

[GreatWyrmGold]

How do you get alkali metals?

Electrolysis of molten salts, typically with a halogen. Upon electrolysis the halogen is released at one electrode (usually chlorine, in which case it just dissipates) and the alkali builds up at the other. Sodium and potassium were also used to purify aluminium from aluminium oxide, but this method was very costly so aluminium's value wouldn't have to be changed from what it is now.

Interesting.
Were these methods available by 1400?

[GoombaGeek]

How do you get alkali metals?

Electrolysis of molten salts, typically with a halogen. Upon electrolysis the halogen is released at one electrode (usually chlorine, in which case it just dissipates) and the alkali builds up at the other. Sodium and potassium were also used to purify aluminium from aluminium oxide, but this method was very costly so aluminium's value wouldn't have to be changed from what it is now.

Interesting.
Were these methods available by 1400?

Electrochemistry was developed in the 1700s as far as I remember, but the technology of making working cells was definitely available since the Middle Ages - a lead-acid battery uses lead electrodes in sulphuric acid. Lead was obviously being produced since the Roman era, and sulphuric acid was easily produced by burning brimstone (sulphur) and collecting the runoff, which was developed during the early days of alchemy. The only novel part was combining the two and hooking up wires to the electrodes to see what happened. When this method of making batteries was discovered, scientists soon discovered that water decomposed into hydrogen and oxygen (or inflammable air and vital air, I think?) and trying this method with other liquids (like... molten table salt, see above) yielded much different results (a flammable metal and a toxic gas!).

The problem with aluminium is that bauxite, its oxide, could not be melted by conventional means, so electrolyzing it was impossible. Instead, potassium was used to reduce bauxite (or another aluminium mineral, I don't remember), leading to impure samples of the metal. Once someone else had the idea to use sodium instead of potassium, they created the first appreciable pure samples of aluminium (if you discount a few mysterious aluminium artifacts found in millenia-old Chinese tombs). Unfortunately, since sodium was very expensive, aluminium's value remained very high until the Hall-Heroult process was devised (which may be beyond our dwarves' tech level, but the individual materials of the process are not so hard to produce).

This process is more complex than simple electrolysis of a molten compound, because bauxite (Al₂O₃) could not be melted. So, research ensued, and it was found that another aluminium mineral, cryolite (which couldn't be smelted either), could be melted at achievable temperatures, and that bauxite was very soluble in molten cryolite. Finally, a workable aluminium-bearing liquid was produced, but the oxygen created by the decomposition of the bauxite reacted with the aluminium too much and the method still didn't work. Luckily, using carbon electrodes (or graphite - not a difficult thing to find) solved the problem, as the free oxygen reacted with the more attractive carbon to produce carbon dioxide, which does not react with aluminium and has the bonus side-effect of creating heat to help keep the cryolite molten. After all this, a process to cheaply produce aluminium was developed and it is now the second most-used metal in the world.

So, here's what you'll need to produce aluminium in both ways:
1. Alkali Method
- Bauxite
- Sodium
- Fuel
- Smelter
This would go like a standard smelting reaction, probably.

2. Hall Method
> A Hall apparatus workshop, constructed with
   - Graphite (electrodes)
   - Copper (wiring)
   - Cryolite (I don't think it's consumed by the process)
   - A magma-safe material to make the tank out of
- Bauxite
- Fuel to melt the cryolite
- A battery cell
   - Lead
   - Sulphuric acid
The above isn't really affordable but it would probably lower the value of aluminium a bit.

If someone ninjaed me on this I'm going to be BLANGRY

[CrzyMonkeyNinja]

Carefully. Likely with some sort of dwarven magic.

You know, I quite like the idea of dwarven magic being able to extract metals that weren't available in the 1400s. That sounds like an interesting use for magic that would have proper benefits and not be too outlandish. It's also quite dwarven.

[GreatWyrmGold]

@GoombaGeek: Not quoting your post.
Did people actually do anything remotely like that in the 1400's? Because, in theory, an Australopithecine could have made stone knives (even with ground edges!) worked wood or something into a circle, punched out the middle, used a stock for an axle, make four wheels and two axles, laid some more sticks down on that, bound it all with sinew or vines or something, and had a cart long before any existed.
But it didn't happen, so having an Australopithecus using such a cart would be an anachronism.

Carefully. Likely with some sort of dwarven magic.

You know, I quite like the idea of dwarven magic being able to extract metals that weren't available in the 1400s. That sounds like an interesting use for magic that would have proper benefits and not be too outlandish. It's also quite dwarven.

I'll concede that alchemy could solve the problem...if the alchemists realized there was a "problem" to "solve," and didn't classify their results as a failure when they exploded.

[assasin]

can't you cut alkali metals with a butter knife. I'm fairly certain they'd make crap weapons. Though I may be wrong. If you want something for the FUN factor, I'm pretty sure the first few halogens would do a lot more damage considering the fact that as a gas, they could actually do some internal damage when they react,

[Slayerhero90]

A cesium necklace for the noble?
He wears it, and the it explodes on contact with his skin.

[laularukyrumo]

@GoombaGeek: Not quoting your post.
Did people actually do anything remotely like that in the 1400's? Because, in theory, an Australopithecine could have made stone knives (even with ground edges!) worked wood or something into a circle, punched out the middle, used a stock for an axle, make four wheels and two axles, laid some more sticks down on that, bound it all with sinew or vines or something, and had a cart long before any existed.
But it didn't happen, so having an Australopithecus using such a cart would be an anachronism.

I think the point he's trying to make is that such things were possible in the 1400s. Did people do such things? No, because of the dark ages. I would bet that if there wasn't a period of time where the people in charge were actively destroying knowledge itself, in all corners of the world, then having alkali metals and aluminum would not be out of the question.

[GreatWyrmGold]

@GoombaGeek: Not quoting your post.
Did people actually do anything remotely like that in the 1400's? Because, in theory, an Australopithecine could have made stone knives (even with ground edges!) worked wood or something into a circle, punched out the middle, used a stock for an axle, make four wheels and two axles, laid some more sticks down on that, bound it all with sinew or vines or something, and had a cart long before any existed.
But it didn't happen, so having an Australopithecus using such a cart would be an anachronism.

I think the point he's trying to make is that such things were possible in the 1400s. Did people do such things? No, because of the dark ages. I would bet that if there wasn't a period of time where the people in charge were actively destroying knowledge itself, in all corners of the world, then having alkali metals and aluminum would not be out of the question.

I doubt it.
I highly doubt that your claims are anything but exaggeration. The Renaissance started in the 14th century, a century or two before the 1400's cutoff; surely anything that would let those 1400'sers get alkali metals would have let them do so after a century or more of Renaissance or else would have been known before that time where "the people in charge were actively destroying knowledge itself, in all corners of the world." And the cutoff isn't the 1400's in a world with no Dark Ages, it's the 1400's in our world. So, no dice there.

[GoombaGeek]

can't you cut alkali metals with a butter knife. I'm fairly certain they'd make crap weapons. Though I may be wrong. If you want something for the FUN factor, I'm pretty sure the first few halogens would do a lot more damage considering the fact that as a gas, they could actually do some internal damage when they react,

Yeah, they would make absolutely awful weapons, especially since most tarnish very quickly and some melt at body temperature. Although lithium is less dense than water, which would be interesting if it didn't react rapidly with said water.

@GoombaGeek: Not quoting your post.
Did people actually do anything remotely like that in the 1400's? Because, in theory, an Australopithecine could have made stone knives (even with ground edges!) worked wood or something into a circle, punched out the middle, used a stock for an axle, make four wheels and two axles, laid some more sticks down on that, bound it all with sinew or vines or something, and had a cart long before any existed.
But it didn't happen, so having an Australopithecus using such a cart would be an anachronism.

I think the point he's trying to make is that such things were possible in the 1400s. Did people do such things? No, because of the dark ages. I would bet that if there wasn't a period of time where the people in charge were actively destroying knowledge itself, in all corners of the world, then having alkali metals and aluminum would not be out of the question.

I doubt it.
I highly doubt that your claims are anything but exaggeration. The Renaissance started in the 14th century, a century or two before the 1400's cutoff; surely anything that would let those 1400'sers get alkali metals would have let them do so after a century or more of Renaissance or else would have been known before that time where "the people in charge were actively destroying knowledge itself, in all corners of the world." And the cutoff isn't the 1400's in a world with no Dark Ages, it's the 1400's in our world. So, no dice there.

Guess what?

There is no dwarven Dark Ages or Renaissance. They do not follow our history and the given year for tech level is a year where they had developed a bevy of powerful acids and equipment in the one area we are most familiar with with the most written history. In China, fewer records survive, and likewise Egypt, and yet we have found all kinds of relics that make no sense for their period. There is evidence for working batteries thousands of years ago in the Arabic world (the MythBusters did an episode on that). The thing is, the world is a huge place and rigidly sticking to a limit of Europe (the Dark Ages' influence was centered on Europe and science was being done as close as the Middle East and as far as China) in "the 1400's" isn't very good. Has human civilization created working cells in antiquity and refined metals not in DF far before "the 1400's"? We have enough evidence to believe so. Could a separate race of humanoids, who have been shown to have more advanced technology and a greater affinity for industry than humans, have figured out electrolysis and basic chemistry by "the same old limit everyone loves so much00's"? Probably so! The biggest limit on aluminium and chemistry and so much else is game balance and use, not realism. I know everyone loves to flout around how much they know about realism in Suggestions and how it's the most important thing, but what we really don't want is sulphuric acid being poured on goblins before the game is ready to handle that advancement. One day, this will all be possible, because alchemy happened and created tons of stuff that just isn't implemented right now, before "the 1400's".

tl;dr Stop thinking that the more you mention "realism" and fail to mention anything but Dark Ages Europe, even if "the game is totally based on Europe!", the more your e-peen will grow.