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[Zanzetkuken The Great]

...with my generation probably being some of the least guilty.

Where you live and out of the people you contacted.  No guarantee that is true outside of that measure.

[Angle]

Yeah, true enough. Still, it definitely seems like those who have power are bothering with less and less in the way of scruples. "Screw it, we'll just take what we want. Who gives a shit about anyone else?"

[wierd]

This is a complex issue (deterioration of work ethic, and deterioration of hope for future, et al), created by a confluence of many things.

this list is hardly comprehensive, just listing a few contributing factors off the top of my head.

1) population has increased, diluting the scarcity of labor, driving down wages.
2) both spouces work, diluting the labor market, diluting the value of money in general, and reducing home buying power to time spent working ratio.
3) Older generations living longer than expected, throwing off plans in economic development upon which further retirement planning is based. (social security, et.)
4) Corporations being obstinate about the myth of purpetual growth, scraping the bottom of the barrel for lost profits, making life hell for everyone. (coupled with regulatory capture, politics for hire, and other social ills)
5) Younger generations ceasing to "give a fuck" about "big picture" items, due to loss/erosion of political power of the electorate (see point 4 above. Money over all!)
6) Younger people starting careers with 3 figures of non-dischargable debt being considered "not qualified" for jobs they paid dearly to be educated for, because of 4) above, being disillusioned quickly when they find that thier best career choice is STILL working at walmart, and living hand to mouth.
7) politicians either in outright denial of these factors, or simply not caring. (the corporations they work for simply dont care at all.) No relief or reform to correct these imbalances are in sight.
the general sense of apathy created by 4) through 7) above make the notion of "populist revolution" (in any form, including non-violent) absurd to even consider as a problem.
9) Corporations and the government see as a blank cheque to do whatever the hell they want, becuse the plebs wont do anything about it anyway.

and so much more.

American workers have poor work ethic, because they get shafted weather they do good work or bad work. There are no true incentives for good work, because the planning methods used by major corporations these days are not quality based, but bulk aggregate sales based. The only people getting perks are sales people selling ice machines to Eskimos, CEOs, and board members.  The actual people that include quality into products are treated as interchangably replacable cogs, and treated like shit as a cost center, and corporate is always looking for ways to reduce that "cost."

The lie that purpetual financial growth is not only possible, but ideal, needs to die in a fire.

[Frumple]

Honestly, from a lot of what I hear american workers, particularly the younger ones, don't really have a bad work ethic -- most of the problem seems to come from them not being allowed to work. Managers getting in the way, preventing good work, jobs not being offered, effort not being recognized and worked with/around, etc., etc. Most of the folks I've been around in my age and the generations coming after kinda' want to work, want to do a good job, etc., etc. -- these are generally very easily motivated people that want to be motivated. But it's like the stars have aligned to do everything in their power to prevent that from happening.

Which is more or less what you're getting at, but...

[SalmonGod]

Yeah, it's actually really hard to de-motivate me.  To the point that I've grown to hate my current workplace and upper level decisions seem designed to make the operation fail in every way possible... and yet I still can't seem to just let go and allow things to fail, even though it wouldn't be my fault and I don't care about the success of the business itself.

But it's been done.  The last place I worked managed to keep me completely and utterly de-motivated to the point that I was on the verge of losing that job almost constantly for 3-4 years.  To the point that I put more effort into doing below minimal work than it would have been to meet requirements, because I hated them just that much.

So yeah... our work ethics are in fact pretty fucked up.  But I wasn't going to paint that much of a picture on the spot, when "We've seen your example and chosen not to follow it" would suffice.

[wierd]

We NEED to let it fail.

Holding up the bullshit, only motivates the fuckwits in charge to cut back harder, because "reducing costs == profit!"

These agencies need to fail, so that there is a power vacuum, and new, competing agencies spring up to fill it.

It's much harder to buy political power when no single agency has the market cap necessary to do so.  Mega conglomerates easily put up that kind of dough, and write it off as a business expense.  Letting thier shit fall all to hell from the inside is the only avenue left of eliminating this problem non-violently.

[SalmonGod]

I am aware.  And I look forward to watching this office fail and close... from a safe distance, once I've found a new job

But really, I do want to watch it all collapse on itself.  The sooner, the better.  But one person throwing his hands up and walking away doesn't matter.  It has to be a lot of people.  And culturally, we're just not there yet.  Too many still sold on the line "Be thankful you have a job", no matter how much they hate it.

[wierd]

sad, but true.

[Bohandas]

This is a complex issue (deterioration of work ethic, and deterioration of hope for future, et al), created by a confluence of many things.

this list is hardly comprehensive, just listing a few contributing factors off the top of my head.

1) population has increased, diluting the scarcity of labor, driving down wages.
2) both spouces work, diluting the labor market, diluting the value of money in general, and reducing home buying power to time spent working ratio.
3) Older generations living longer than expected, throwing off plans in economic development upon which further retirement planning is based. (social security, et.)
4) Corporations being obstinate about the myth of purpetual growth, scraping the bottom of the barrel for lost profits, making life hell for everyone. (coupled with regulatory capture, politics for hire, and other social ills)
5) Younger generations ceasing to "give a fuck" about "big picture" items, due to loss/erosion of political power of the electorate (see point 4 above. Money over all!)
6) Younger people starting careers with 3 figures of non-dischargable debt being considered "not qualified" for jobs they paid dearly to be educated for, because of 4) above, being disillusioned quickly when they find that thier best career choice is STILL working at walmart, and living hand to mouth.
7) politicians either in outright denial of these factors, or simply not caring. (the corporations they work for simply dont care at all.) No relief or reform to correct these imbalances are in sight.
the general sense of apathy created by 4) through 7) above make the notion of "populist revolution" (in any form, including non-violent) absurd to even consider as a problem.
9) Corporations and the government see as a blank cheque to do whatever the hell they want, becuse the plebs wont do anything about it anyway.

Don't forget advances in technology making human labor increasingly pointless and obsolete.

[SalmonGod]

I'd like to join this thread, but it's too much of a hassle reading 29 pages right now.

So, I'm in generation Z, I think. Born right on the beginning of the year 2000, which is neat.

Anyways, what is the current topic of conversation?

Start here.  Near beginning of last page.  That's not too bad, right?

[GreatJustice]

Seeing people born in the 00's posting on forums makes me feel really old. I remember when being born in the late 90's made you the kid of the community, and now that's the average age of posters.

[wierd]

Imagine how I feel, being an early 80s kid!

[i2amroy]

Imagine how I feel, being an early 80s kid!

You old fogey you! (Early 90s here).

[Gentlefish]

Imagine how I feel, being an early 80s kid!

You old fogey you! (Early 90s here).

[Angle]

Imagine how I feel, being an early 80s kid!

You old fogey you! (Early 90s here).