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Author Topic: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Game Over!  (Read 89222 times)

Dariush

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - Two replacements needed!
« Reply #300 on: February 05, 2013, 02:02:48 pm »

NQT:
That's true enough, but we've been in need of at least one replacement for over a week now. I'd much rather active replacements got in, but it's not looking like it's happening any time soon. But rest assured sweet Dariush, I will continue to actively hunt scum as well.
You still haven't explained why you are continuing to vote for the guy in need of replacement, how it's supposed to help him get an active replacement, or what his lynch is going to accomplish, apart from have a 4/5 chance to get a dead townie, which is even less useful to the town than in normal games (because town doesn't get any useful info from a town death, while scum does).
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This means he's least likely to be a mason (who we'd expect to have a narrower range of serious attackers and targets), most likely to be a normal townsperson and medium likely to be scum. That's my read. I don't want to bandwagon on someone that isn't more than 50% scummy in my eyes.
The hell you are talking about, NQT? How is a mason supposed to somehow have a narrower range of targets (a pool of nine people (ignoring buses) isn't much narrower than a pool of 12 people on the game scale) and attackers (because it somehow assumes that whoever attacks a mason knows he's a mason)? Same question goes regarding scum possibility (even though it must be the same even following your insane twisted logic). The whole post looks like a desperate attempts to cover a scummate, in all.

Ford:
The main reasons for this vote is that if Ford wasn't scum, scum would have basically zero reason to lynch Tolyk, since he could easily be lynched at any point due to his lurkatron.
That's bullshit and you know it. Hell, you're proving it right now. Why lynch me then when you could just lynch me now? Two for the price of one!
Er, what? The exactly same logic could be applied in reverse - from the scum point of view, why lynch you now if you could be lynched then, and Tolyk lynched now without any obstructions?

Captain Ford

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - Two replacements needed!
« Reply #301 on: February 05, 2013, 04:16:35 pm »

Tiruin:
Ford
-snip-
Woah, jumpy there.

He didn't explicitly mention that it referred to you.
[/quote]
Umm...yes, he did:

That said, the congruence of the Captain Ford factors is not something I can overlook.

Read his response to me. He is not at all ambiguous about this.

-snip-
So you want to undermine his post by putting biased insults over it?

Also, whats the difference of the lynch anyway? Are you getting information solely by the flips, or getting it from the information gained behind the flips and trying to connect it with who-is-with-who?

Also, why the jumpiness and hostility?

1. Meh. I called it like I saw it.
2a. Activity is the difference. More interaction leaves more material to be analyzed.
2b. Of course I'm analyzing who voted whom and for what reasons.
3. The more I play this game, the more it's making me irritable. I think that "talking" with you has been the primary cause.



Toaster:
Ford:
That's retarded. Either it's valid or it's not. Using it against me only is complete bullshit.

Why don't you try reading my posts?

Captain Ford fits both those criteria.
How does that change anything? You're still making a case that it's valid for me, and not for anyone else. And now you're just trying to obfuscate it.

Me making the tie is a terrible argument considering the confusion over the deadline. Leafsnail made a mistake on one of the votecounts, and then didn't do anything for four days. I had no clue when the deadline was until I looked it up on Thursday, then I realized it was that day, and made a post urging someone to break the tie -- which is when Leafsnail revealed that it had ended a day earlier.

I didn't even realize there was a tie until the next day. And nobody else did either until I pointed it out 24 hours later. At which point, I called for somebody else to break the tie. It's really sad that you're pinning the responsibility on me when you timed your vote change the same way.

And no matter how hard I try, I just can't feel sorry for tying up my own lynch. What fucked up world do you live in where it's the responsibility of the lynchee to make sure he dies?



Dariush:
Ford:
The main reasons for this vote is that if Ford wasn't scum, scum would have basically zero reason to lynch Tolyk, since he could easily be lynched at any point due to his lurkatron.
That's bullshit and you know it. Hell, you're proving it right now. Why lynch me then when you could just lynch me now? Two for the price of one!
Er, what? The exactly same logic could be applied in reverse - from the scum point of view, why lynch you now if you could be lynched then, and Tolyk lynched now without any obstructions?
Let me rephrase that:

Offing Tolyk was the right choice, because there are two nutjobs who are obsessed with killing me, and who are getting away with having crappy or vague reasons for their case. Scum gets two townies, and this way there's no risk of Tolyk suddenly coming back from the grave and not being lynched.

I don't even know why you're voting me anymore. You've agreed with me on the main point we were arguing about and you haven't raised any new points at all. You just keep calling me scummy.
Logged
...Holy shit. Ford, you get the Official Medal of Epic Awesomeness.
Its official! Ford! You need to put it in your sig now! "Official Mafia Welcomer!"

notquitethere

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - Two replacements needed!
« Reply #302 on: February 05, 2013, 05:12:57 pm »

Toaster
This feels scummy to me- it's vague and nonspecific, but it's like you're trying to be the cheerleader for Team Town.  I don't know, but it bugs me.
I'll try to bear that in mind. The vast majority of us are on the same team and so it makes sense (to me at least) to address fellow players as a team, while maintaining suspicious of any given member.
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Are you putting equal weight to all votes?  RVs should matter little, pressure votes some, and lynch votes a lot.

How scummy is Ford?  Who is the highest percentage scummy person to you right now?
What I've actually done is make a chart from reading the votes and FOS's from the Lurker tracker, marking up all the RVs. Then, when I look at each individual voter's pattern, I can look into the thread to see whether they were just pressure votes and so on.

Just from the numbers alone, given some assumptions about what each kind of team's voting would look like (and I might be wrong), I'd say Ford is low scummy. He's received eleven votes from five people. Assuming scum and masons will tend not to vote for their team mates, we can expect town members to receive votes from the widest range of people. His number of people that have voted against him are above the game average of 3.75. From this I'd say he's least likely to be mason and (given that scummy looking players may receive lots of votes) he's as likely town as scum, and as there's much more town than scum, he'd most likely town. That's just from the vote numbers though, and we'd obviously have to look at what people say before coming to a firmer judgement.

Unvote

I'm not sure who's the scummiest. I've got a few candidates:

obolisk0430. Only one person has ever voted against him (a sure sign of low activity) and he's only ever voted against one person. Best case, he's convinced Deathsword is scum and is focusing on him for the time being, and the low votes against hint that he could well be a mason, though his lack of cohesion in voting alongside other player's targets speaks slightly against that. Worst case, he's keeping a low profile with active-lurking and lack lustre scum-hunting.

Deathsword, and his (seemingly wilful) misunderstanding of my earlier posts and, more tellingly, his bandwagonning of both me in the last 'day', and now Captain Ford. Best case he's a dangerously mistaken townie, worst case he's a bandwagon-jumping mafioso.

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If someone is likely town, why lynch them ever?
Well that's my thought, but on numbers alone, any given person is more likely than not a friend and Ford (who's on track to be killed) is not much more scummy than many other players. The best that can be hoped for his death (bar the unlikely event of him flipping scum) is a possible read on the alignment of those targeting him.

Dariush
You still haven't explained why you are continuing to vote for the guy in need of replacement, how it's supposed to help him get an active replacement, or what his lynch is going to accomplish, apart from have a 4/5 chance to get a dead townie, which is even less useful to the town than in normal games (because town doesn't get any useful info from a town death, while scum does).
Now it's overwhelmingly clear that no one else agrees that getting rid of non-participating players is in our best interests, I've focused back on the active players.

Quote
The hell you are talking about, NQT? How is a mason supposed to somehow have a narrower range of targets (a pool of nine people (ignoring buses) isn't much narrower than a pool of 12 people on the game scale) and attackers (because it somehow assumes that whoever attacks a mason knows he's a mason)?
I'm saying exactly that: on average masons will have a narrower range of serious targets because they won't seriously target their mates. Likewise, they'll have less serious attackers because a good chunk of their potential attackers will be masons. It's not going to be a huge margin, but overall I'd think the effects noticeable.

Quote
Same question goes regarding scum possibility (even though it must be the same even following your insane twisted logic). The whole post looks like a desperate attempts to cover a scummate, in all.
You're quite right, except that for most of the game so far there's been half as many scum as masons. I'm sorry that you think it looks like I'm protecting my scumbuddy Ford but town members have the greatest incentive not to lynch players that they think are likely to be town as well.
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zombie urist

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - Two replacements needed!
« Reply #303 on: February 05, 2013, 06:09:46 pm »

From this I'd say he's least likely to be mason and (given that scummy looking players may receive lots of votes) he's as likely town as scum, and as there's much more town than scum, he'd most likely town.
This is stupid, because since there are more town, everyone is more likely town. I don't see how the distribution of votes matter.

Quote
If someone is likely town, why lynch them ever?
Well that's my thought, but on numbers alone, any given person is more likely than not a friend and Ford (who's on track to be killed) is not much more scummy than many other players. The best that can be hoped for his death (bar the unlikely event of him flipping scum) is a possible read on the alignment of those targeting him.
How "much" more scummy do you need to be to be worth lynching? Also, please provide a non-statistical reason why Ford is not scummy. Also, please stop using numbers in mafia. It doesn't work well.

1. Thats such a trivial thing to get upset about.
Not upset. I was irritated at how my impression of obolisk changed right there.
On another note, it's a matter of personal ethics. Back here, the fact that it came out of nowhere sounded like I affected him by just stating his name. It also came from seeing obolisk's posts and seeing how he viewed mine.
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2. How did you imply "reluctance = siding with lurkers" from his posts?
3. Everyone knows about kills because they're announced in thread.
@2:
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[...]I'm beginning to think your reluctance on this point is because you're on the same team as at least one of the lurkers.
Like that.
And on the kills, I meant the targeting. What I got from what NQT said was the fact that he mentioned 'kills' in his wording and not anything else here.
1. Meh. To be frank, it seems like the other way around.
2. Ok.
3. That makes no sense. NQT said "concrete info comes from kills", which is true. I don't know how you ever thought he implied targeting in any way.
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The worst part of all of this is that Shakerag won.

Leafsnail

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - One replacement needed
« Reply #304 on: February 06, 2013, 06:53:12 am »

Hapah has replaced Phantom of the Library.  Still looking for a replacement for Edosurist.

Votecount (6 votes to lynch):
Dariush:
Tiruin:
Phantom of The Library Hapah:
Captain Ford: Toaster, Dariush, Deathsword, Tiruin (4) <-- L-2
Edosurist:
Deathsword: obolisk0430, notquitethere (2)
notquitethere: zombie urist (1)
zombie urist: Captain Ford (1)
Toaster:
obolisk0430:

Not voting: Edosurist, Phantom of the Library Hapah (2)

Deadline: 12:52:14 am GMT on the 9th of February (about 2 and a half days away).
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TheZoomZoll

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - One replacement needed
« Reply #305 on: February 06, 2013, 11:43:49 am »

Could I perhaps apply for this replacement?

Hapah

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - One replacement needed
« Reply #306 on: February 06, 2013, 01:08:41 pm »

Hello, strangers! I'll get in a read and a post this evening.
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I can't be expected to remember the names of everyone I've tried to stab.

Bored? Go read the EVE Chronicles.

Leafsnail

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - One replacement needed
« Reply #307 on: February 06, 2013, 02:34:56 pm »

Could I perhaps apply for this replacement?
Sure.  I'll send you the role PM.
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Leafsnail

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #308 on: February 06, 2013, 02:37:04 pm »

TheZoomZoll has replaced Edosurist.
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TheZoomZoll

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Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #309 on: February 06, 2013, 03:26:11 pm »

Righty righty.
Lets get on with some random personality quiz-interrogations.


Captain Ford-There have been many discussions that I won't repost.But yes.I think you should meet the noose.
                                           Heres a good question for you.Do you like vanilla or chocolate icecream more?

Toaster-Hmm.Let's see.
                   Shoot one,stab one,burn one:NQT,Deathsword,Dariush

Tiruin-Would you rather be a stonecrafter or a peasant?

zombie urist

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #310 on: February 06, 2013, 03:39:52 pm »

You do realize that you've put Ford at L-1 right?

Also, those questions suck.
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The worst part of all of this is that Shakerag won.

TheZoomZoll

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #311 on: February 06, 2013, 03:42:56 pm »

You do realize that you've put Ford at L-1 right?

Also, those questions suck.
Don't worry!
I went to a psychology lesson once.I think.
Maybe.

Captain Ford

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #312 on: February 06, 2013, 04:16:45 pm »

Captain Ford-There have been many discussions that I won't repost.But yes.I think you should meet the noose.
                                           Heres a good question for you.Do you like vanilla or chocolate icecream more?
Vanilla.

Which flavor do you prefer?
Logged
...Holy shit. Ford, you get the Official Medal of Epic Awesomeness.
Its official! Ford! You need to put it in your sig now! "Official Mafia Welcomer!"

zombie urist

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #313 on: February 06, 2013, 04:33:54 pm »

pfp. Zoom, pls provide reasons for why tou think ford deswrves lynch.
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The worst part of all of this is that Shakerag won.

Tiruin

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day Two (10/13) - An accident
« Reply #314 on: February 06, 2013, 05:11:24 pm »

Righty righty.
Lets get on with some random personality quiz-interrogations.


Captain Ford-There have been many discussions that I won't repost.But yes.I think you should meet the noose.
                                           Heres a good question for you.Do you like vanilla or chocolate icecream more?

Toaster-Hmm.Let's see.
                   Shoot one,stab one,burn one:NQT,Deathsword,Dariush

Tiruin-Would you rather be a stonecrafter or a peasant?
In addition to that, could you also provide a behind the scenes ideology on why the specific choices?

I'd rather be a peasant, because I'd be tilling the soil and able to do multiple and various jobs. Unspecified, of course, but at least I'd be able to be a generalist - able to expand my potential and still able to keep an open ended view of my labors and other stuff related to being the stereotypical peasant I am.

How does this help you with anything, and why would you FoS me for such?

PFP
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