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[Neonivek]

We also have to take into account how many of those shootings are due to crime groups and not random crazy people.

[Owlbread]

But my understanding here is that the killer was using perfectly legal guns, specifically two handguns.

[PanH]

We also have to take into account how many of those shootings are due to crime groups and not random crazy people.

I know you have to consider them apart, but both are to be taken in account.

[Hiiri]

Look at the whole map. The top one is poverty. Bottom one is firearm assaults. POVERTY, not gun laws matches with firearm crime.

That's just misdirection. "Look, I'm snapping my right hand fingers, therefore my left hand doesn't exist."

So it's poor people shooting other people... so what? They're still shooting them, aren't they? Taking care of gun laws & poverty are not exclusive.

Edit: You keep talking about black market guns, why do you think it's as easy to find a black market as it is a gun shop? Surely it can't be true in the US?

[olemars]

Some points of order since I've seen it mentioned upstream:

1. Norway has a higher gun ownership rate than the US.
You're about as likely to get shot in a hunting accident as in violent crime (in Norway that is).
3. Anders Breivik bought his weapons legally. There are two ways to get a weapons permit: Be a licensed hunter or an active member of a sports shooting club. ABB was both.
4. ABB was not a random crazy, he was a terrorist with a plan.

I don't care that much about gun restrictions, but what's so alien to me is the idea that I should have a gun for self defense. That kind of thinking is to live a life in fear and paranoia.

Norway used to have the same system as Switzerland, in that all reserve soldiers transferred to the National Guard had to keep a G3 heavy assault rifle and 100 rounds of ammo in their bedroom. This was accepted as a necessary evil during the cold war due to the terrible commies across the border. It's no longer in practice since the necessity disappeared and there were too many nasty incidents. Also, it's NEVER been conceived as a self defense measure, it was for defense against military invasion.

[Scelly9]

*Sigh*

Humanity is wonderful at depressing me.

[Sir Finkus]

The idea of using a firearm for self defense is that it doesn't matter how physically fit you are.  If someone were to break into my 86 year old grandmother's house, she'd be helpless.  Give her a knife or a baseball bat and she's a little less vulnerable.  If you give her a .45, suddenly she has a fighting chance.

I have a few guns.  Self protection wasn't my main reason for purchasing them, but it was a factor.  I don't think I'm paranoid, I just look at it like having a fire extinguisher.

[Darvi]

Thing is, once a burglar is armed too, your grandma is figuratively screwed again, since physical fitness, in this case reaction time (as in who shoots first) is very much a factor again.

[Hiiri]

Not to mention the burglars will probably shoot her at first sight, if they have a good reason to assume she's armed. So instead of just getting robbed, she'd probably get herself killed. :/

[majikero]

Is it strange that I want my  future children to study in a small school with surrounded by walls with barbed wires and an armed security guard?

That's the kind of school I went to when I was in gradeschool.

[Loud Whispers]

Is it strange that I want my  future children to study in a small school with surrounded by walls with barbed wires and an armed security guard?

Because that wouldn't have any effect on your children's development at all...

[Euld]

No no, that'd actually be a very good thing!  In America, we spend more money per prisoner in prisons than we do per student.  So re-zoning all our schools into maximum security prisons will significantly improve education.

[majikero]

Not really no. The security guard was a cool guy and all the little kids want to touch his gun.

[Loud Whispers]

Not really no. The security guard was a cool guy and all the little kids want to touch his gun.

I'd OOC this but it just seems too easy

But yeah the point still stands.

[Darvi]

Not really no. The security guard was a cool guy and all the little kids want to touch his gun.

I'd OOC this but it just seems too easy

Whoa.