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Author Topic: Copper only military still viable?  (Read 6533 times)

Dwarfotaur

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Copper only military still viable?
« on: December 07, 2012, 05:53:04 am »

Turns out my embark only has Gold and Tetrahedrite which seems to be Copper/Silver. I currently have one dwarf in my military (I was just searching for ore to start a proper military before discovering I have nothing other than gold/copper) who is wearing a full suit of copper except for his Artifact Gold Left Gauntlet Mostondun, The Shame Pointer (name from memory, it's something cool like that).

I have embarked near a Necromancer tower and near goblins so I except some heavy resistance in the forts future. I may even provoke the elves as I have no need for their fancy wood based products as I've embarked in a heavily forested area.

My first and only strange mood so far has netted with a Legendary Armourer so I can get some high quality armour production started especially as I embarked with on a perfectly flat 4x4 with a volcano. I'm just worried that my copper dwarves will be punctured and cut apart all too easily.

I've hit the magma sea and below, there appears to be 0 candy (a first for me...) Not sure if I just can't find it or if it really doesn't exist.  I've asked the dwarf caravan to bring plenty of metal bars and metal goods so I can smelt them down but sadly they don't bring much at all.
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SRD

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2012, 06:04:07 am »

Just get dfhack to change a vein to hematite or something.
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EDIT: HOW DO I STOP THE BLEEDING!
SUPEREDIT: Nevermind. Bled to death ._.

Connermc

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2012, 06:06:41 am »

Or you could just make Gold War Hammers

Also copper armor is about as good as iron armor.
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Owlbread

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2012, 06:23:02 am »

If you have obsidian you could make obsidian short swords and use copper armour. That would do you.
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XXSockXX

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2012, 06:28:44 am »

Just get dfhack to change a vein to hematite or something.
Or less cheaty: use dfhack's fixmerchant to get trade agreements with the humans and import metal and ore from them.

Or you could just make Gold War Hammers

Also copper armor is about as good as iron armor.
You can't make weapons from gold, silver war hammers on the other hand are quite good.

I don't think copper is as good as iron, bronze would be better: http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Armor#Material


What I'd do is, import stuff to melt (anvils are best in this case), bars and ores. Also order not only iron bars and ores but also tin, bismuth, pig iron and steel. That way you should get a mix of iron/steel/bronze/bismuth bronze weapons/armor which should be enough to get the military started.
As you have just one military dwarf I guess you're early in the game, the caravans will bring much more stuff over time, when you get richer.
Also don't underestimate goblinite, even in worlds where the goblins only have metal helms and weapons I ususally get an enormous amount of bars out of melting all the stuff.
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Dwarfotaur

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2012, 06:32:18 am »

Just get dfhack to change a vein to hematite or something.

I have to restrict from using DFHack otherwise I just place magma exactly where I need it for forges, then I change the walls next to it to candy... My thought process is a long the lines of, "Let's change it to hematite... Why not candy?"

If you have obsidian you could make obsidian short swords and use copper armour. That would do you.

How effective are obsidian shortswords? On a scale of wood to candy, where do they rank?

I forgot about Goblinite, what metal is that... Again on a scale of wood/copper to candy? I'll have to go with what XXSockXX said if I want to keep it legit. And yea, the fort is still young, only about a year old.
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Connermc

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2012, 06:36:55 am »

You can't make weapons from gold

Gold weapons are possible with a bit raw editing:
Find \Dwarf Fortress 0.34.11\data\save\regionXX\raw\objects
and open the text document "inorganic_metal"
Under "[INORGANIC:GOLD]" add in "[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED][ITEMS_AMMO][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR]" in a new line

Now you can make Gold Weapons in your current save.

Edit:

How effective are obsidian shortswords? On a scale of wood to candy, where do they rank?

I forgot about Goblinite, what metal is that... Again on a scale of wood/copper to candy? I'll have to go with what XXSockXX said if I want to keep it legit. And yea, the fort is still young, only about a year old.

Obsidian shortswords are fairly useless being better than wood but much weaker than any sword made from metal.

For Goblinite, Refer to: http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Goblinite
« Last Edit: December 07, 2012, 06:41:57 am by Connermc »
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XXSockXX

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2012, 06:41:25 am »

Just get dfhack to change a vein to hematite or something.

I have to restrict from using DFHack otherwise I just place magma exactly where I need it for forges, then I change the walls next to it to candy... My thought process is a long the lines of, "Let's change it to hematite... Why not candy?"

If you have obsidian you could make obsidian short swords and use copper armour. That would do you.

How effective are obsidian shortswords? On a scale of wood to candy, where do they rank?

I forgot about Goblinite, what metal is that... Again on a scale of wood/copper to candy? I'll have to go with what XXSockXX said if I want to keep it legit. And yea, the fort is still young, only about a year old.

I don't find fixmerchant too cheaty, since there were trade agreements in earliers versions, otherwise I agree with limiting dfhack use.

Obsidian swords are ok, but not better than copper: http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Weapons#Material,
so I'd only use them if you have easy access to obsidian.

Goblinite is not a metal per se :), it's just a term for the metals the goblins bring. If you melt all their iron/copper/bronze/silver weapons and armor, you get a decent metal supply out of them. http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Goblinite
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goblolo

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2012, 06:43:11 am »

Gold weapons are possible with a bit raw editing:
Find \Dwarf Fortress 0.34.11\data\save\regionXX\raw\objects
and open the text document "inorganic_metal"
Under "[INORGANIC:GOLD]" add in "[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED][ITEMS_AMMO][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR]" in a new line

Now you can make Gold Weapons in your current save.

gold is much weaker than copper (only effectiveness of the maces can be argued).
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Dwarfotaur

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2012, 06:46:40 am »

I'm tempted to edit the raws to make gold armour/weapons and just duke it out in Gold. It may not be effective but damn it'd be classy.

And oh... I always thought Goblinite was some cheap metal goblins used. Wasn't aware it was just a blanket term their items. I've now just realised that goblins are the 'ore' to be 'mined' :P
« Last Edit: December 07, 2012, 06:48:16 am by Dwarfotaur »
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Connermc

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2012, 06:47:42 am »

Gold weapons are possible with a bit raw editing:
Find \Dwarf Fortress 0.34.11\data\save\regionXX\raw\objects
and open the text document "inorganic_metal"
Under "[INORGANIC:GOLD]" add in "[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED][ITEMS_AMMO][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR]" in a new line

Now you can make Gold Weapons in your current save.

gold is much weaker than copper (only effectiveness of the maces can be argued).

Although gold has a density twice that of silver, which makes its warhammers very effective against everything.
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Dwarfotaur

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2012, 06:49:37 am »

Warhammers for everybody! They'll come in useful should a necromancer attack. What about gold armour? I imagine it won't be very strong...
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Connermc

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2012, 06:56:29 am »

Warhammers for everybody! They'll come in useful should a necromancer attack. What about gold armour? I imagine it won't be very strong...

Gold is worse than copper for armor.
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usgreth

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2012, 07:11:42 am »

Always getting gold/tetrahedrite embarks myself. Silver war hammers, and some basic copper crap to tide you over until you can import enough iron/steel. Melt down all the goblinite you can muster and nibble away at candy as much as you dare. Goes without saying to buy/melt nearly anything iron the human/dorf caravans bring, anvils are pretty cheap to buy, trap components tend to be really expensive. When you have enough of the other things, then you can waste copper on bolts or trap components. Coppers not great for them but by this time its more about quantity and wearing enemies down.
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Owlbread

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Re: Copper only military still viable?
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2012, 07:28:28 am »

Have obsidian short swords been nerfed? In my day they were as strong as steel swords.
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