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[Darkmere]

I tend to agree with the "if I paid for it once, I still own the rights to use a copy" argument. Though on occasion I've bought re-releases of old games to run them on new OS's for convenience.

If it's a AAA game that I know I'll enjoy (and there's... well... maybe 2 of those. Maybe.) I just buy it.
If it's an indie game, reviews will be available on this very forum, and it will be on steam sale. Then I'll buy it.

I'd consider games that come with corporate-sponsored spyware "unavailable" and wouldn't have an issue pirating them until such time as a clean version came out. But that kind of crap is what drove me from AAA titles in the first place, so I guess it's not an issue for me.

[Zangi]

1. I own the the disc for X console game.  I want to play it on the CPU.  Justified enough for me.
2. Not available for legal purchase.  Justified enough for me.
3. Restrictive/Crippling DRM.  Justified enough for me.

My ethics are flexible.

Edit: Added #3

[scriver]

My one true justified reason: If I already bought the game, but broke the disc, don't want to deal with the intrusive DRM, or such.

Other less justified but acceptable reasons are:
1. To try it out.
2. Unavailability, such as too old games or such.
3. If you're a littlest cancer patient wasting away in a hospital.

The rest of the reasons people make up for pirating just sound like hollow excuses for their own greed to me.

I don't consider pirating a game fair just because I don't have the hardware to play it (such as with a console emulator).

Why?  I don't own a gameboy and never will, therefore I am never going to buy a gameboy game.  If I was to go and pirate a load of gameboy games for the purpose of emulation nobody loses out, because there was no chance of me buying a game I'm unable to play in the first place.  On the other hand, I have a PS2 and still buy games for it from time to time.  If I pirate a PS2 game the developer has lost a sale, this doesn't apply for gameboys.

On the contrary, they've just lost the sale of  game and of a console.

[Girlinhat]

The "I don't own the platform" argument doesn't hold up.  If we're gonna make a list of comparisons...  That's like getting your friend to drive you everywhere, putting your feet on the dashboard and never paying for gas because you never intended to buy a car anyways.  That's like walking into a bookstore and just taking books out because you never intended to buy a backpack or desk.  That's like going into a supermarket and eating frozen food in the isle because you never intended to buy a microwave.

You can argue "I'd never pay anyways, so it's no money lost" but that's the point really.  Economics work by punishing people who don't pay.  You don't pay for a TV, you don't get TV shows.  That's the way economics work!  To try and claim "I refuse to pay, therefore I get it for free" is Insane Troll Logic.

If you've already paid but your media format is invalid, then you've already payed.  If you really cannot find the item to buy, then you are unable to pay.  If you just refuse to pay, then you're just refusing to pay.

[Telgin]

Why?  I don't own a gameboy and never will, therefore I am never going to buy a gameboy game.  If I was to go and pirate a load of gameboy games for the purpose of emulation nobody loses out, because there was no chance of me buying a game I'm unable to play in the first place.  On the other hand, I have a PS2 and still buy games for it from time to time.  If I pirate a PS2 game the developer has lost a sale, this doesn't apply for gameboys.

You could argue that Nintendo lost a sale of a Gameboy, but the way copyright law works I think older console emulators technically get around that.  Nonetheless, you're still acquiring a copy of their work for nothing.  They're not really losing out on a sale (unless they started selling ROM images, which would be interesting), but the proper way to go about using the emulator would be to pay the company for an electronic copy of the game that ran in the emulator (fat chance, I know) or to buy the cartridge and use whatever hardware is used to get the ROM image off of it to play in the emulator (also fat chance, I know).

Gameboys are a bit different from a more modern example because you generally can't find the games for sale anywhere even if you tried to find them, or the consoles themselves for that matter.  My morals are a bit flexible there, especially since any revenue generated isn't going to go to the original author of the game now anyway.  Any copies would be second hand.

For a slightly more modern example, consider the Playstation.  Emulators existed that could play the games if they were put in a PC's CD drive.  Would you still pirate the game if you had a PC emulator, or would you go buy the game and just skip the Playstation part of the equation?  I'm not sure, but suspect that the modern game consoles can be used similarly with emulators, although they probably require illegal firmware copying unless you own the console (the Playstation did).

Why?  I wouldn't buy an album without hearing a few tracks first, a book without scanning through a couple of pages, a car without taking it on a test drive or a sofa without sitting on it.  I'd actually say it's kinda foolish to do otherwise.

That's what the demo is for.  Most games have demos.  If they don't have a demo you can actually download, such as for console games, you can still often get plenty enough information to decide if it's worth risking the money on it.  PCs have the added level of complexity in that the game flat may not work, but again, that's what the demo is for.  If the company producing the game doesn't release the demo, that's a risk they're taking by not letting the fans try it out, although it bites the fans too.

The example about music is simlar.  You can usually find samples of music tracks on iTunes or in the store.

To be honest though, this one I wouldn't really care much about if people are honest about buying the game if it works and they like it.

1. I own the the disc for X console game.  I want to play it on the CPU.  Justified enough for me.

I'm flexible about this too, but so far haven't been bothered enough to actually pirate a game based on this.

[lordcooper]

On the contrary, they've just lost the sale of  game and of a console.

Well in this case they probably aren't the same people so that doesn't really work.  Anyway, for an actual example, the last game I pirated without going on to purchase (about six months ago) was The World Ends with You.  This is literally the only DS exclusive I have any interest in playing.  There's no way I'm forking out on a console for the sake of a single game so my options were to either never play it or pirate it.  Both choices have exactly the same effect on the developer and publisher.

The "I don't own the platform" argument doesn't hold up.  If we're gonna make a list of comparisons...  That's like getting your friend to drive you everywhere, putting your feet on the dashboard and never paying for gas because you never intended to buy a car anyways.  That's like walking into a bookstore and just taking books out because you never intended to buy a backpack or desk.  That's like going into a supermarket and eating frozen food in the isle because you never intended to buy a microwave.

Not really.  In each of those examples someone would actually lose out on gas, books or food.  It's more akin to lending a book from a library (multiple people enjoying entertainment that was only paid for once) than stealing one.

@Telgin: If it had been possible to buy a ROM image of that game, I definitely would have.

I had a quick count and I've purchased 44 out of 47 games I've pirated in the last year (two were terrible and one just wouldn't run on my PC).  None of these games had demos and I wouldn't have bought any of them without the ability to pirate them first.

[Neyvn]

Last checked the general rule on this is thus.

As long as you own a physical and true copy of the game in question. You are fully allowed to emulate it. Its only when you dont where it becomes piracy...

[Dutchling]

I pirate games if it it's too expansive for me to buy it without feeling like I'm wasting money (like Skyrim at release),  or if it's not on Steam. This means I buy most of my games though.
I actually did buy Skyrim later on in a Steamsale.

[Flare]

Last checked the general rule on this is thus.

As long as you own a physical and true copy of the game in question. You are fully allowed to emulate it. Its only when you dont where it becomes piracy...

Only in Canada where games, movies, and music are categorized as a service where emulation when you'v bought a copy is permitted. Pretty sure it's counted as a good in the US and Britain.

[itisnotlogical]

I think it's acceptable to pirate games that are completely unavailable, or would be cost-prohibitive to play in their original form. For example, when was the last time anybody has seen a copy of A Mind Forever Voyaging, even in a thrift store? Who owns an authentic Apple II to play it on? What about Eojjeonji Joheun Il-i Saenggil Geot Gateun Jeonyeok, an obscure beat-em-up game released only in South Korea in 1997? Ninja Baseball Batman? Mother 3?

Many of the companies who previously owned the rights to these games don't exist anymore, so they wouldn't turn a profit. If anybody owns these games at all, they've done nothing but sit on the rights so that nobody else can have them. There is no reason why Mother 3 and Fire Emblem Gaiden shouldn't be available on the Wii Store, and Nintendo only has themselves to blame that those games are pirated.

[scriver]

On the contrary, they've just lost the sale of  game and of a console.

Well in this case they probably aren't the same people so that doesn't really work.  Anyway, for an actual example, the last game I pirated without going on to purchase (about six months ago) was The World Ends with You.  This is literally the only DS exclusive I have any interest in playing.  There's no way I'm forking out on a console for the sake of a single game so my options were to either never play it or pirate it.  Both choices have exactly the same effect on the developer and publisher.

The "I don't own the platform" argument doesn't hold up.  If we're gonna make a list of comparisons...  That's like getting your friend to drive you everywhere, putting your feet on the dashboard and never paying for gas because you never intended to buy a car anyways.  That's like walking into a bookstore and just taking books out because you never intended to buy a backpack or desk.  That's like going into a supermarket and eating frozen food in the isle because you never intended to buy a microwave.

Not really.  In each of those examples someone would actually lose out on gas, books or food.  It's more akin to lending a book from a library (multiple people enjoying entertainment that was only paid for once) than stealing one.

Rather, it's like planking into a concert "because you wouldn't have paid for a ticket anyway". Regardless, you snipped out the wctual point of Girl's post; you're logic basically amounts to "I don't want to pay, so I get it for free". And that really doesn't hold up.

Why?  I wouldn't buy an album without hearing a few tracks first, a book without scanning through a couple of pages, a car without taking it on a test drive or a sofa without sitting on it.  I'd actually say it's kinda foolish to do otherwise.

That's what the demo is for.  Most games have demos.  If they don't have a demo you can actually download, such as for console games, you can still often get plenty enough information to decide if it's worth risking the money on it.  PCs have the added level of complexity in that the game flat may not work, but again, that's what the demo is for.  If the company producing the game doesn't release the demo, that's a risk they're taking by not letting the fans try it out, although it bites the fans too.

The example about music is simlar.  You can usually find samples of music tracks on iTunes or in the store.

To be honest though, this one I wouldn't really care much about if people are honest about buying the game if it works and they like it.

Another thing about demos is that they're no always actually representative about what the game they're supposed to demonstrate is like. Take the Total War games, for example, they have a pretty bad history with scripting their demo battle AI to make it seems smarter than the AI will actually be when you play the game. I don't have very strong objections against pirating for demo purposes in general, but I would have full understanding for people who want to see what TW battles are truly like pirating those games.

[FritzPL]

Yeah, what's wrong in that? If you bought the game, and it got damaged/mistakenly thrown away, pirating it is like reclamation. As long as you weren't the one who damaged it, in which case, you're half a pirate.

[Muz]

IMO, abandonware is fine. There's the gray area about what IS abandonware and what's just an old game, but everyone is smart enough to figure that out on their own.

Technically, it's probably illegal even if you own it and want to redownload it. I think it's the norm to be allowed to pirate something you've bought legally before, but I don't read the legal stuff that closely.

Ethically, it's up to you to decide, and Internet People will say what they want to believe. I think a bunch of old games are up on portals like Desura or Steam and I hear you can download them if you've got the CD key, but never actually tried it.

[lordcooper]

Regardless, you snipped out the wctual point of Girl's post; you're logic basically amounts to "I don't want to pay, so I get it for free". And that really doesn't hold up.

But I do want to pay.  If there had been a PC/PS3 version available (or if they even simply sold the ROMs) I'd have happily forked out for it.  If there was an easy way to donate to them I'd even do it that way.  There isn't.  So I could either have pirated it or never played it.

[foil]

Pirate everything, say nothing.