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[Snake_Eyes]

So I have gotten the  fundamentals of Adventurer down, I can safely get an Elite Legendary Superhuman through crab-wrestling, and outfitted with a full suit of armor and weapon. Though I am not sure what to do between the starting grind, and killing Mummies or other difficult creatures.

0.34.11

I have not played in Fortress Mode yet so I may be missing some things, but I am currently playing:

First I go crab hunting, lay down and wrestle the crab until I reach superhuman levels of power. 15,000 Fighting, 3,000 Shield, 3,000 Dodging, 1,700 Armor Use, 600 Swordsman. I sneak everywhere increasing Ambush to ~1,000.

Second I head to a fort until I find a training weapon, and pieces of armor. Increase Swordsman and Armor Use slowly.

Third I head to the labyrinth and get a full suit of armor, and weapon. Attain Legendary in all combat skills, Superhuman in attributes.

Forth, in search of adventure I get kicked in the head by a Llama, or shot through the knee. What am I meant to  do instead?

Starting

Superior
Recuperation
Disease Resistance

Above Average >> Superhuman
Strength
Agility
Toughness
Endurance
Willpower
Spacial Sense
Kinesthetic Sense

Above Average >> High
Focus

Above Average
Social Awareness

Starting skills are as following, though I am tempted to reduce Armor Use to rank 16 and increase Observer.

Novice
Swordsman
Reader
Dodger
Observer

Adequate
Swimmer

Master
Armor User

So do I need to play Fortress Mode to get magic items and such or should I be able to play a world without creating a fortress made of candy first?

I am not scumming in any way, though am happy to grind.

Is there any thing I should be doing differently? Should I be hunting vampires, or looking for underground passages?

Thanks in advance,
Snake_Eyes

[Trif]

Um, wow. That sounds incredibly boring.

Why don't you just get some armor and companions and go hunt night creatures?

[TheBlueSteel]

First point: You need more Ambusher. Your adventurer is only mortal, no matter how buffed he gets. One good hoof or arrow to the brain and he is done, period. The best way you can avoid this scenario for as long as possible is ensuring that you never get attacked, instead cutting the enemy into little chunks without them noticing. I always train to Legendary +5 Ambusher before trying to kill anything even modestly dangerous. At that point you can stand right next to it and slash away and almost everything short of a Megabeast won't notice.

Second, your start build doesn't really make any sense. Recuperation is useless, because as soon as you Fast Travel anything that will heal will heal. Presto chango, just like that. Disease resistance is also extremely pointless, as the only thing it does right now is prevent you getting vampirism or lycanthropy, and that only happens at insane levels of Disease Resistance, and the attribute is effectively impossible to train. Those two attributes should be your dump stats, not at Superior. For the rest, you don't really need Endurance, and you should always max Strength, Agility, and Willpower. Strength and Agility are vital to any adventurer, as having them start high means you can cap at many times the abilities of a standard creature. Willpower is hard to train, but is crucial if you want to live long. The moment you chip a bone you have a very high chance of giving in to the pain, and the moment you do that you are dead, for all intents and purposes. Thus, you really need Willpower to survive for long without savescumming often.

As for skills, you really only need Novice Swimmer, as swimming is easy to train in any murky pool. Just don't train in temperate areas close to night. Armor User is a really nifty skill to have, but again you can train it very easily by letting an undead groundhog try to hurt you with any decent armor on. You don't need to start it that high, put the points into Observor and your chosen weapon profession instead. Observer only trains when you get ambushed, and directly increases how far away you can see said ambushes and how often they happen. Thusly it is quite difficult to train without dying, as ambushes are a great menace to the low-level Observer/Adventurer.

Finally, you should be doing well otherwise. I can't emphasize the need to train Ambusher enough. It's not sporting in the least, but even with Legendary Dodger, Armor User, and Shield User, some lucky goblin archer is fully capable of putting a silver bolt through your brain. The best solution is to rip him limb from limb without his friends even noticing their buddy being eviscerated right next to them.

[Snake_Eyes]

Um, wow. That sounds incredibly boring.

Why don't you just get some armor and companions and go hunt night creatures?

I have done. Bogeymen are no problem. Tomb Mummy Necromancers are still too hard.

I just found that grinding wrestling against a crab works well enough to raise the important attributes and skills.

I just use a piece of chocolate foil and jam the direction key and then walk away from the computer for quarter hour prior to play, it doesnt actually require macros or anything.

YMMV,
Snake_Eyes

[Snake_Eyes]

First point: You need more Ambusher. Your adventurer is only mortal, no matter how buffed he gets. One good hoof or arrow to the brain and he is done, period. The best way you can avoid this scenario for as long as possible is ensuring that you never get attacked, instead cutting the enemy into little chunks without them noticing. I always train to Legendary +5 Ambusher before trying to kill anything even modestly dangerous. At that point you can stand right next to it and slash away and almost everything short of a Megabeast won't notice.

>Right, I train Ambush not invest starting points in it. By the time I get a full suit of armor I would be at legendary.

Second, your start build doesn't really make any sense. Recuperation is useless, because as soon as you Fast Travel anything that will heal will heal. Presto chango, just like that. Disease resistance is also extremely pointless, as the only thing it does right now is prevent you getting vampirism or lycanthropy, and that only happens at insane levels of Disease Resistance, and the attribute is effectively impossible to train. Those two attributes should be your dump stats, not at Superior. For the rest, you don't really need Endurance, and you should always max Strength, Agility, and Willpower. Strength and Agility are vital to any adventurer, as having them start high means you can cap at many times the abilities of a standard creature. Willpower is hard to train, but is crucial if you want to live long. The moment you chip a bone you have a very high chance of giving in to the pain, and the moment you do that you are dead, for all intents and purposes. Thus, you really need Willpower to survive for long without savescumming often.

>Recuperation is very helpful for long fights, you heal very quickly at superior, and there is no way to raise it in game.

>Same with disease resistance there is no way to raise it and it prevents crippling infections. There is no way I am not
going to devote points to these as I am not becoming a vampire or werewolf yet.

>Strength, Agility, Toughness, Endurance, Willpower, Spacial Sense, Kinesthetic Sense are all superhuman levels after one grind crab-wrestling. Unless there is a level beyond it would be a complete waste of points to start them higher than above average. I am new to this but I am not aware of any levels above Superhuman, is there?

>No savecumming here.

As for skills, you really only need Novice Swimmer, as swimming is easy to train in any murky pool. Just don't train in temperate areas close to night. Armor User is a really nifty skill to have, but again you can train it very easily by letting an undead groundhog try to hurt you with any decent armor on. You don't need to start it that high, put the points into Observor and your chosen weapon profession instead. Observer only trains when you get ambushed, and directly increases how far away you can see said ambushes and how often they happen. Thusly it is quite difficult to train without dying, as ambushes are a great menace to the low-level Observer/Adventurer.

>I dont like practicing swimming, it is too dangerous.

>Ive been playing 1,600 Armour Use 900 Observer since that posted build. If I can find an simple way to increase Armor Use early in the game I will increase Observer further.

>I dont need any weapons skill beyond 500, and that is only to start with a weapon other than spear. By the time I start playing I have ~15,000 Fighting, and superhuman attributes, I just find a training weapon and use that as my build.

Finally, you should be doing well otherwise. I can't emphasize the need to train Ambusher enough. It's not sporting in the least, but even with Legendary Dodger, Armor User, and Shield User, some lucky goblin archer is fully capable of putting a silver bolt through your brain. The best solution is to rip him limb from limb without his friends even noticing their buddy being eviscerated right next to them.

Yeah I have Legendary 3,000 at a minimum in all those. What level should they be? I can get Fighter to 15,000 easy but not the other skills.

I train Ambush by using the slow travel, I get to Legendary by the time I get a full suit of armor. Though three iron shirts and a breastplate and everything else I still get killed by random goblins and animals. I have no idea what I am meant to do to get to the power level needed to kill mummies.

Is my problem that I have not played Fortress Mode first? I have not encountered magic items, adamantine, steel, colossus, dragon, demons etc. do I need to play fortress first to unlock these?

Thanks for your feedback and comments, that was what I was after,
Snake_Eyes

[AutomataKittay]

Only thing that fortress mode does is allow bluemetal equipment ( and tapping HFS ). Steel's rare because of lack of dwarven settlement, but I've seen few people report steel equipments existing in lairs or on bandits. And the lack of elven/dwarf/goblin settlement thing can be fixed with a work-around in recent versions. Demon I'm not sure about outside of deities and a couple mentions here and there of being lucky to find the trapped sword underground.

Everything else just take a lot of travelling and not getting killed

[Snake_Eyes]

Only thing that fortress mode does is allow bluemetal equipment ( and tapping HFS ). Steel's rare because of lack of dwarven settlement, but I've seen few people report steel equipments existing in lairs or on bandits. And the lack of elven/dwarf/goblin settlement thing can be fixed with a work-around in recent versions. Demon I'm not sure about outside of deities and a couple mentions here and there of being lucky to find the trapped sword underground.

Everything else just take a lot of travelling and not getting killed

Thank you.

Is there a collection within the forum of constructed fortresses to explore? I cant understand Fortress Mode at all, so I cant really build any steel objects or greater.

Is there a way to generate a world so that an adventurer can reach the underground?

Thanks,
Snake_Eyes

[pisskop]

Caves will always spawn, but if you want a gaurenteed shot at the cavarns (or deeper) than youre better off making a fort and using all seven dwarves to make a tunnel (and whatever else you want there) to wherever you want to go.  Be careful.  Its easy to get lost in the scary cavarns...

Also, stop grinding and start enjoying.

[Snake_Eyes]

Caves will always spawn, but if you want a gaurenteed shot at the cavarns (or deeper) than youre better off making a fort and using all seven dwarves to make a tunnel (and whatever else you want there) to wherever you want to go.  Be careful.  Its easy to get lost in the scary cavarns...

Also, stop grinding and start enjoying.

Unfortunately I have not grasped the fundamentals of Fortress Mode well enough to do any construction, even something as simple as a tunnel. I have been reading the wiki, and some lets play tutorials for Dwarf Mode but still have not succeeded.

Currently I am trying the Advanced World Parameters to try and generate worlds that are more suited to Adventurer Mode, so this is the other thing I am learning currently.

I maybe did not explain myself clear enough. I find a crab and jam down the direction key and walk away from the computer, I come back with Superhuman attributes and Fighter of 15,000 or more. It takes no time or effort for me to raise the skills of the opening character, though I still randomly die to some pretty average threats.

I have generated another world and adventurer in an effort to try and kill a necromancer, just by grinding against one crab I have.

Superhuman Strength, Agility, Toughness, Endurance, Willpower, Spacial Sense, Kinesthetic Sense. Fighting of 20,000. It literally only took a few minutes to locate a crab selectively dismember it, the grinding is just walking away from the computer for a few minutes.

I have some separate questions,

Do steel items become more likely the longer the world history?

Is there a way to increase animal populations? Or creature diversity?

Thanks,
Snake_Eyes

[itisnotlogical]

It takes no time or effort for me to raise the skills of the opening character, though I still randomly die to some pretty average threats.

That's the name of the game. An adventurer with Grand Master in every skill is still vulnerable to bad luck. Spinal injuries and blows to the head mean game-over in 90% of cases, no matter who deals them out. While having a high Dodge skill means that you theoretically avoid these attacks most of the time, they're still very damaging and usually fatal.

[Snake_Eyes]

It takes no time or effort for me to raise the skills of the opening character, though I still randomly die to some pretty average threats.

That's the name of the game. An adventurer with Grand Master in every skill is still vulnerable to bad luck. Spinal injuries and blows to the head mean game-over in 90% of cases, no matter who deals them out. While having a high Dodge skill means that you theoretically avoid these attacks most of the time, they're still very damaging and usually fatal.

I generally try to get to Legendary 3,000 in Armour Use and Dodging, and Legendary 15,000+ in Fighting. It does take much effort but it is an annoying ritual to prepare oneself only to die from mundane things.

I have a feeling it is the lack of quality equipment that might be causing such fatalities. Have not seen a steel anything yet, or masterwork iron even, let alone adamantine.

Since the last post, I made some other adventurers, one with Legendary 22,000 Fighting, everything relevant Superhuman and Legendary, gets killed by a goblin with a hammer. A similar adventurer gets kicked by a random animal through four layers of iron to the chest, suffocates and dies.

And the other thing that ruins my adventurers is infection, so many perfect adventurers have gotten an infected toe or hand and be decommissioned, even with Superior Recuperation and Disease Resistance. I have retired a few Superhuman because of a simple infection.

I have been playing with Advanced World Generation Parameters to try and generate more interesting Adventure Mode play, and am wondering is there a way to increase the chances of better quality equipment? Is it based on population or age of the world? This is mostly because of my difficulty in grasping the basics of Fortress Mode.

Thanks for your feedback and comments,
Snake_Eyes

[pisskop]

be more cautious.  I do not grind (exceptions occasionally leveling sneak or wrestling ir throwing to competent) and have yet to see a llama use my face as a bell.

while equipment quality of coyrse helps this isnt a classic roguelike or final fantasy.  armor doesnt have a specific 'protection value' that reduces physical damage.  rather it has. physical properties that define it interactions with other materials imbued with varying levels of force.  Look at the material raws.

outside of finding the rare steel or dwaven made adamantine (which iirc is newly discovered when you find it in a fortresd) and picking your battles more carefully (most hooved animals are herbivores and therefore not innately aggressive) developing a functional definition of the world around you and honing playing preference are important.  Learn how to play more effectivly and what can work.  Experience is vital, as much to the character in the form of levels as to the player in terms of knowledgebase.

[itisnotlogical]

It takes no time or effort for me to raise the skills of the opening character, though I still randomly die to some pretty average threats.

That's the name of the game. An adventurer with Grand Master in every skill is still vulnerable to bad luck. Spinal injuries and blows to the head mean game-over in 90% of cases, no matter who deals them out. While having a high Dodge skill means that you theoretically avoid these attacks most of the time, they're still very damaging and usually fatal.

I generally try to get to Legendary 3,000 in Armour Use and Dodging, and Legendary 15,000+ in Fighting. It does take much effort but it is an annoying ritual to prepare oneself only to die from mundane things.

I have a feeling it is the lack of quality equipment that might be causing such fatalities. Have not seen a steel anything yet, or masterwork iron even, let alone adamantine.

Since the last post, I made some other adventurers, one with Legendary 22,000 Fighting, everything relevant Superhuman and Legendary, gets killed by a goblin with a hammer. A similar adventurer gets kicked by a random animal through four layers of iron to the chest, suffocates and dies.

And the other thing that ruins my adventurers is infection, so many perfect adventurers have gotten an infected toe or hand and be decommissioned, even with Superior Recuperation and Disease Resistance. I have retired a few Superhuman because of a simple infection.

It can't be helped. It keeps the game challenging at high levels. You aren't dying because your skills aren't high enough, you're dying because of random chance- the equivelant of a bad dice roll in a tabletop RPG. You'd probably have more fun if you simply didn't grind at the beginning and did some quests instead.

If you just want to stomp all over the world being invincible and stuff, you can mod bronze collosi or dragons to be playable in Adventure mode. I haven't done it, but it can't be very difficult since I modded animal men to be playable.

[Snake_Eyes]

It can't be helped. It keeps the game challenging at high levels. You aren't dying because your skills aren't high enough, you're dying because of random chance- the equivelant of a bad dice roll in a tabletop RPG. You'd probably have more fun if you simply didn't grind at the beginning and did some quests instead.

If you just want to stomp all over the world being invincible and stuff, you can mod bronze collosi or dragons to be playable in Adventure mode. I haven't done it, but it can't be very difficult since I modded animal men to be playable.

I am actually not using that intensive of a grinding strategy, I just jam the direction key and walk away from the computer for a while and come back with Superhuman and Legendary levels, it is more effort trying to kill my quest than to prepare by grinding. Sorry if I have not explained that well enough, but I am basically saying I start off with a Superhuman Legendary adventurer.

So what do I do between the time of getting a suit of iron armor (I can do easy) and hunting necromancers (cant do yet)?

I can hunt some of the megabeasts, and generally all of the bandits and other quests. But I am stuck with iron equipment, and this seems to be a major weakness of all the characters as far as I can tell. The tombs are impossible to overcome currently.

Do I need to become a vampire or werewolf in order to become a necromancer?

I really am looking for suggestions/ strategies of what to do in adventurer mode, as I have not played Fortress Mode yet.

Thanks for your help,
Snake_Eyes

[Trif]

Iron is pretty much the best you can get. You could try going for bronze, but I don't think that the improvement is noticeable in adventurer mode. No type of armor will make you perfectly invincible, the game has to end at some point.

You don't have to be a vampire or werebeast to fight the necromancers, but it helps significantly.

Tombs are really hard, I only go there if I really have to. I like exploring the dungeons or catacombs - they've got some interesting structures and varied enemies.
Otherwise, there isn't much to do except killing stuff. You have to set your goals yourself - hunting down the jerks that killed your last adventurer is always fun.